Shadowrun Shadowrun Returns Pre-Release Thread

[crawlkill]

People play chess for the same reason - it's not about winning and being the best, it's about enjoying the challenge of a good game.

But the almost inevitable fate of the non-action RPG is to have a few awesome setups for your character or party that blow the game out of the water. That's one of the reasons we can admire Dark Souls (note: this poster does not like Dark Souls, but that doesn't mean there's nothing valid about it)--even with a 'great build,' the trundling refrigerator man that is your character is still subject to hideous five-story falls at the hands of snakemen beating on his shield because of your fat, fumbling fingers (seriously they're chubby you should talk to a doctor). Pure numbers RPGs don't have that, and the challenge in them generally comes of bad luck or of game systems that aren't sufficiently explicated to the player.

 

[evdk]

You liked Expeditions: Conquistador which was not very challenging. Though it had real roleplaying, which it sounds like SRR will not.

Edit For Vault Dweller of course

Well, Conquistador combat had options and resource management and it wasn't piss easy either. Some of the battles were pretty challenging.

 

[Infinitron]

Pure numbers RPGs don't have that, and the challenge in them generally comes of bad luck or of game systems that aren't sufficiently explicated to the player.

Oh god not this BS again

Look - have you played Vault Dweller's game?

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Pure numbers RPGs don't have that, and the challenge in them generally comes of bad luck or of game systems that aren't sufficiently explicated to the player.

Oh god not this BS again

Look - have you played Vault Dweller's game?

You might want to rename that thread of long ago. Replace Fallout with AoD.

 

[DalekFlay]

With this thread going at roughly 20 messages every 10 minutes I can only imagine how it will be once the actual fucking game is playable.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Available: 25 July 2013

This game will unlock in approximately 2 hours

 

[Aeschylus]

With this thread going at roughly 20 messages every 10 minutes I can only imagine how it will be once the actual fucking game is playable.

Far quieter because people will actually be playing the game?

 

[aris]

Do you ever get the impression that a lot of RPG players get way too much of their sense of self-worth out of their ability to complete video games? The obsession with games being sooper haaard is confusing to me, not least because it's such a completely subjective metric (and then that same need to be Good At Vidya Games creatues a situation in which they need to -claim- they had an easy time of it even if they didn't).

On the RPGcodex? Absolutely.

 

[Infinitron]

Pure numbers RPGs don't have that, and the challenge in them generally comes of bad luck or of game systems that aren't sufficiently explicated to the player.

Oh god not this BS again

Look - have you played Vault Dweller's game?

You might want to rename that thread of long ago. Replace Fallout with AoD.

Nah. While I have my share of criticisms of AoD, I do think it's fundamentally a less flawed game than Fallout, because it has combat that is hard even if you build your character correctly.

 

[crawlkill]

Look - have you played Vault Dweller's game?

Izzat Conquistador? I'll go pick it up after I've wrung out Shadowrun, maybe, it sounded cool from the review.

 

[Infinitron]

Look - have you played Vault Dweller's game?

Izzat Conquistador? I'll go pick it up after I've wrung out Shadowrun, maybe, it sounded cool from the review.

No, Age of Decadence:
http://www.irontowerstudio.com/
http://www.irontowerstudio.com/forum/index.php/topic,2488.0.html

(how do you not know this)

 

[buzz]

(how do you not know this)

not all Vaporware are popular

 

[Clockwork Knight]

With this thread going at roughly 20 messages every 10 minutes I can only imagine how it will be once the actual fucking game is playable.

Far quieter because people will actually be playing the game?

Far noisier because two people who will be playing the game, one of them quitting halfway during the tutorial to post First Impressions™ ("it's shit"), the other promising a review two weeks from now. The others will be taking sides randomly. On the left corner, the True Believers who are excited as bunnies; on the right corner, The Jaded Fucks, who are pessimistic as fuck (" I prefer the term realistic ").

 

[ERYFKRAD]

(how do you not know this)

He got turned off by the silly men in skirts?

 

[Wizfall]

You are wrong because he has massive enjoyment for the game while he says combats are only "good for what it is" (to summarize).

