People News How George Ziets would make BG3

[VentilatorOfDoom]

Tags: George Ziets

Georg Ziets explains how he would make Baldur's Gate 3 on Formspring.

I’ve always thought that the struggles of a new FR deity could be pretty interesting. Think about what the Bhaalspawn would be up against: 1) few or no followers in a setting where a god requires worship to survive, 2) no divine portfolio to speak of, and 3) a fortress / headquarters that is still floating somewhere in the Abyss – not friendly territory, even for an evil PC.

Under those circumstances, I think a divine campaign would be a battle for survival. It’s suggested at the end of ToB that Cyric and his allies will be coming after you (whether the player is evil or not) because Cyric took over Bhaal’s divine portfolio. The player, as a nascent god, would be facing off against some powerful deities.

Terrible odds? Yes. But that’s great for a story hook.

Initially the player may just be staving off imminent disaster as Cyric and his friends move quickly against the player – several strong deities against a relatively weak one. I could imagine the player being forced to abandon the Throne of Bhaal and going on the run across the planes. The player’s goal would be to gain followers (faith=power), usurp the divine portfolio of another god, and carve out a base of power in the wider multiverse. Your journey could take you to some of the planes we’ve never visited in a CRPG – Mount Celestia, Limbo, and Mechanus, for example – as well as revisiting old favorites like Sigil, though seeing the City of Doors through the eyes of a minor deity could be a very different experience. In a divine-level planar campaign, the player might stir up a civil war on Mount Celestia, conquer a layer of the Abyss, or assemble an adventuring party of divine avatars. Ultimately you’d take back the Throne of Bhaal, smack down Cyric and his friends, and establish a place for yourself among the pantheon of gods.

Mechanically, it seems like a critical resource would be your divine power, which would rise with your number of followers (humans, divines, demons, or whatever), the extent of your notoriety and influence, and the importance of your divine portfolio. (The concept of divine rank could conceivably replace character level.) You’d create avatars to go adventuring in the various planes, so death wouldn’t force a reload. And as you travel the planes, you might learn ways to change or improve the traits of your avatar, or to create multiple avatars, each with different shapes and abilities, useful for different situations.

That’s just some quick brainstorming, but I think a divine-level BG3 could be a lot of fun, and the Bhaalspawn’s story could certainly go on if developers wanted to pursue it.

Mechanus, Limbo, Mount Celestia, eh? Would pay 50 bucks on Kickstarter.*

Make it so.

(*) unless it's gonna be P:E-like clown-down bullshit, then 20 dorrah max

 

[Excidium]

That sounds like a p. cool concept, but then you realize it would use high-level D&D mechanics.

 

[SwiftCrack]

Coming to a PC near you in 2015 by courtesy of Trenst Oster.

 

[Koschey]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place? Great way to bethesda the Planescape lore.

 

[Monkeyfinger]

how is this not an infinitron posting?

 

[Angthoron]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place? Great way to bethesda the Planescape lore.

Maybe for a chance to romance the Lady~

 

[VentilatorOfDoom]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place? Great way to bethesda the Planescape lore.

np, just do a few fetch quests for her

 

[Minttunator]

how is this not an infinitron posting?

Technically it is, Infinitron originally posted this quote in the inXile Torment successor thread. :D

 

[Spectacle]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place? Great way to bethesda the Planescape lore.

Perhaps the bhaalspawn could hide his divinity with some magical ritual that would make him forget that he was a god, along with everything else about his life? He would still be practically immortal because of his divine nature, and have other powers not available to normal men.
In such a scenario it would be very useful for the bhaalspawn to have some kind of familliar to look after him while his memory is gone. A floating skull would be a good sidekick for a god of murder, pretty cool and original.

 

[Haba]

That sounds like a p. cool concept, but then you realize it would use high-level D&D mechanics.

Not just high-level, divine level.

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Divine_Ranks

It would be interesting to play a game with those rules.

Especially if it featured derps like this:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Godslayer_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)

Or maybe some high level those:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Baatorian_Arcanovore_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)

 

[Moribund]

Just awful. I say that not just to the idea but to the post above. Never seen any of those prestige classes or whatever.

Obviously problem with FR and BG is everything tries too hard to be super epic awesome already, especially in the later games. Any DnD 4e game would be just awful anyway and that's all they'll ever make, but this is 9/10 ugh and 1/10th planescape ripoff. Seriously we need to stop getting everyone and their uncle pitching every combination of every popular game ever made. How about a new game some day now that there's this wild KS thing that might make it possible?

 

[CappenVarra]

Sounds like the "I" tier from BECMI... Would be cool, but only if it used BECMI mechanics and not some d20 nonsense such as Haba posted examples of

 

[ghostdog]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place?

The game will end with the protagonist being cut down by the lady's blades. His horrendously scarred body will then be transfered to the mortuary and put on a slab. But is he truly dead ...?

There you have it. BG/PST crossover.

 

[Azrael the cat]

That would actually be one game where I'd be perfectly happy for them to scrap the (fucking awful) corresponding PnP rules altogether.

 

[Gord]

The concept sounds interesting, but I wonder whether it should be an RPG.
Some strategy/builder game with some rpg concepts might be better suited for it.
Epic level DnD is already quite derpy most of the time (although I admit that there's some small chance that this idea might actually provide a background where epic level stuff can be made making sense).

