Wizardry .

[KeighnMcDeath]

Wanna see why I can't vote Wizardry 8

Just classic... :(

So uh... where the fuck is disc 2 and why did it come with 2 of disc 1? And yes, those are two identical disc 1s and not just labelled wrong). This pissed me off to no end. I couldn't return it either.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

The poll should have collected more information, so that we could know how many of the people voting for Wizardry 8 never played an earlier game in the series.

 

[Darth Canoli]

Making everything 3d and giving monsters real positioning does away with some of the streamlining inherent in the blobber formula, but the way it was implemented in W8 also means that trash battles often end up taking 45 minutes, most of which is the AI's turn.

There is some long battles, mostly early in Arnika Road because your equipment sucks and you don't have good spells either.
But they're not trash combat, because it can kill you, that's the opposite of trash combat.

Also, there's 3 fixes for Wizardry 8 to speed up enemy animations and combat speed, two of them are still on snafaru's wizardry website.

Wanna see why I can't vote Wizardry 8

Just classic... :(

So uh... where the fuck is disc 2 and why did it come with 2 of disc 1? And yes, those are two identical disc 1s and not just labelled wrong). This pissed me off to no end. I couldn't return it either.

I do have the box version and played with it for several years, no CD shenanigans.
Still, why would you care, if you have the original box, downloading a "pirate" version is legal in most countries (probably all of them)?

The poll should have collected more information, so that we could know how many of the people voting for Wizardry 8 never played an earlier game in the series.

I've played Wiz 6 & 7 and even Grimoire.

 

[Cleveland Mark Blakemore]

Wanna see why I can't vote Wizardry 8

Just classic... :(

So uh... where the fuck is disc 2 and why did it come with 2 of disc 1? And yes, those are two identical disc 1s and not just labelled wrong). This pissed me off to no end. I couldn't return it either.

Must have been packaged by the loser crew at Sir-Tech. These guys would screw up a wet dream. I used to catch all kinds of mistakes like this when I worked with them. No attention to detail, writers have grammar that requires hiring another writer to correct it and make it sound half decent. Remember, Brenda spent most of her time smoking in school and when she got out mainly cruised for sex using her freebie BBS to explore deviance and perversion. Not a lot of time left for these degenerates to hone any of their basic skills in anything else.

This is the same woman who objected to scantily dressed good looking women at E3. Totally driven out of concern for them, you understand - that's why she put them out of work and starved their children. These dumbasses literally could not count to three.

 

[ZodoZ]

If there is a wizardry 8 spiritual successor. I want a longer game maybe a triple scenario game where you alternate controlling 3 parties working for various goals with one major plot moving forward as they accomplish their goals. Mix of premade npcs and your pcs.

Ascension
Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan
https://www.decklinsdemise.com/index.htm

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Making everything 3d and giving monsters real positioning does away with some of the streamlining inherent in the blobber formula, but the way it was implemented in W8 also means that trash battles often end up taking 45 minutes, most of which is the AI's turn.

I find the classic blobber gameplay uninteresting because it is so streamlined, but Wizardry 8 adds a lot of tedium, so maybe it's not really the most enjoyable game in the series, even though it has way better mechanics in theory.

People keep repeating that, but never mention that one of the most significant ways in which Wiz8 mixes up the classical blobber approach is that the encounters don't constantly spawn out of thin air on top of yo ass, but are actually spawned and present on the maps and the game gives you multiple ways of avoiding them, the simplest of which is having a brain capable of eye-hand coordination and a keyboard with functional shift key. And I know it's just fighting against windmills at this point, but to have an encounter take 45 minutes you'd probably need to reach some late game area, like rapax carpet of doom, and be really bad at the game and try to chip away at them with low-end ammo and lvl 2 fireball or something. Yeah, the combat takes long, but that what the game's about. Unlock the teleporter hubs and spells and you're good.

Anyway, comparing games from the same series is only natural, but wiz 6-7 versus 8 is just a completely different ball game. All of them are classics worth playing. Wiz7 is probably the peak performance for a classic, tb blobber, while Wiz8 is a unique game that managed to merge blobber formula with a lot of then-modern trends and innovate without inducing decline.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

there's a wiz8 mod that removes respawning enemies but it also adds a bunch of other changes
I want to get around to seeing if I can prune just that change from it sometime

 

[Viata]

removes respawning enemies but it also adds a bunch of other changes

It's amazing how those mods always include some shit when they do something we need.

 

[PorkaMorka]

There is some long battles, mostly early in Arnika Road because your equipment sucks and you don't have good spells either.
But they're not trash combat, because it can kill you, that's the opposite of trash combat.

That's like, your definition of trash combat, maaan.

In my book it's still trash combat because it's boring untactical randomly generated fights against nameless plant monsters (or whatever) that respawn over and over and just spam a few boring attacks. (Yes, I am aware there are limitations on how enemies respawn, but in the course of a full run you will have multiple long and boring fights with these nameless uninteresting enemies.)

I tried to finish Wizardry 8 three times and I always get sick of the game mid way through for this reason; exploring a new zone means more trash fights, at some point it's not worth it. I always force myself to play through Arnika road and the boring early game, but then eventually the mid game payoff isn't worth the tedium.