Massive enjoyment is a very subjective concept that tells you little. If I'm told that a game is challenging and tactical, I know I will enjoy it. If I'm told that the game is mostly about combat but combat is easy, the game is linear, the dialogues are Biowaresque but well written, there are balance issues, but the story and music are good and the game is super enjoyable, I'm not sure if I'd find it equally enjoyable.

So instead you rather think RD has shit questionable taste, i can understand that
Edit to myself : never do a review for the Codex or be very vague about your opinion, otherwise you are going to be shot in the crossfire.

 

[Zewp]

I wonder how Steam is going to botch the launch this time. Every time a game is popular, they end up botching the launch somehow.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

I wonder how Steam is going to botch the launch this time. Every time a game is popular, they end up botching the launch somehow.

Pretty sure the server load will botch it all by itself.

 

[mindx2]

I wonder how Steam is going to botch the launch this time. Every time a game is popular, they end up botching the launch somehow.

DON'T SAY THAT!!!!!!!

 

[crawlkill]

(how do you not know this)

I don't keep track of personalities around here much. I played the first AoD demo that let you wander around the city, yeah. I wasn't as offended as some, but I didn't see what the point of my dying in the opening scene was, either. Is having to reload before the game starts the challenge you're looking for? I never signed up for the RNG Olympics.

He got turned off by the silly men in skirts?

I'm pro-skirtmen, but they were a little bulky for my tastes

 

[Vault Dweller]

So instead you rather think RD has shit questionable taste, i can understand that

There are many very subjective things that can color one's impressions. It's much easier to explain mechanics and what works and what doesn't, then explain the effect the setting, atmosphere, writing, and music had on you.

 

[Wizfall]

So instead you rather think RD has shit questionable taste, i can understand that

There are many very subjective things that can color one's impressions. It's much easier to explain mechanics and what works and what doesn't, then explain the effect the setting, atmosphere, writing, and music had on you.

Nice dodging skill
RD is safe...for now.

 

[Stabwound]

Do you ever get the impression that a lot of RPG players get way too much of their sense of self-worth out of their ability to complete video games? The obsession with games being sooper haaard is confusing to me, not least because it's such a completely subjective metric (and then that same need to be Good At Vidya Games creatues a situation in which they need to -claim- they had an easy time of it even if they didn't).

I think the last time I worried about whether I was "good" at a game or not as any kind of personal quality I saw as meaningful was when my age was in the single digits. Many things are interesting without being particularly challenging (see every other medium ever for examples of cool things that aren't difficult). Few RPGs are genuinely hard, because ultimately they're just ramming numbers up against one another, and numbers are easy to outsmart. What are you expecting, exactly? A game where the numbers are routinely smarter than you are? Smarter than the community? It isn't gonna happen. The unfortunate fact is that the only way to make a game actually "difficult" in such a way that moderately sentient play and a basic understanding of the mechanics won't break it is to include action elements, and you know how that shit gets received around here.

The Codex would be a lot happier if it would decouple from this idea that hard=good (or even hard=possible). A game (with more than one "challenge mechanic," in Sawyer's words) is a round, whole experience.

No, this is true, but it's infinitely more true for competitive MMO games. There are some people that base their entire self-worth on their status in their game of choice, and the funny part in that is that it's almost always just a case of wasting more of your spare time staring at a computer screen than having any kind of tangible ability.

It's not like cRPGs are even a hard genre of game. There isn't even very much player skill involved in most games; it's just a matter of butting your head against the wall until you figure out what works. If there's any way I'd be impressed by someone being good at a video game, it would be something like the insane Japanese Tetris players, but even that would be stupid to base your self-worth on.

 

[Infinitron]

Is having to reload before the game starts the challenge you're looking for?

I'm afraid you'll never find the mythical non-action RPG that's truly difficult if you immediately discount it for being too difficult when you play it

 

[Vault Dweller]

(how do you not know this)

I don't keep track of personalities around here much. I played the first AoD demo that let you wander around the city, yeah. I wasn't as offended as some, but I didn't see what the point of my dying in the opening scene was, either. Is having to reload before the game starts the challenge you're looking for?

The purpose of the challenging first fight was to let you test your character right away rather than letting you discover 20 min later that you spread your points too thin.

 

[buzz]

It's all about the ride, huh?