STG interview at NMA

[Vault Dweller]

Tags: Bethesda Softworks

Today we have something different for you. It's an <a href=http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34700>interview</a> with <a href=http://www.startrek-gamers.com/>Star Trek Gamers</a> site. Why? Good question. Bethesda has blacklisted this site for criticizing their Star Trek game, and to put it simply, I think that the gaming community should be aware of Bethesda's ways to handle criticism. Anyway, long story short:
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<blockquote>Originally it (Star Trek Legacy) was met with open arms. This was the first game in 3 years and the fan sites were all over it, STG being the one that got the most interviews with the makers of all 3 games (there was Tactical Assault and Encounters being made as well). It was directly leading up to the release in December when things started to turn sour. It started to become obvious that a lot of the features which were hinted at being in the game weren't going to be there...
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Before the games release the PR Department was more than happy to work with the gaming sites of Star Trek, STG being the largest we got most of the interviews. The minute the game was released that PR Door was slammed shut. PR of Bethesda used and abused the gaming sites for their own advantage, and then they get all worried when one of them has the balls to bite back...that's their problem...not mine.
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Now, people who know me know what I am like. I speak my mind. If I dont like something I say it right on the front page of the site, screw the consequences. It got to the stage where Bethesda Softworks' silence was getting beyond a joke, and that's when The Argus Array, the STG's Star Trek Gaming podcast (which gets about 100,000 listeners) went on the record and listed the flaws of the game in a constructive manner. Argus 13, 14 and 15 all discussed what was wrong with the game and then Lindsay Muller (some kind of artist in Bethesda) came on the official Bethesda boards and said that the Argus Array must follow Bethesda Forum policies...basically Bethesda was now trying to dictate what i should put on my own podcast which I pay the hosting for.
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...needless to say I wasn't happy. They didn't want criticism, but I gave it to them full bore. I told them exactly what I thought of Legacy. All the while another particular "fansite" remained silent. It got to the stage where official "volunteer" moderators in the Bethesda boards were allowing any topic made by me to be flamed, but at the same time they banned any of my staff in the forum for the slightest misdemeanor.</blockquote>Here is the official Bethesda's response:
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<blockquote>Well, to start off, let me give you the official statement;
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"Linking to this site is not permitted due to prior infractions of our forum rules and Bethesda's terms and conditions."
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Considering the abuse you've given to devs and moderators who either work for bethesda, or volunteer their spare time to moderator the forums here. both on this site and on your own, and on your podcasts, And considering your general disruptiveness and negativity, bethesda has decided to remove any and all links to the STG.
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Any post containing it has been removed, and made after today will be edited, the same goes for signatures.
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I'm sure Bethesda is very sorry it had to come to this, but they believe you left them very little choice.</blockquote>If you'd like to know more about the game, here is a list of reviews:
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<a href=http://pc.ign.com/articles/750/750369p1.html>IGN - 59%</a>
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<a href=http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/star-trek-legacy/751151p1.html>GameSpy - 40%</a>
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<a href=http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=16428>"the worst game ever"</a>
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Anyway, as you all know, it's not the first time Bethesda blacklisted a site for daring to criticize their games. Let's hope that more people will speak against such tactics instead of staying silent. So, if you have something to say on this matter, Pete Hines would love to hear from you: <b>phines@bethsoft.com</b>
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[callehe]

Ok, we know that bethesda people aren't competent game makers, but that hate blog thing is really unsettling...

A thought: I wonder if the major gaming sites are going to report about this little incident? This is really a worthwhile newspiece, much bigger than Bethsofts Fallout 3 poster on E3 that made a big fuzz. It'll be a clear measure of beth-bribe the gaming sites received if they don't report this.

 

[jiujitsu]

It's bad form, in my opinion. Bethesda isn't playing nice. Whatever happened to "the customer is always right?"

 

[psycojester]

On the ESF "The customer is always right" will be changed by the swearing filter to "I love Bethesda and trust their design choices"

 

[Jason]

If I dont like something I say it right on the front page of the site, screw the consequences.

That shit is intense. No wonder the Man is afraid.

 

[Volourn]

"Whatever happened to "the customer is always right?"

NEWSFLASH: In my experience, the customer is nearly always wrong.

The site has the right to hate on the game if they so wish. And, Betehsda has the right to counter them any way thery wnat inbcluding banning them.

Just like VD can ban anyone he wnats without whiny crybabies whining about it for a second time.

Go STF forum. Go Betehsda. they ahve the right to do what each of them did.

I'm on both their sides.


_________________

 

[no]

It's hilarious how that interview is like a courtroom interrogation made by a Fallout fan camouflaged as an attorney.

NMA: Do you feel Bethesda or Mad Doc gave an honest presentation of what they were doing with the game during development
...
NMA: Do you feel Bethesda is fit to publish more Star Trek games? Do you think those games by Bethesda would be a commercial success?
...
NMA: I have no further questions, mr. judge

*retires back to his seat with a smug look on his face*

 

[POOPERSCOOPER]

I bet you pete hines is jacking off to this interview with his giant gimp hand at full speed.

