Preview A Wight By Any Other Name....

[JarlFrank]

Why is no one capable of making unique worlds like Morrowind's Tamriel any more?

They're capable, they're just not willing. Face it: the majority of games these days are geared towards console douchebags. Gothy, metally, rap music? Check! Tattooed, pierced, spikey-haired chicks with big tits? Check! Awesome "fatality" moves? Check! Sit back and watch the 15-year-old wiggers line up to buy the shit out it.

More like "stereotypical movie-like EPIC orchestral soundtrack" and "sorceresses in skimpy armor with large shoulder pads and even larger tits". That's what generic fantasy has turned into nowadays.

 

[MetalCraze]

Every child knows that an abomination is a creature created when a demon possesses a mage

 

[Micmu]

But it's got Liches, guys. This is going to be epic!
Kangaxx will return.

 

[ds77]

Ok, so I am pretty confused after reading some of these comments. Im 32 and really looking forward to DA. I have played some of the best RPGs out there beginning with my favorite series 'Ultima'. So if you all think that this game is going to suck sooooo much, then why dont you do something about it? Start your own game company or what have you. You should at least be pretty psyched that we get a new RPG. I dont know about you, but I think that RPGs and originality went out the window years ago. Every RPG has some piece that is ripped out of Tolkien. I am not sure if you can really get around it in this day and age. When I think of a BGII like RPG, I think of swords and magic. That limits the playing field right there. No mater what you come up with, its still going to seem like a game you have already played. DA will add some serious blood and violence to the mix, which I always thought was lacking. Whoever said that

Morrowind/Oblivion is original should open their eyes. Its all just frost giants, goblins, magic, and swords just like all the others. But you have some pretty crappy leveling thrown in as well. Bring back the days of 'uhh, you really want to avoid that area until you are sure you are NOT going come out holding your ass in your hands.

Be happy we get a RPG that looks like it will be fun. You mine as well go back to playing MUDs then read the massive amount of complaints in this thread about a game that hasnt been repleased yet.

 

[Hümmelgümpf]

Whose alt are you?

 

[circ]

David Gaider.

 

[circ]

Also, sorry ds77, but I can't be psyched about about football player shoulderpads and otherwise horrible looking armor. Massive swords that would put any jrpg to shame. Bad bad bad dialogue, even worse VO, generic BioWare groupmates and generic fantasy setting. So, what is it I'm supposed to be excited about, that it's an RPG?

I haven't had Snapple [flavor] in years because they stopped selling it. Let's say someone comes up to me with a glass of pee and says 'DRINK IT FAGGOT!'. No thanks, it's not Snapple [flavor].

 

[Rosh]

Ok, so I am pretty confused after reading some of these comments. Im 32 and really looking forward to DA. I have played some of the best RPGs out there beginning with my favorite series 'Ultima'.

Except that Ultima wasn't really trying to rip off high fantasy. It has a lot of originality in the world construction and backstory. DA offers none.

So if you all think that this game is going to suck sooooo much, then why dont you do something about it? Start your own game company or what have you.

Many of us already have. Maybe you should also look towards others who fit your remarks, the indie developers. Or did you just knee-jerk a reply into this thread without being aware of AoD?

You should at least be pretty psyched that we get a new RPG.

I dont know about you, but I think that RPGs and originality went out the window years ago.

Given statement two, statement one is false. If the setting doesn't matter, then why not just replay better games?

Every RPG has some piece that is ripped out of Tolkien. I am not sure if you can really get around it in this day and age. When I think of a BGII like RPG, I think of swords and magic. That limits the playing field right there. No mater what you come up with, its still going to seem like a game you have already played. DA will add some serious blood and violence to the mix, which I always thought was lacking.

Wizardry, Might and Magic, Ultima, etc. All have an imaginative setting and backstory that at first looks like a standard stock fantasy cliché...up until you figure out more about the setting.

So why should we reward BioWare's laziness by throwing money away at them?

Be happy we get a RPG that looks like it will be fun. You mine as well go back to playing MUDs then read the massive amount of complaints in this thread about a game that hasnt been repleased yet.

The sad thing is, I have played more imaginative and creative MUDs than someone's stupid attempt to reinvent high fantasy, hinging it in banal monster design and even worse romances that are the only "depth" they don't excuse against. David Gaider hates complexity in story paths, as it is exponentially more work for him, but we see where it goes when they want to make complex romances. The attention to detail is clearly in the wrong place for the old school to really care about this crap, but the X-Box kiddies will certainly love it.

 

[Vault Dweller]

A fantasy RPG without undead? Hmmm... Quite possible, yeah.

I think the issue here isn't as much about undead in DA, but about what these undead are. In the iconic Torment, most undead you see are non-hostile and have better reasons to be there than "we hunger for the flesh of teh living argh!!!". When a brand new and supposedly original IP offers you Devouring Corpses, Arcane Horrors, and Deep Stalkers, it's hard not to feel some disappointment.

 

[thesheeep]

But you have to include a lot of things people know, or else the mass will simply not buy it.

Cool. What else can you pull out of your ass?

