Roguey vs the Grognards Thread

[Roguey]

Those crazy mods exist for all those games though????

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Those crazy mods exist for all those games though????

Yes but grafeex.

 

[Infinitron]

Roguey I'm pretty sure it was mostly just a "right place in the right time" thing.

Also, I think people found the whole snowy northern atmosphere captivating. Kinda like how more people than you'd expect are inordinately fond of Icewind Dale?

 

[Seaking4]

Well Bethesda's popularity continued to grow (Fallout 3 brought a whole new audience of people that wouldn't have played an Elder Scrolls game) so naturally they sold more copies and the initial reaction to Skyrim was overwhelmingly positive. I suppose you could also say that Skyrim had an extensive modding scene which helped extend the life of the game but I'm quite sure Oblivion had that as well.

Anyways, that would be my guess but I can't say I've looked into this at all.

 

[Roguey]

Apparently all you need to do to sell 20 mil is a big open world, enough but not too much character customization, and a radiant quest system to provide technically-unlimited gameplay.

Should be interesting to see how DAI does by comparison. Witcher 3 too I guess, but it's kinda hampered by forcing you to play as Geralt.

 

[Delterius]

Doesn't make it a good game, let alone an RPG. I have a lot of hours in that game, it's a time waster, like an mmo. It's really easy to jump into, but doesn't leave a lasting impression.(Isn't very replayable, and doesn't have a definite end) Also he's right in the Oblivion comparison, but you could also take that as an insult for what is a truly awful game.

There has to be something more here to explain why it sold so many more millions over Oblivion, Fallout 3, and New Vegas, and I'm going to try to find it.

Given most people dint even play games these days I would think marketing.

 

[CyberP]

There has to be something more here to explain why it sold so many more millions over Oblivion, Fallout 3, and New Vegas, and I'm going to try to find it.

It's really quite simple:

Primary: Marketing. They invested in this significantly.
Secondary: a "deep" game wrapped up in "accessible" design that intentionally appeals to a wide variety of demographics.

 

[Roguey]

It's really quite simple:

Primary: Marketing. They invested in this significantly.
Secondary: a "deep" game wrapped up in "accessible" design that intentionally appeals to a wide variety of demographics.

Given most people dint even play games these days I would think marketing.

All those games were marketed by the same company (and all but one made by as well).

And people definitely played/play Skyrim. This thing was $60 for over a year. It didn't go down in price because people kept buying new copies in sufficient amounts because nobody sold it to Gamestop because they were too busy playing it or holding on to it to play it later. http://steamcharts.com/ will show you that Skyrim is the 4th most played game at this moment and over 20 million hours have been played by all those people since release, which is pretty damn impressive for a single player game. Anything that exceeds or comes close to that is multiplayer.

 

[Infinitron]

It's really quite simple:

Primary: Marketing. They invested in this significantly.
Secondary: a "deep" game wrapped up in "accessible" design that intentionally appeals to a wide variety of demographics.

Given most people dint even play games these days I would think marketing.

All those games were marketed by the same company (and all but one made by as well).

And people definitely played/play Skyrim. This thing was $60 for over a year. It didn't go down in price because people kept buying new copies in sufficient amounts because nobody sold it to Gamestop because they were too busy playing it or holding on to it to play it later. http://steamcharts.com/ will show you that Skyrim is the 4th most played game at this moment and over 20 million hours have been played by all those people since release, which is pretty damn impressive for a single player game. Anything that exceeds or comes close to that is multiplayer.

While other developers derped around with popamole trend-chasing, Bethesda simply built their reputation for open world "see that mountain, you can climb it" RPGs, year after year, title after title. When you do that, then after a while, the message gets out that your games are THE way to get a particular sort of experience, and voila, you now own a niche.

Same thing happened with Call of Duty. It wasn't a 30 million units seller at first either.

(Bioware owns a niche too, but it's a niche that isn't as large)

 

[CyberP]

All those games were marketed by the same company (and all but one made by as well).
.

And? Each game is case by case, with growth came the opportunity to invest more into the next project.

"Skyrim Marketing and Development budget = 85 million dallars"

I speculate that New Vegas' budget was approximately 20 mil.

It's no longer about the passion to make good games, it's all about business. It's saddening that quality is rare these days but the stakes are very high when so much money is invested that I cannot blame studios for playing it safe.
Won't stop me calling them fucking small dick sell-outs though.

That is why it is up to insane modders and smaller dev teams who keep the spirit alive, though even amongst these groups there are few that actually do just that.