I could definitely see the classic blobber formula being less tedious, although I'll probably never find out for sure.

 

[NerevarineKing]

Wiz 1 is a still very playable, especially with the newer ports. Only played a few games in this series so far, but 1 is the one I ended up enjoying the most.

 

[Viata]

Wiz 1 is a still very playable, especially with the newer ports. Only played a few games in this series so far, but 1 is the one I ended up enjoying the most.

All of them are still playable today. Even in their original version.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Links to the wiz8 mods and list of what it does?

Of course I have the GoG versions of 6-8 and my original cd for wizarchives 1-5 (copied into folders to use in dosbox) and before gog I managed to pirate wiz8 (very shitty pirate )copy

 

[Darth Canoli]

Links to the wiz8 mods and list of what it does?

Of course I have the GoG versions of 6-8 and my original cd for wizarchives 1-5 (copied into folders to use kn dosbox) and before gog I managed to pirate wiz8 (very shitty pirate )copy

Wizardry 8 mods (snafaru)

Forum for more info about most mods (postcount)

 

[Serus]

You can easily fuck yourself if you class change too much in 6 and 7. You will be lacking in levels, meaning you repeatedly get wrecked by status effects, and you will end up with a huge excess of skill points (especially in 7 when skill points are category-locked).

Very fake news. You change the classes early in game at very low levels. This way in the end you can be less than a level beyond what you would be without hyper class changing. There are some classes/races combos that allows to do it even on level 2 and they don't need any additional points at all to do it! You can go from one class to another and back again almost indefinitely. Many others class/race combos require only very few points to change the same way. Basically, you make use of the fact that early levels cost a very small % of exp of higher levels. Enemy "generators" make it even easier. If you change the class a dozen times or more you still won't be behind on higher level significantly. If it worked like you think it did, there wouldn't be any issue with Wizardry 7 levelling to begin with.

I rarely say that but in this case - to everyone who wants to play W7 - don't use this "feature". Change classes but set yourself a self-imposed limit of how many changes is allowed before the beginning of the game and stick to it. I suggest 2, maximum 3 changes. That's my advice, take it or leave it.

Wizardry 8 levelling system had serious problems too. Namely it was (almost) useless. The authors understood the problem with Wizardry 7 but what they did as a solution? They addressed the issue... by butchering the system almost completely. Class changing wasn't so easily abused anymore. It was useless instead. Except very few class changes (and even there it was minor) they simply don't make sense, or have minimal impact mechanically. I suppose it is still usable by larpers. "I want a Bard/Gadgeteer! It's cool" kind of thing.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

obsessive focus on class changing is one of the reasons I dislike wizardry

I don't really understand the point of using a class-based rules system that is focused on changing your class or multiclassing.

 

[Grauken]

obsessive focus on class changing is one of the reasons I dislike wizardry

I don't really understand the point of using a class-based rules system that is focused on changing your class or multiclassing.

They just wanted to offer prestige classes to evolve into, they didn't expect people abusing the system as much as they did

 

[Serus]

obsessive focus on class changing is one of the reasons I dislike wizardry

You shouldn't dislike Wizardry 8 then. As i wrote, class changing might not have been there at all and you wouldn't see any difference.

Or was it irony? I'm terrible at irony over the Internet.
However a LOT of people do obsessively change classes in Wizardry 7. I present you myself, as a living proof.

obsessive focus on class changing is one of the reasons I dislike wizardry

I don't really understand the point of using a class-based rules system that is focused on changing your class or multiclassing.

They just wanted to offer prestige classes to evolve into, they didn't expect people abusing the system as much as they did

Not sure about that. Wizardry 6 had the same system, right? I never played it for any significant amount of time. There are 2(?) years between 6 and 7. You would think that if what you say were true - they'd change it in part 7? I'm not sure myself to be honest.

 

[Grauken]

Class changing has been there since Wizardry 1

 

[Butter]

You can easily fuck yourself if you class change too much in 6 and 7. You will be lacking in levels, meaning you repeatedly get wrecked by status effects, and you will end up with a huge excess of skill points (especially in 7 when skill points are category-locked).

Very fake news. You change the classes early in game at very low levels. This way in the end you can be less than a level beyond what you would be without hyper class changing. There are some classes/races combos that allows to do it even on level 2 and they don't need any additional points at all to do it! You can go from one class to another and back again almost indefinitely. Many others class/race combos require only very few points to change the same way. Basically, you make use of the fact that early levels cost a very small % of exp of higher levels. Enemy "generators" make it even easier. If you change the class a dozen times or more you still won't be behind on higher level significantly. If it worked like you think it did, there wouldn't be any issue with Wizardry 7 levelling to begin with.

I rarely say that but in this case - to everyone who wants to play W7 - don't use this "feature". Change classes but set yourself a self-imposed limit of how many changes is allowed before the beginning of the game and stick to it. I suggest 2, maximum 3 changes. That's my advice, take it or leave it.