I'm not pulling anything out of that area...
Seriously, sad as it is, it does work that way.

Only an already established IP (like Command & Conquer, Elder Scrolls, etc., NBA, etc. ), a well known (and popular) setting and/or marketing sells games.
Oh, and quality helps, of course

A brillant game with a completely fresh setting and no marketing will not sell good on the mass market. And even with marketing you can't be sure that it will.
Or only in very, very rare cases (and I don't know any).


@ VD:
True, that.

 

[Texas Red]

Go to the DA forum archives and read the posts before information on the game went black--

Once you try black you don't go back

 

[BearBomber]

A brillant game with a completely fresh setting and no marketing will not sell good on the mass market. And even with marketing you can't be sure that it will.

Game with no marketing will not sell good on the mass market no matter what setting it has.

 

[thesheeep]

Game with no marketing will not sell good on the mass market no matter what setting it has.

In general, yeah, but there are some exceptions. I just guess that games like FIFA, NBA, etc. are not that heavy on the marketing side, but I may be wrong here, since I don't really care about such games

 

[Vault Dweller]

But you have to include a lot of things people know, or else the mass will simply not buy it.

Cool. What else can you pull out of your ass?

I'm not pulling anything out of that area...
Seriously, sad as it is, it does work that way.

Only an already established IP (like Command & Conquer, Elder Scrolls, etc., NBA, etc. ), a well known (and popular) setting and/or marketing sells games.
Oh, and quality helps, of course

A brillant game with a completely fresh setting and no marketing will not sell good on the mass market. And even with marketing you can't be sure that it will.
Or only in very, very rare cases (and I don't know any).

I disagree. Blizzard has created 3 different IPs from scratch and is working on the fourth one. All their games are extremely successful. Well, that's Blizzard. Bioshock, a game with a very unique and too detailed for a shooter setting, sold 2.2 mil. A sequel is on its way. Well, that's a shooter. Ok. The Witcher sold over a mil. Needless to say that 99% of the North Americans have no clue who Sapkowski is and never heard about witchers. Gothic is yet another example.

As for marketing, any game will benefit from good marketing and exposure.

 

[Demnogonis Saastuttaja]

You should at least be pretty psyched that we get a new RPG.

Why, when nothing interesting has been shown yet? What's there to be psyched for? It's setting and story seem like tired enough, it looks repulsing, it forces us to listen to shit music in it's trailers, and judging by Bioware's last game I'm concerned that they consider gameplay to be a trivial thing in RPG's. It certainly doesn't have any old-school charm about it, and why would it since it's target audience isn't likely to appreciate that.

 

[MetalCraze]

Game with no marketing will not sell good on the mass market no matter what setting it has.

In general, yeah, but there are some exceptions. I just guess that games like FIFA, NBA, etc. are not that heavy on the marketing side, but I may be wrong here, since I don't really care about such games

Why they should be? People just know that they will get the exactly same shit only with better graphics every year.

 

[Alex]

Hmm. I like them. But I don't mind generic settings at all.

All that is important to me is that everything in the setting/world actually has a reason and fits in well. And that seems to be the case here, no matter if half of it was ripped directly from DnD.

And to be perfectly honest, try inventing new undeads that do not remind you of DnD. Not that easy, I guess.

Then why include undead at all? It's not mandatory, no more than dragons or elves or dwarves or medieval pseudo-Europe are.

It isn't mandatory, but why should they shy away from including undead creatures? There are a lot of interesting conflicts one could do with the concept, even if they are always hostile creatures. By breaking the barrier between life and death, the concept of undeath creates many engrossing questions that can be answered though play, such as the amount of humanity found in the new creatures, the conflict (if there is one) between the old and the new self of the deceased (Bioware's version actually implies an even messier conflict here, with the possessing demon influencing, but not controlling, the end result), the new necessities that this condition brings to the creatures, etc.

Different from most people here, I found these examples somewhat interesting (for much the same reasons as Naked Ninja). I think that the reason that most people are so negative about the news isn't the news itself, but rather an unwillingness to believe Bioware could actually have something interesting in this game.

I don't think this is such a bad reason (the last games that they published certainly weren't for the Codexian taste), but most people here seemed to be making fun of the excerpt from the page itself, when there is so very little information there. If you want to bash what you think will be Bioware's implementation of the described monster, then sure, go ahead! But making fun of what we really know about these undead seems to make no sense.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Im 32 and really looking forward to DA.

Well, if people who are over 30 are looking forward to DA, it must really be an awesome game. Is that what you're trying to say?

 

[Applegate's Breasts]

Devouring Corpse, Arcane Horror

They gave Marilyn Manson a cameo in the game as well?

 

[skyway]

Blizzard has created 3 different IPs from scratch

ahahahha

 

[Naked Ninja]

Except that Ultima wasn't really trying to rip off high fantasy. It has a lot of originality in the world construction and backstory. DA offers none.

Lol, what?

Many of us already have. Maybe you should also look towards others who fit your remarks, the indie developers. Or did you just knee-jerk a reply into this thread without being aware of AoD?