 

[861129]

The concept sounds interesting, but I wonder whether it should be an RPG.
Some strategy/builder game with some rpg concepts might be better suited for it.
Epic level DnD is already quite derpy most of the time (although I admit that there's some small chance that this idea might actually provide a background where epic level stuff can be made making sense).

Yes - for a straight RPG, the "gathering followers" bit is all too reminiscent of Bioware's four plot devices and suicide mission. It's difficult for me to imagine how you'd do this in a strictly RPG format without reverting to that sort of structure. The dynamic of the player's choices would be much better expressed in strategy-type gameplay.

 

[Luzur]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place? Great way to bethesda the Planescape lore.

Perhaps the bhaalspawn could hide his divinity with some magical ritual that would make him forget that he was a god, along with everything else about his life? He would still be practically immortal because of his divine nature, and have other powers not available to normal men.
In such a scenario it would be very useful for the bhaalspawn to have some kind of familliar to look after him while his memory is gone. A floating skull would be a good sidekick for a god of murder, pretty cool and original.

why not a floating Dong this time? with little wings and hairy balls.

 

[villain of the story]

That's nice, I would like to play a game like that but the basic concept doesn't fit with BG1+2 as a game which are more personal games. Therefore, fuck Ziets despite the good work he has done on MotB.

The concept sounds interesting, but I wonder whether it should be an RPG.
Some strategy/builder game with some rpg concepts might be better suited for it.
Epic level DnD is already quite derpy most of the time (although I admit that there's some small chance that this idea might actually provide a background where epic level stuff can be made making sense).

Yes - for a straight RPG, the "gathering followers" bit is all too reminiscent of Bioware's four plot devices and suicide mission. It's difficult for me to imagine how you'd do this in a strictly RPG format without reverting to that sort of structure. The dynamic of the player's choices would be much better expressed in strategy-type gameplay.

I thought more along the lines of HOMM or JA2.

 

[Bladderfish]

That's nice, I would like to play a game like that but the basic concept doesn't fit with BG1+2 as a game which are more personal games. Therefore, fuck Ziets despite the good work he has done on MotB.

Yes - for a straight RPG, the "gathering followers" bit is all too reminiscent of Bioware's four plot devices and suicide mission. It's difficult for me to imagine how you'd do this in a strictly RPG format without reverting to that sort of structure. The dynamic of the player's choices would be much better expressed in strategy-type gameplay.

If written right, a fight for survival could be incredibly personal, as the protaganist is in danger of losing everything they hold dear. I'd be willing to let Ziets run with anything given the work he did on MotB.

I took the gathering followers comment as more of an impersonal thing. I.E they aren't companions or friends or romanceable idiots like in Bioware games; they are underlings or worshippers perhaps classified by numbers more than anything else. The player can spread their reputation and influence across a town or plane and gain unseen followers who literally worship their actions, whatever they may be. These worshippers would then increase the power of the player dependant on the type of worship they are receiving (which in turn is predicted by the type of actions the player undertook).

Sounds like a hybrid Populous/RPG in a sense, but the focus would still be on questing and survival, with the goal being power and worship rather than skills and levels. An interesting idea imo

 

[TeknoBM]

i need this !!! my body is ready ! make it happen !!!!!!

 

[Erebus]

It's not a bad idea, but it would be hard to write a scenario that would work equally well for all kinds of PC. The morality and ideals of the PC would be the heart of the religion he's trying to start, which would be the heart of the story. An evil PC might simply decide to become the new god of murder, but a good or a neutral one would have very different goals. Unless the new religion is some sort of shapeless ideology (which wouldn't be very satisfying), it would be fairly hard to deal with all the possibilities.

 

[handup]

I said it in the Torment Successor thread, and I'll repeat it with a little less sarcasm: As a whole some interesting ideas, but come on, a fledgling god running around Sigil? How is that supposed to work with the Lady in place? Great way to bethesda the Planescape lore.

He mentioned that you will be able to take the form of avatars to go questing in certain places. I assume Sigil is one of them. I think that would be pretty cool as it would be very limiting in power compared to the rest of the game. In Torment you never really got a sense of scope regarding just how insanely powerful the Lady is. In this game her influence would affect the gameplay mechanics, so really, this could be a more accurate portrayal than Torment.
Also Bhaalspawn/Lady of Pain OTP.

 

[grotsnik]

Yeah, you'd need a godawful lot of permutations to account satisfactorily for all the different PC builds - and I think the natural limitations of its being a CRPG would probably make themselves awkwardly felt no matter what you did, just because the set-up is based around an agency and freedom that you'd have to then handwave out.

"You have ascended to divinity, Child of Bhaal! Now create an avatar and send it out to find worshippers in the multiverse - and by 'multiverse', I mean these three quest-hub locations. You're not allowed to go anywhere else, because, uh, Cyric. As a concession to your almighty godlike powers, you can visit them in any order you like."

 

[Infinitron]

A game concept with potentially out of control scope, you say?

Mr. Ziets is a true Obsidian dev.

 

[Jaesun]

They need to fucking hire Mr. Ziets permanently at Obsidian.