KickStarter Underworld Ascendant Pre-Release Thread

[Wirdschowerdn]

What on earth have they been doing?

Adding useless stuff like parkour, wall-running, rope swinging and physics (and not added very well I must say).

Seriously the parkour/wall-running shown in the early days sealed the deal (for me) the game will be shit.

Too much wasted effort on bullshit, and not enough on the actual game play.

Zep--

I WANT TO BE DISHONORED

 

[ciox]

tfw kickstarter shitshow going down

 

[BEvers]

Some positive feedback giving cause for hope:

I've been playtesting this since round 1, and at the risk of oversharing, the progress made from build to build has been truly staggering. Yes, I'm disappointed that NPC interactions will be limited. I hate Typhon's VO. But I'm still excited to see how the final game shapes up. Remember, the original Thief's ENTIRE AI CODE was re-written by one dude in 12 days, right before the game shipped. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect something similar here, given the team.

Here's my experience as a non-hardcore fan, without breaking NDA for later content:

- Portals don't bother me. Who cares? I want the content. "Interconnected world" isn't something I need in an immersive sim. Thief didn't have it, Deus Ex didn't have it, SS2 didn't have it, Dishonored didn't have it, and they were all the better for it. Every time they tried to create one (ahem, Thief 3), it was to the detriment of overall quality. I'd rather discrete, fully-fleshed levels than another vanilla open world.

- Sound design is stellar. I don't know about the beta, but there's plenty of ambient soundscapes & music in the builds I've played, and it's all fabulous.

- Echoing what the devs have already said, the deeper dungeons are absolutely enormous. I've gotten lost in them multiple times. They are bigger than many of the original Thief's levels, and they feel fantastic to traverse. People whining about 'parkour' are missing the point.

- Combining some of the advanced skills and spells can result in incredibly fun, exciting gameplay styles. For those playing the beta, next time through, try to rack up enough memora to get both 'Pounce' and 'Leap of Legend.' I promise you won't be disappointed.

- VO and NPCs are for sure disappointing. Even without having played the originals, it's never felt right to me that we spend so much time hearing about the factions without meeting them. Communicating through the mediators just feels strange, and makes it hard to care about the quests. Definitely my #1 criticism.

- The AI is in rough shape. I find stealth difficult to gauge, and enemies tend not respond in ways I expect. But again, given the changes from build to build, and the team's history of making pressure-prompted Hail Mary's, I'm optimistic.

- Based on the playtesting changes and responses from devs here, I'm confident that the final product will be something fun, unique, and challenging. It may not be what UU fans expected, but I'd be shocked if it were less than engaging. But also: I never play games at launch anymore. I plan to wait at least a month before diving into UA, because I assume that many hiccups will be smoothed over in post-release patches. That's less a criticism of OSE, and more of the overall industry, and the uneasy relationship between publishers kickstarted budgets.

So those are my thoughts. I've had a lot of fun playtesting this and seeing it evolve. And I've been really frustrated at times, too. I don't have nearly as many bugaboos as the hardcore fans (many of whom are behaving like the devs are personally out to get them by not taking every piece of feedback and implementing it to their precise specifications). But I'm optimistic about the final product.

If you're not, that's your loss, I guess. It's a risk we all take when backing a beloved project, and imagining a result that will give us the same feeling we had when we were growing up. Personally, I let that kind of dreaming go years ago. It's like trying to live in a pensieve - it's understandably tempting, but unhealthy and unhelpful. I'm taking this game at face value, and so far, I've been having a lot of fun.

And developer response:

Brodo, thank you for your brief review. It's been great to have you on as a playtester, and incredibly valuable to have your and other backers' feedback.

We know VO and AI in particular are in the roughest shape, and the story is still wrangling itself together in the final days. There's framework available, and we have more plans to improve it, so it's still helpful for us to hear which direction we should be pushing in. I remember we put in a lot of new Typhon VO just to showcase and test out how he should feel, and one of the first things this round of playtesters mentioned was that they liked his voice, but it was too much! And that's fine. Better for us to spread out his dialogue than to discover you didn't even know he existed.

We're working on it. And that's always been the case; I know a number of you have mentioned that the sense of danger so critical to the dungeon-crawling experience hasn't been felt in UA yet. The first few levels (especially if you've only played for less than an hour), are generally friendlier than later areas, and the latest levels are far less linear.

 

[Zep Zepo]

A plant, a shill. It's pretty obvious.

Zep--

 

[Mud']

I think this may actually be the worst Kickstarter in terms of project management and technical incompetence. We‘ve seen some bad shit over the years, but this feels like a high-school project. I still can’t wrap my head around what they were thinking.

Its kinda hard to believe that Underworld can beat SOTA at project management and technical incompetence, but since they both share the same universe, maybe that is the intended effect.

 

[BEvers]

A veiled apology?