Many? Exaggerating much? Most of you do jack-shit beyond complain and throw poop. It's not a lack of ability, it's just that making games isn't anywhere near as fun as ripping them off, amiright?

If the setting doesn't matter, then why not just replay better games?

Use simple logic. Why not just replay old games, you ask? Well, do you lack the ability to get bored of replaying something you've already played before? Cause I don't. I get very bored.

Wizardry, Might and Magic, Ultima, etc. All have an imaginative setting and backstory that at first looks like a standard stock fantasy cliché...up until you figure out more about the setting.

Lol, what? imaginative setting? Might and Magic? It's fantasy...but it's not! It's sci-fi! Oh teh imaginative twist!

So why should we reward BioWare's laziness by throwing money away at them?

What stopped you back in the M&M days? Oh, right, you hadn't developed this rose-tinted nostalgia cloud you live in nowadays.

When a brand new and supposedly original IP offers you Devouring Corpses, Arcane Horrors, and Deep Stalkers, it's hard not to feel some disappointment.

Really? I still like zombies and ravenous undead plenty. Other variations are interesting, certainly, but hostile undead aren't an auto-fail criteria.

Blizzard has created 3 different IPs from scratch and is working on the fourth one.

I'd just like to point out to you that all of Blizzard's IPs are fairly bog standard concepts (High fantasy, Gothic Horror fantasy and standard Sci-fi). To accuse DA of unoriginality then hold up Blizz as an example is silly. They don't really make anything original, they simply offer incredibly polished versions of existing themes and concepts. And I'm fine with that.

Bioshock, a game with a very unique and too detailed for a shooter setting, sold 2.2 mil.

Lol, what? You really need to give gamers slightly more benefit of the doubt Vince, even a teenager can get Bioshock's setting fairly easily.

The Witcher sold over a mil. Needless to say that 99% of the North Americans have no clue who Sapkowski is and never heard about witchers. Gothic is yet another example.

It reaaaalllly isn't hard to get into those two games if you have had ANY exposure to fantasy at all. Sword : check. Monsters to kill : check. People to get quests from : check. Gogogo! Anyone who played a fantasy RPG is going to be able to pick them up fairly easily. They aren't vastly original. Spakowski's books are cool and all but the games aren't that removed from high fantasy.

I think that the reason that most people are so negative about the news isn't the news itself, but rather an unwillingness to believe Bioware could actually have something interesting in this game.

I have an alternate theory. On the Codex complaining has become a competitive sport with the kiddies racing to top each other in the contempt stakes. It's gotten so that many of the members anticipate new posts not for the actual information on offer but for the chance at new entertainment-via-derision. And a developer can't even come along and chat with folks without suffering through a barrage of insults and spite.

 

[Rosh]

Blizzard has created 3 different IPs from scratch

ahahahha

Sorry, but I gotta agree. Originally, they were rip-offs.

Warcraft: High fantasy that started off a bit generic, but later was developed into a somewhat interesting backstory, retcon after retcon after retcon.
StarCraft: Warhammer 40k rip-off.
Diablo: Graphical Rogue-like...in HELL!

 

[Rosh]

Many? Exaggerating much? Most of you do jack-shit beyond complain and throw poop. It's not a lack of ability, it's just that making games isn't anywhere near as fun as ripping them off, amiright?

I can't speak for others, but indie developers do post here. Just like the mainstream posters. Or are we all to have special avatars and titles so people remember?

Use simple logic. Why not just replay old games, you ask? Well, do you lack the ability to get bored of replaying something you've already played before? Cause I don't. I get very bored.

Well, if merely different graphics and widget placement entertains you, then by all means, enjoy!

Lol, what? imaginative setting? Might and Magic? It's fantasy...but it's not! It's sci-fi! Oh teh imaginative twist!

At least it tried harder, years ago, than BioWare does now. The setting backstory was both a neat tie-in between games, as well as giving a setting reason for square maps as a poke at the genre.

What stopped you back in the M&M days? Oh, right, you hadn't developed this rose-tinted nostalgia cloud you live in nowadays.

No, because the games were actually fun to play. Still are, if you like them.

 

[Naked Ninja]

I can't speak for others, but indie developers do post here. Just like the mainstream posters.

Just like the mainstream posters? Oh my, that is amusing. Cause you guys have managed to drive most of those off. You have a few newer developers like Anthony and Markland but I wander how long it will take before they get tired of fending the onslaught and leave, like the others did?

Being repeatedly verbally gang-raped by a bunch of emotionally stunted kids has to lose it's luster over time.

 

[Rosh]

Just like the mainstream posters? Oh my, that is amusing. Cause you guys have managed to drive most of those off. You have a few newer developers like Anthony and Markland but I wander how long it will take before they get tired of fending the onslaught and leave, like the others did?

Being repeatedly verbally gang-raped by a bunch of emotionally stunted kids has to lose it's luster over time.

Well, if you miss the Bethesda folks so badly, go onto their forums, where they will happily lie to you on a regular basis. If devs want to talk about game design and not hype or make excuses, then that is one thing. If they want to bullshit around, they generally get torn apart.