A Quest That Became Legend - gridless open world blobber

[Bad Sector]

Quite so, they act as a single entity, which makes it mechanically identical to a game with a single entity.

Not really, among others, your party members have different stats and skills, you can leave some members at the inn (so they aren't usable) and hire others, so there are several differences between it and a game with a single entity.

 

[Serus]

These games always took some liberties with the whole "party of <number>" aspect, hence the term "blobber" (they act as a single entity).

Quite so, they act as a single entity, which makes it mechanically identical to a game with a single entity.

Wrong. They act as a single entity - in some situations only. Like in case of map movement. To some extent also combat - namely positioning in combat - although many blobbers have some form of limited positioning within the blob. The characters do other stuff individually, same as in other types of crpgs. They attack, use abilities in combat and outside of it, have stats, individual inventories, can die individually, etc.. etc...

 

[Atlantico]

These games always took some liberties with the whole "party of <number>" aspect, hence the term "blobber" (they act as a single entity).

Quite so, they act as a single entity, which makes it mechanically identical to a game with a single entity.

Wrong. They act as a single entity - in some situations only. Like in case of map movement. To some extent also combat - namely positioning in combat - although many blobbers have some form of limited positioning within the blob. The characters do other stuff individually, same as in other types of crpgs. They attack, use abilities in combat and outside of it, have stats, individual inventories, can die individually, etc.. etc...

So now "blobbers" have parties that act "a single entity - in some situations only".

OK sure, it's a made up term. It means what you want it to mean, doesn't mean it actually exists. There is no mechanical difference between whatever you call "blobbers" or "gridders" and any other first person RPG.

That's best demonstrated in the disappearance of the "blobber", because people realized it was pointless.

Having a party of 4 is the same as having a party of one character with four abilities and that was way cooler regardless. The "blobber" was just an abstraction for single players to pretend they had a party, because RPGs always had a party. It was like that in the old days.

We're still playing the same type of game, now it's just done with a single character. Same game mechanics. The "blobber" never existed.

What really piques my interest is how many people are triggered by this observation.

 

[Serus]

These games always took some liberties with the whole "party of <number>" aspect, hence the term "blobber" (they act as a single entity).

Quite so, they act as a single entity, which makes it mechanically identical to a game with a single entity.

Wrong. They act as a single entity - in some situations only. Like in case of map movement. To some extent also combat - namely positioning in combat - although many blobbers have some form of limited positioning within the blob. The characters do other stuff individually, same as in other types of crpgs. They attack, use abilities in combat and outside of it, have stats, individual inventories, can die individually, etc.. etc...

So now "blobbers" have parties that act "a single entity - in some situations only".

OK sure, it's a made up term. It means what you want it to mean, doesn't mean it actually exists. There is no mechanical difference between whatever you call "blobbers" or "gridders" and any other first person RPG.

That's best demonstrated in the disappearance of the "blobber", because people realized it was pointless.

Having a party of 4 is the same as having a party of one character with four abilities and that was way cooler regardless. The "blobber" was just an abstraction for single players to pretend they had a party, because RPGs always had a party. It was like that in the old days.

We're still playing the same type of game, now it's just done with a single character. Same game mechanics. The "blobber" never existed.

What really piques my interest is how many people are triggered by this observation.

You are training hard for the incoming ITO*. I like dedication. Keep it up. I'll help playing along and acting as if i took your trolling attempts seriously. No need to thank me.
*

Spoiler

Internet Troll Olympics

I might disappoint you, I don't see anyone triggered. Where they are so i can troll them? We could even do it together, maybe i can show you a few tricks.
What really piques MY interest however is your inability to grasp any argument presented to you and to formulate a single one of your own. Let's see.

1. Yes they do.
Even in many non-blobber party based crpgs you do some activities as "single entity" (say, fast travel in some games). It just the question, how much and which activities are abstracted. In blobbers the abstraction is simply used more. But the fact that something is abstracted doesn't negate it.
What is your confusion here?

2. All terms are "made up". The point is if they describes something. In this case a subgenre of crpg. Tell us why having all that attributes, that I mentioned earlier, characters are not real and are part of "a single entity"? Why? Also where you are at it, what about blobbers with recruitable NPCs (like Wizardry 8)? Are those NPCs part of single entity? Yes or no and why. Those games are tricky.

3. They didn't "disappear". Some subgenres becomes more or less common and popular with time. Think about RTwP vs TB. There were people in late 90 early 00 that non-ironically claimed the end of turn based games as it was... what was the term you used? "Pointless" in view of the "new" more modern RTwP.
In addition, I am not your secretary but hey, let it be known that am not insensitive to greenskinned under-the-bridge dwellers: https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/list-of-all-blobbers-on-steam.134830/

4. "Having a party of 4 is the same as having a party of one character with four abilities and that was way cooler regardless". This very phrase can be said about any party-based crpg. Nothing you said there isn't specific to blobbers. You need to make actual argument.


One last thing. If you want me to help in your training I mentioned above then you need to make effort. Otherwise you will have to look for other training opportunities.

 

[Atlantico]

One last thing. If you want me to help in your training I mentioned above then you need to make effort. Otherwise you will have to look for other training opportunities.

Oh no, I can't be bothered to discuss this again. It's already been discussed, you're not that interesting — nor are your "points".