 

[Ninjerk]

Obsidian wants a piece of that popamole pie

 

[Roguey]

I speculate that New Vegas' budget was approximately 20 mil.

It was likely higher than that.

http://gamestar.ru/english/1925.html

from at least one of our most recent RPGs, the marketing outstripped the cost of developing the project several times over.

Granted, Urquhart did say it costs less to make a sandbox slam dunk than you'd think, but it was still probably more than 10 million.

 

[CyberP]

While other developers derped around with popamole trend-chasing, Bethesda simply built their reputation for open world "see that mountain, you can climb it" RPGs, year after year, title after title. When you do that, then after a while, the message gets out that your games are THE way to get a particular sort of experience, and voila, you now own a niche.

Same thing happened with Call of Duty. It wasn't a 30 million units seller at first either.

(Bioware owns a niche too, but it's a niche that isn't as large)

Indeed, but they first built that reputation on passion-driven design that made little compromise (Morrowind et al). Since then instead of upping the overall quality they slowly popamolified the franchise each iteration.
Morrowind incline x3 would have been glorious.

 

[CyberP]

Anyway, New Vegas was incline. I'm thankful for that. One of few games of that shitty generation of games I have love for.

 

[RandomAccount]

Marketing is... everything:

1 - The most famous of them all, so much so that such gaffes are now known as "doing a Ratner".

Gerald Ratner wiped £500 million from the value of Ratners jewellers with one speech in 1991.

He said: "We also do cut-glass sherry decanters complete with six glasses on a silver-plated tray that your butler can serve you drinks on, all for £4.95. People say, 'How can you sell this for such a low price?' I say, because it's total crap."

He added that his stores' earrings were "cheaper than an M&S prawn sandwich but probably wouldn't last as long".

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3 - Asked in an interview in 2001 to clarify the target market for the Topman clothing chain, the firm's brand director, David Shepherd, replied: "Hooligans or whatever."

He went on: "Very few of our customers have to wear suits for work. They'll be for his first interview or first court case."

The company later suggested that the word "hooligan" would not be seen as an insult among its customers.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1573380/Doing-a-Ratner-and-other-famous-gaffes.html

 

[Infinitron]

RandomAccount Didn't you say you weren't interested in becoming a regular

 

[RandomAccount]

Uh-oh, it's spotted me...

Laters guys... another night one day... maybe...

 

[Roguey]

Some people sure are insistent on insulting their patrons.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Some people sure are insistent on insulting their patrons.

Sounds like some guy I know, can't remember his name but I remember Infinity Enginerators or something being mentioned.

 

[Grunker]

this thread gave me cancer

 

[Duraframe300]

I speculate that New Vegas' budget was approximately 20 mil.

It was likely higher than that.

http://gamestar.ru/english/1925.html

from at least one of our most recent RPGs, the marketing outstripped the cost of developing the project several times over.

Granted, Urquhart did say it costs less to make a sandbox slam dunk than you'd think, but it was still probably more than 10 million.

I think Chris was refering to Dungeon Siege III there actually.

 

[Delterius]

And people definitely played/play Skyrim. This thing was $60 for over a year. It didn't go down in price because people kept buying new copies in sufficient amounts because nobody sold it to Gamestop because they were too busy playing it or holding on to it to play it later. http://steamcharts.com/ will show you that Skyrim is the 4th most played game at this moment and over 20 million hours have been played by all those people since release, which is pretty damn impressive for a single player game. Anything that exceeds or comes close to that is multiplayer.

Those numbers are quite interesting, thanks.

Amazingly, considerably smaller playerbases aren't that far behind Skyrim when it comes to total playtime. Games with 10 times less concurrent players have something like half the total amount of playtime. And that's considering some of those games should have many times less potential players that Skyrim supposedly should have.

Overall, I still think both our guesses can be right. A heavy marketing campaign can make the most of a game which combines Skyrim's apparently huge open world with little characterization, creating the illusion of a sprawling ocean that only reveals itself to be as deep as a pond once you are a few dozens of hours in -- a game quickly goes viral when your first impression of it is glowing and you start recommend it to everyone you know.

 

[Delterius]

this thread gave me cancer

No dear.

We are all part of the cancer. Embrace the truthz.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

Some Mod clear the Skyrim shit from this Grognard stuff.
Jaesun Please?

 

[Clockwork Knight]

RandomAccount Didn't you say you weren't interested in becoming a regular

Isn't he a Lady Error alt?