 

[Slylandro]

"Whatever happened to "the customer is always right?"

NEWSFLASH: In my experience, the customer is nearly always wrong.

Well, that's because you are the customer in your experience.

 

[One Wolf]

yes, vol, beth has the right to ban anyone who doesn't post about how great their product is, but it's still pretty fucked up.

"the worst game ever"

maybe it's just me, but i found that review to be hysterical.

So, every combat goes like this: space bar (select random enemy), f f f f f f f f f f f f left click left click left click f f f f f f f f f f left click right click f f f f f f f f f f f f

 

[callehe]

"Whatever happened to "the customer is always right?"

NEWSFLASH: In my experience, the customer is nearly always wrong.

The site has the right to hate on the game if they so wish. And, Betehsda has the right to counter them any way thery wnat inbcluding banning them.

Just like VD can ban anyone he wnats without whiny crybabies whining about it for a second time.

Go STF forum. Go Betehsda. they ahve the right to do what each of them did.

I'm on both their sides.


_________________

"the customer is always right" is not a fact, nobody is claiming that you turkey - it's a policy a lot of consumer-serving companies have -> likely in hope of getting more profitable by presenting themselves as service inclined.

if you fuck with your own policies and come off as untrustworthy in the public eye, that's not good for business. then it doesn't matter who's right or not.

 

[Volourn]

"Well, that's because you are the customer in your experience."

Nah. Not always. Cumstoners may think they're always right; but they are nearly always wrong - espicially when they try to tell employees what their job is. L0L

Hilarious stuff.


"if you fuck with your own policies and come off as untrustworthy in the public eye, that's not good for business. then it doesn't matter who's right or not."

O RLY? Many companies do things that anger a certain percentage of their potential customers, and do just fine.

And, if one thing angers a certain percentage; you'd bet there's a good chance that same thing pleases another.

That's soemthing the so called hardcore fanbase that makes up the Codex regualrs simply are too daft to understand. Just because you (Generla you; not specifically you) dislike x game for y reasons doens't mean other fans think the same as you. And, it's not because youa re stupid.

How much money does this ST fansite make? A lot less than betehsda. Bethesda knows what theya re doing. This fansite doesn't.

Game over, MAN, game over.


"yes, vol, beth has the right to ban anyone who doesn't post about how great their product is, but it's still pretty fucked up."

If someone trahses your product.. they are no longer your customber base (since they hate your product) so you havge no reason to cater to their whims hence why Betehsda has no need to allowed bashers on their site. It gets in the way of actual fans of Bethesda products.

 

[Walkin' Dude]

Go STF forum.

Is that the forum dedicated to discussing the STF?

Actually, I agree with Volourn. Of course STF folks can complain about Bethsoft's piss-poor handling of the license. Of course Beth don't want to link to a site that will slam their game. That would be stupid.

Um. . . how does it go?
R000fles?

 

[callehe]

...

"if you fuck with your own policies and come off as untrustworthy in the public eye, that's not good for business. then it doesn't matter who's right or not."

O RLY? Many companies do things that anger a certain percentage of their potential customers, and do just fine.

And, if one thing angers a certain percentage; you'd bet there's a good chance that same thing pleases another.

That's soemthing the so called hardcore fanbase that makes up the Codex regualrs simply are too daft to understand. Just because you (Generla you; not specifically you) dislike x game for y reasons doens't mean other fans think the same as you. And, it's not because youa re stupid.
...
How much money does this ST fansite make? A lot less than betehsda. Bethesda knows what theya re doing. This fansite doesn't.

how much money did the reporters that worked on the Enron case make compared to Enron's president? you can't measure success based soley on monetary success. bank robbers are successful sometimes too you know.

yeah sure you can fuck with the fanbase sure enough, but once just once it might blow up in your face. again, there's lot's of examples of cases where when the fans and customers all abandoned the franchise when their sphincter can't take no more rape - ultima, fallout, x-com - to name a few.

 

[Volourn]

Enron got cuaght doing something illegal while in this case Bethesda's 'crime' is they made a game someone doesn't like. But, yeah, those situations are exactly the same. Yeah.

 

[Bradylama]

Not just someone, practically everybody. Nobody's arguing whether or not Bethesda has the right to do this, the point is that it's a shit move on their part.

 

[enchanted_eyeball]

I found something interesting, which got me shocked , but then it all made sense:


Bethesda - Serving people with developmental disabilities
http://www.blhs.org/


Our Mission - To teach and share Christ's love while providing supports and services for people with developmental disabilities.

--could there be a connection? : :

 

[taxacaria]

@enchanted_eyeball

priceless - you saved my day

 

[Elwro]

I'm sure Bethesda is very sorry it had to come to this, but they believe you left them very little choice.