They all boil down to "duurrr u must make reeel r-gument lul" anyway.

By the way, you posting a wall of text on this topic is being triggered, sunshine.

 

[V_K]

random, even if it remains the same across runs

My brain just exploded.

Perhaps an easier to way to describe it is that the object placement, setup, etc are the output of a random number generator, thus they are randomly generated. Their placement, setup, etc can be fixed with a fixed seed that causes them to be the same across runs, but they still is the result of randomness.

My problem with this reasoning is that RNGs aren't random. They're mathematical functions producing a sequence of values that is completely determined by the initial value i.e. seed. They only approximate chance operations when the seend is chosen ad hoc - but even then they're pseudorandom at best since the output conforms to a given distribution. Give the RNG a fixed seed, and you end up with a completely deterministic sequence that conforms to a set mathematical formula. There's zero randomness to it.
So at best you could say that DF is pseudorandomly generated, but even that would be misleading.

 

[Bad Sector]

My problem with this reasoning is that RNGs aren't random. [...] So at best you could say that DF is pseudorandomly generated, but even that would be misleading.

Pretty much everything on a computer is not true randomness but this isn't a useful distinction to make.

Hell, even a physical dice roll isn't true randomness as it is merely the outcome of all the forces applied to it.

The only practical consideration when it comes to games is if something can be perceived as random or not (ie. if human beings can follow the sequences and can spot patterns).

 

[V_K]

My problem with this reasoning is that RNGs aren't random. [...] So at best you could say that DF is pseudorandomly generated, but even that would be misleading.

Pretty much everything on a computer is not true randomness but this isn't a useful distinction to make.

And distinguishing a fully deterministic generation algorithm that doesn't even try to pretend to be random from other kinds of procedural generation is useful how exactly?

 

[Trithne]

One last thing. If you want me to help in your training I mentioned above then you need to make effort. Otherwise you will have to look for other training opportunities.

Oh no, I can't be bothered to discuss this again. It's already been discussed, you're not that interesting — nor are your "points".

They all boil down to "duurrr u must make reeel r-gument lul" anyway.

By the way, you posting a wall of text on this topic is being triggered, sunshine.

Will you stop shitting up every thread that says blobber? You have a thread to bitch about that in already.

 

[Atlantico]

Will you stop shitting up every thread that says blobber? You have a thread to bitch about that in already.

All the 500 post alts are going apeshit with faux indignation. You've posted zero times before in this thread.

I can respond to posts directed at me, and my post is on topic.

 

[Bad Sector]

And distinguishing a fully deterministic generation algorithm that doesn't even try to pretend to be random from other kinds of procedural generation is useful how exactly?

I already explained a few weeks ago how the procedural generation and the random generation relate to each other with regards to Daggerfall. The key difference that you should pay attention to is that the important elements that make up the world are not set up by hand but instead were set up randomly using the random generator (even if the fixed seed causes it to always generate the same values and thus use the same setup - again, the difference is that the setup of these elements wasn't chosen by a human designer). The Daggerfall world is randomly generated because the inputs that make up the elements that define the world are generated by a random number generator.

(the "define the world" is also significant because if the random number generator was used for elements that made no difference, like e.g. the placement of some minor rocks, or choosing foliage patterns, or other mostly visual artifacts or even just making minor adjustments to elements that a designer placed, like deciding which one of the predetermined -by a human designer- potential positions for a bridge will be used for that bridge when the game starts, then the world wouldn't really be randomly generated - though of course the more elements like the bridge example are used, the more "gray" that area becomes)

 

[rusty_shackleford]

is baldur's gate a good blobber?

 

[Bastardchops]

So basically: "party based Skyrim" is blobber. Gotcha.

See you're starting to learn. It's not so hard. Have sticker and sit in the corner for being a good boy.

 

[Bastardchops]

Quite so, they act as a single entity, which makes it mechanically identical to a game with a single entity.

Please never become someone who repairs heavy machinery. Your idea of what is mechanically identical would cause significant injury and loss of life.

 

[Atlantico]

Quite so, they act as a single entity, which makes it mechanically identical to a game with a single entity.

Please never become someone who repairs heavy machinery. Your idea of what is mechanically identical would cause significant injury and loss of life.

Game mechanics and physical mechanics are not synonymous, moron.

Your mangling of the English language could work as a warning to ESL students everywhere. Wow, that reminds me: I hope English is your second language.

 

[Abu Antar]

A video of fighting giant spiders.

Fighting giant spiders on the way through the valleys of the jungle to the spider queen’s lair

 

[Infinitron]

 

[Infinitron]

The queen spider and her hatchlings are always hungry, so beware all who dare enter her lair

 

[Infinitron]

 

[Eisen]

Is it made in Unity?

 

[Infinitron]

Lurala is mostly a frozen wasteland inhabited by nasty things like ice golems and wyverns. So better warm up your fire spells for a trip through this Icy desert

 

[Abu Antar]

 

[cyborgboy95]

 

[Abu Antar]

Fighting wyverns and other flying creatures can sometimes be hard. Especially if your party primary relies on melee attacks. But luckily, it's possible to use magic that forces them to land on the ground. #RPG #madewithunity #IndieGameDev

Spoiler

 

[mindx2]

Please tell me that ugly yellow outlining can be turned off?!