It's curious that none of the higher ups have made any comments about this. Torment's last-minute revelations were accompanied by a personal letter from Colin McComb; here it's just the community manager saying "Looking at the Kickstarter pitch now, it was way out of scope", "A dialogue system might have felt stale," etc. etc. Maybe it's because no news outlets have picked up on it / people don't really seem to care anymore?

 

[Zakhad]

I think they haven't commented because they're hoping for a Hail Mary that will prevent them needing to apologise quite so much.

Like a lot of games, this one seems to have been ruined by kickstarter. Over-promising: never do it.

Also a problem: Unity. Why do people keep making big 3d games in unity, it seems really unsuited for that genre?

 

[BEvers]

Developer quotes from the Discord explaining what's possible with the savegame system:

The game auto-saves every time you return to Marcaul.

Returning to marcaul in the middle of the quest assumes that you've forfeit the quest so the day passes, and typhon advances.

We did some updates to the save system this weekend so that you can exit the game, but come back start at the beginning of the level you were questing in as opposed to starting back in Marcaul

pending testing

We were originally tossing around an idea that you could activate portals within the level, but it's tricky because saving every object's exact state and location would be REALLY hard to document without making the save file huge

We're currently working on a way so that if you save your progress while within a level, it preserves the quest you chose and any items you selected

tl;dr The maps reset whenever you load a savegame or if you leave the map. This is because they can't store the map information in a save file without making it "huge".

 

[Nyast]

I don't understand what's the problem of making the save file "huge" ? Of course that depends what they mean by huge, but it's certainly not going to be hundreds of MBs, so who cares ? It's not like they have milliions of objects in their levels either. In fact, from playing I would say it's pretty standard compared to other games.

 

[Zep Zepo]

Save System. Bad planning by the designers and/or cheap kid programmer got to far ahead of himself showing us WOW! PHYSICS! and not thinking about a proper save system.

This has MUH FIRST GAME written all over it.

Zep--

 

[Zep Zepo]

I laugh every time someone uses "Industry Veterans" referring to these ass clowns.

"Senile Old Men" would be more appropriate.

Zep--

 

[Eggs is eggs]

I thought Warren Spector and a lot of devs from UU, System Shock, Thief, etc. were working on it? Or is it like Shroud of the Avatar where they have Richard Garriott and Starr Long on top and everyone else is a bunch of recent technical school graduates without any experience? Though in SotA's case the state of the game is 100% the fault of upper management and not the lower staff.

 

[V_K]

I wonder if there's something in Unity codebase that makes programming saves a pain in the ass. SRR originally also shipped only with saves at the start of level - and it didn't have any physics to take care of.

 

[Zep Zepo]

I wonder if there's something in Unity codebase that makes programming saves a pain in the ass.

Yes, there is. It's the modular system you have to use. You have to plan ahead for it, I mean WAY AHEAD, esp. with an open-ish world. Saves, one month out, seem like an afterthought to them.

You'd think, after testing and playing their own game...somebody (An "Industry Veteran") would have said "Hey...why are we having to restart fresh every time programmer kid? Where's the save system?"

Zep--

 

[Max Heap]

I wonder if there's something in Unity codebase that makes programming saves a pain in the ass. SRR originally also shipped only with saves at the start of level - and it didn't have any physics to take care of.

It's been a while but if I remember correctly Unity provides a separate object structure that is filled with custom variables and then saved via a relatively simple command. I think there is a restriction in file size to it, but that can be circumvented by using some alternative approach.
Looking at the documentation right now that might have changed though.

Either way, they are working with C#. Even if the engine was not capable of doing what they want it to do, they could write their own save system and save/load with standard I/O libraries.

 

[Zep Zepo]

Programmer kid looks like your typical open source faggot, he's probably using default Unity script..which is Java-like. I doubt he knows C#.

Zep--

 

[BEvers]

Inside information from a closed beta tester:

New Build Confirms Underworld DNA

I've popped across from testing and feel I can open up about Underworld Ascendant as the new 'backer build' coincides with our one of our external test builds. I am more than happy and a little relieved to confirm that the new build now seriously hints at the 'Underworld' dna that lies therein. I think the new iteration should confirm in our minds that the team is on the right track and we now need to give them the next few weeks to polish what I believe will be a great game and a true Underworld title deserving of the name and a member of the family.

I know many of you have concerns that the game fails to reflect the 'Abyss' of the earlier games; however, I've had a chance to test the new build and many aspects of the game now echo the architecture, atmosphere and even bestiary from the previous games. The maps are devilish with many traps awaiting the unwitting player, the UI well-designed and melee combat fulfilling. I haven't yet had much chance to explore the Rune system but will report back here when I have.