Poor little Bethesda, alone in a world filled with hate.

 

[GhanBuriGhan]

Oh, evil evil Bethesda! But the Codex was "blacklisted" (a rather strong word) because of it's then abundant tubgirl and porn posts, not its criticism of the game. How ridiculous, geekwars!

 

[enchanted_eyeball]

well anyway, I like to spread geeky stuff around.
Just give you a little story how easily can fans (if not destroy) but influence developers.


Once I used to be a part of a thing called "petition" against Activision, in which the petition was made toward the Rome: Total War game and Activision's retarded policy of "only 2 patches, regardless if there are still problems".

We fixed them nicely with 15,000 signatures to boycott against them and the game, and we even managed to flood their "user reviews" on various boards and brought down the game from the 5/5 score to 2.5/5.

Of course, The entire forum (www.twcenter.net) was excommunicated, but later on, they offered us the oil branch , since the Total War frenchise was given to SEGA and they are a lot better, not the best, but better when it comes to fans versus devs/distributors.

Even though , never admitted, we (the old petitioners) know it well that our little "contribution" played in part of what happened and suddenly there came not one, but 3 more patches, to fix the utterly broken game.

Later on, I became the admin of twcenter for 2 years and just recently resigned, since a change of ownership for twcenter.net plus I am tired of it as well.



anyway, I posted it on twcenter, since that place sees like 500-600 visitors a day on a weekend here you go:

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthre ... ost1502263

me= Horsearcher

 

[callehe]

Enron got cuaght doing something illegal while in this case Bethesda's 'crime' is they made a game someone doesn't like. But, yeah, those situations are exactly the same. Yeah.

you missed the point: the analogy was to illustrate that just because you make a lot of money doesn't mean that you are successful in any orthodox sense.

besides it doesn't matter if they are right or not legally, they made a move - it LOOKS bad, it is bad PR. bad PR *usually means bad business.

it's good to see beth's bullshit exposed for once to a greater audience.

 

[Kraszu]

Oh, evil evil Bethesda! But the Codex was "blacklisted" (a rather strong word) because of it's then abundant tubgirl and porn posts, not its criticism of the game. How ridiculous, geekwars!

Yeah right haw do you know that is true? Why msf stopped posting when that happen. Bethseda have some sexual moral policy for workers? Doesn't like blacklisting other site that were criticizing betheseda and have no "tubgirl and porn posts" leads to conclusion that it wasn't real reason more likely? Doesn't they forum policy of closing any discussion that they don't like leads to opposite conclusion then yours also?

 

[DarkUnderlord]

"if you fuck with your own policies and come off as untrustworthy in the public eye, that's not good for business. then it doesn't matter who's right or not."

O RLY? Many companies do things that anger a certain percentage of their potential customers, and do just fine.

And, if one thing angers a certain percentage; you'd bet there's a good chance that same thing pleases another.

The problem arises when there are more angry customers then there are pleased customers. Going by the reviews of Star Trek Legacy, I'd say they messed up here.

Mind you, I'm waiting for someone to point out that Mad Doc are the developers and Bethesda are just the publishers. Come on Volourn, you usually notice these things.

How much money does this ST fansite make? A lot less than betehsda. Bethesda knows what theya re doing. This fansite doesn't.

For the record, how much money do you make? That way we can dismiss your opinion whenever we find someone who earns more than you and who disagrees with you. I'm thinking that would almost be everyone here.

"yes, vol, beth has the right to ban anyone who doesn't post about how great their product is, but it's still pretty fucked up."

If someone trahses your product.. they are no longer your customber base (since they hate your product) so you havge no reason to cater to their whims hence why Betehsda has no need to allowed bashers on their site. It gets in the way of actual fans of Bethesda products.

Your retarded logic is as astounding as ever. If Star Trek fans are bashing a Star Trek product, you have a problem. The "customer is always right" because without customers, you don't have a business. A customer is someone who has bought the product. These people have bought the product. If customers who have bought your product are complaining about it, then other people who might potentially be customers will be less likely to purchase it. As a result, you lose potential customers.

Bethesda has blacklisted this site for criticizing their Star Trek game, and to put it simply, I think that the gaming community should be aware of Bethesda's ways to handle criticism.

For some reason, I'm really looking forward to Fallout 3 now.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Oh, evil evil Bethesda! But the Codex was "blacklisted" (a rather strong word) because of it's then abundant tubgirl and porn posts, not its criticism of the game. How ridiculous, geekwars!

Really? So both kathode and MSFD post here for about a year, with MSFD cracking jokes that he comes here for shockporn and even posting a link to a goatse PS3 "special edition", then my review comes out and suddenly the Codex is blacklisted and all the links are deleted and ANY FUCKING MENTION of the site is deleted as well. Yes, blacklisting is such a strong word *rolls eyes*.