Wizardry 8 levelling system had serious problems too. Namely it was (almost) useless. The authors understood the problem with Wizardry 7 but what they did as a solution? They addressed the issue... by butchering the system almost completely. Class changing wasn't so easily abused anymore. It was useless instead. Except very few class changes (and even there it was minor) they simply don't make sense, or have minimal impact mechanically. I suppose it is still usable by larpers. "I want a Bard/Gadgeteer! It's cool" kind of thing.

You can get fucked by a lack of levels as early as Old City when the Puxic Oozes start poisoning and sickening your entire party.

 

[Grauken]

Save scumming is your friend

 

[Serus]

You can easily fuck yourself if you class change too much in 6 and 7. You will be lacking in levels, meaning you repeatedly get wrecked by status effects, and you will end up with a huge excess of skill points (especially in 7 when skill points are category-locked).

Very fake news. You change the classes early in game at very low levels. This way in the end you can be less than a level beyond what you would be without hyper class changing. There are some classes/races combos that allows to do it even on level 2 and they don't need any additional points at all to do it! You can go from one class to another and back again almost indefinitely. Many others class/race combos require only very few points to change the same way. Basically, you make use of the fact that early levels cost a very small % of exp of higher levels. Enemy "generators" make it even easier. If you change the class a dozen times or more you still won't be behind on higher level significantly. If it worked like you think it did, there wouldn't be any issue with Wizardry 7 levelling to begin with.

I rarely say that but in this case - to everyone who wants to play W7 - don't use this "feature". Change classes but set yourself a self-imposed limit of how many changes is allowed before the beginning of the game and stick to it. I suggest 2, maximum 3 changes. That's my advice, take it or leave it.

Wizardry 8 levelling system had serious problems too. Namely it was (almost) useless. The authors understood the problem with Wizardry 7 but what they did as a solution? They addressed the issue... by butchering the system almost completely. Class changing wasn't so easily abused anymore. It was useless instead. Except very few class changes (and even there it was minor) they simply don't make sense, or have minimal impact mechanically. I suppose it is still usable by larpers. "I want a Bard/Gadgeteer! It's cool" kind of thing.

You can get fucked by a lack of levels as early as Old City when the Puxic Oozes start poisoning and sickening your entire party.

Man, what i described, I did myself. It's not theorycrafting but practice. And not just me. Far, far from it, including, i'm pretty sure, some Codexers as well.
But be my guest, if you want to believe in pink, singing unicorns leaving your ass when you fart, be my guest. Who am i to tell anyone what to think.

 

[Serus]

Save scumming is your friend

Not even that much needed in this case. There is infinite numbers of enemy spawns AND monster generators to make it even easier. You can level up back to "normal" in no time. However save scumming was part of the experience IF you wanted to do the same thing with race/class combos that required several points to change into each other.
Did i mention that it could be called degenerate gameplay style?

 

[Grauken]

Save scumming is your friend

Not even that much needed in this case. There is infinite numbers of enemy spawns AND monster generators to make it even easier. You can level up back to "normal" in no time. However save scumming was part of the experience IF you wanted to do the same thing with race/class combos that required several points to change into each other.
Did i mention that it could be called degenerate gameplay style?

I mentioned save scumming in case you got poisoned or diseased at low levels (especially for the later)

 

[Cleveland Mark Blakemore]

Wizardry 8 levelling system had serious problems too. Namely it was (almost) useless. The authors understood the problem with Wizardry 7 but what they did as a solution? They addressed the issue... by butchering the system almost completely. Class changing wasn't so easily abused anymore. It was useless instead. Except very few class changes (and even there it was minor) they simply don't make sense, or have minimal impact mechanically. I suppose it is still usable by larpers. "I want a Bard/Gadgeteer! It's cool" kind of thing.

Didn't Wiz 8 strike you after 20 minutes as something a woman designed who decided "this is probably something that would improve the game" when in fact she didn't know enough about the games to understand what made the previous Wizardry games so great?

Every criticism of Wiz 7 up here reinforces its greatness. You really had to play the game at least 3 times all the way through to appreciate how incredible it was. The discovery of a new mechanic or feature or path through the game changed everything each time.

I once swam straight across the ocean when I made it to Old City and had a blast without ever touching the boat. Those areas between the lands were fantastic and fun. I tried to recaptuire some of that feel in Grimoire in the Loch system, which could be traversed with clever swimming without being on the Seahorse ship. I had also wished I could board other ships in the ocean and ended up putting that feature into Grimoire.

 

[Cleveland Mark Blakemore]

If there is a wizardry 8 spiritual successor. I want a longer game maybe a triple scenario game where you alternate controlling 3 parties working for various goals with one major plot moving forward as they accomplish their goals. Mix of premade npcs and your pcs.

I wanted that after playing Wiz 7 and put a lot of those ideas into Grimoire as well. I liked the idea you could change your entire party from the beginning into a completely different party during the course of playing it through by recruiting NPCs and class changing, switching portraits and totally overhauling your characters. I also liked the idea of scoring really overpowered NPCs in the strangest situations, like resurrecting old bones or incanting a sword to free the spirit trapped within.