I know that some are concerned development fails to reflect the earlier games, I myself was one such person; however, as we get nearer release and each new build appears you can see a new Underworld appear before your eyes. One amazing moment for me was hearing the familiar notes of George Sanger's music but composed in an entirely original way. Seriously, the hairs rose on the back of my neck! Especially so, seeing it come from an entirely new game...The maps are detailed, set in an environment specific to the Underworld series but most of all, it is the physics game engine that stands out. Old Underworld hands will know, what made Ultima Underworld so unique was how the Blue Sky took 3D modelling more reminiscent of flight simulators and applied the technique to creating a 3D rpg. Otherside Entertainment led by Paul Narath has done the same thing, creating a first-class 3D physics engine that will stand the test of time.

I promise to report back here when I can and update backers and fans as to the latest state of development passing on impressions as we get near release (taking into consideration obviously my NDA).

 

[Trans-Financial-Man]

Inside information from a closed beta tester:

New Build Confirms Underworld DNA

I've popped across from testing and feel I can open up about Underworld Ascendant as the new 'backer build' coincides with our one of our external test builds. I am more than happy and a little relieved to confirm that the new build now seriously hints at the 'Underworld' dna that lies therein. I think the new iteration should confirm in our minds that the team is on the right track and we now need to give them the next few weeks to polish what I believe will be a great game and a true Underworld title deserving of the name and a member of the family.

I know many of you have concerns that the game fails to reflect the 'Abyss' of the earlier games; however, I've had a chance to test the new build and many aspects of the game now echo the architecture, atmosphere and even bestiary from the previous games. The maps are devilish with many traps awaiting the unwitting player, the UI well-designed and melee combat fulfilling. I haven't yet had much chance to explore the Rune system but will report back here when I have.

I know that some are concerned development fails to reflect the earlier games, I myself was one such person; however, as we get nearer release and each new build appears you can see a new Underworld appear before your eyes. One amazing moment for me was hearing the familiar notes of George Sanger's music but composed in an entirely original way. Seriously, the hairs rose on the back of my neck! Especially so, seeing it come from an entirely new game...The maps are detailed, set in an environment specific to the Underworld series but most of all, it is the physics game engine that stands out. Old Underworld hands will know, what made Ultima Underworld so unique was how the Blue Sky took 3D modelling more reminiscent of flight simulators and applied the technique to creating a 3D rpg. Otherside Entertainment led by Paul Narath has done the same thing, creating a first-class 3D physics engine that will stand the test of time.

I promise to report back here when I can and update backers and fans as to the latest state of development passing on impressions as we get near release (taking into consideration obviously my NDA).

Everything is fine. Move along. Consume. Obey.

 

[Max Heap]

Inside information from a closed beta tester:

[...]

I believed in Cleve and even I have high doubts reading all that.

 

[Curratum]

Inside information more like "Please, don't review-bomb us on launch day".

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.othersideentertainment.com/forum/index.php?topic=6223.0

Morning everyone!

I'm writing to you all from Argentina today, and I'll be back in the office on the 30th. Thankfully, I still have some cool updates for you all, even if I'm not in the office

First: We'll be holding a Reddit AMA on r/gaming Oct 25 at 1pm ET! We'll be talking about Underworld Ascendant, Deus Ex, Thief, Ultima Underworld, and LGS games... Hope to see a couple of you there!

And of course, if you don't have a Reddit account or can't participate live, we can collect some of your questions tomorrow via Google Form.

Second: We've been parsing through all the Backer Beta feedback we've received and tackling some of the problems that we've been wrestling with for awhile. (I'm looking at you, object highlighting and too much VO...) The external playtesters received a new build on the 20th, so if you're one of those, make sure that your branch was updated!

Third: We've been receiving reports of the Backer Beta failing to load to the Main Menu over the weekend. We're looking into this. We suspect this has to do with save files. Please let us know if you are experiencing this issue AND have existing save files on your machine (or none!) let us know.

Fourth: We've been working hard on preparing the physical KS goods, so please remember to update us at support@otherside-e.com if your BackerKit information is not correct.

As for how work in the Abyss is progressing, we've been upgrading UI and the look and feel of the game between weeks. Mobility should feel more natural, mantling is getting another pass, and of course cleaning over the levels to make sure there's no empty holes or missing tiles. We're finally updating some of the flame vents, which I'm pretty excited about. And of course, some optimization along the way whenever we can.

Overall, really excited to see some long-awaited updates going in. Here's some screenshots to give you an idea of some of the aspects we're improving upon, which includes the flame vents, a Kickstarter figurine prototype which just came in of Aelita, the physical merch goodies we have saved up from an in-office visit, and examples of skill trees we gave save files to for the latest external playtest. IMAGES HERE.

 

[Curratum]

this_joke_isnt_funny_anymore.mp4

 

[BlackGoat]

Less than a month from release and they're showing off cracks in the ground like i'ts gonna jazz people up? Christ

 

[Ivan]

this_joke_isnt_funny_anymore.mp4

 

[ciox]

Less than a month from release and they're showing off cracks in the ground like i'ts gonna jazz people up? Christ

It's kind of neat if they are procedurally generated which I'm pretty sure they are, it's just that there's bigger fish to fry.