Are you a Storyfag or a Gameplayfag?

[l3loodAngel]

The writting was also there and so was decent combat system (DnD).

Clunky RTwP combat, by far the stickiest pathfinding of the IE RPGs, atrocious encounter design, non-existent resource management, obscenely OP itemization and spell-casting cutscenes...

Pretty standard for DnD. Pathfinding was also pretty standard.
Encouter design is a product of game desing limitations i.e. no mandatory spellcasters. They sacrificed a part of combat for interesting companions which were not not mandatory, I believe it was conscious decision. It also limited opportunities for interesting encounters during mid and early game. However, they were later improved from Curst onwards and boss fights were good for me (Ravel, Cassius, Trias and some lesser beings).

Resource management was dependent on skill level. During my first play trough I found myself constanly dying due to lack of healing and not enough spells as there were places were you couldn't rest. Additionally, you needed a lot of gold to buy items you wanted and shit was really expensive. Like 14k for an acid hammer.
There were few items, but they were good not OP for a 16-20 lvl character if we are not talking about sword of Trias. And the weapon which you could get depended on the amont of money as trash mobs didin't drop divine swords (resource management).

 

[Somberlain]

Pretty standard for DnD. Pathfinding was also pretty standard.

What? Do you mean "pretty standard for IE games" or do you not even know what D&D means? Also, the mentioned stuff was worse in PST than in any other IE game so it wasn't standard.

Encouter design is a product of game desing limitations i.e. no mandatory spellcasters. They sacrificed a part of combat for interesting companions which were not not mandatory, I believe it was conscious decision. It also limited opportunities for interesting encounters during mid and early game. However, they were later improved from Curst onwards and boss fights were good for me (Ravel, Cassius, Trias and some lesser beings).

It was conscious decision to make the game less fun? If you want to make a storyfag game all about writing and interesting companions, don't ruin it with shitty combat. PST has bad gameplay, probably because they thought that you can't sell an RPG with no typical combat & stuff, even if it didn't fit the game at all.

 

[l3loodAngel]

1.What? Do you mean "pretty standard for IE games" or do you not even know what D&D means? Also, the mentioned stuff was worse in PST than in any other IE game so it wasn't standard.



2. It was conscious decision to make the game less fun? If you want to make a storyfag game all about writing and interesting companions, don't ruin it with shitty combat. PST has bad gameplay, probably
3. because they thought that you can't sell an RPG with no typical combat & stuff, even if it didn't fit the game at all.

1. So the animations took longer time to execute. Didin't bother me and somehow other games IE didin't end up being better if you evaluate full package.
2. Less fun for you. Its all about trade offs in life and games. You can't have interesting companions, which are not forced on your party and have a tacticool game. I for one liked getting Ignus in mid game after quests. If your party would have gained him in the beginning it wouldn't have felt gratifying. Also moving Fall from grace to slums so you could just pick her up ASAP would also feel rushed/wrong. You got Annah a thief in slums, which does makes sense. If you force companions from the beginning you might as well scap the good ideas and give party Minsc, Dynaheir and Imoen. I even know a game that did it and BG had one of the best combat encounters to date.
3. Yes, it is well documented that the design team wanted to make Dear Esther form the beginning. However, Fargo and Feargus stepped in at a right time and demanded that they would add combat and so we ended up with PST and they are crying ever since.

 

[Lilura]

Pathfinding was also pretty standard.

My point is that pathfinding was at its worst in PS:T... coupled with the units sticking to each other and being delayed in movement (unpredictably so) this adversely affected the enjoyment of combat; moreso than other IE RPGs.

The portable pop-up was annoying to use and the dedicated combat log was replaced by floating text over the playing field that was barely readable in the heat of combat and then just faded and could not be reviewed. The portraits don't even display status effects...

TNO has Morte and Dak'kon in the early game; Morte, Dak'kon, Annah, Ignus and Grace in the mid-game; and the option of taking Vhailor and Nordom in the late-game. They could have made combat interesting in all of these stages, but they just didn't. The reasons and excuses are irrelevant because they don't change the fact that PS:T's combat encounters are shit.

Curst was a rushed segment of the campaign and incomplete, with hordes of mindless aggro mobbing the party with no variation. It wasn't fun because neither the area design nor the repertoire of TNO and his companions facilitated genuine tactics.

Loot is thrown around like confetti and your companions generally look after their own gear; so apart from tattoos, a set of teeth and an earring they don't want for much.

You can even quaff an infinite number of charms within inventory mode and their effects stack (in the other IE RPGs you could only quaff or use one item per round).

It's a storyfag's RPG... there is nothing to see here for strategists and tacticians (i.e, fans of TRU D&D).

 

[l3loodAngel]

1. My point is that pathfinding was at its worst in PS:T... coupled with the units sticking to each other and being delayed in movement (unpredictably so) this adversely affected the enjoyment of combat; moreso than other IE RPGs.

2.The portable pop-up was annoying to use and the dedicated combat log was replaced by floating text over the playing field that was barely readable in the heat of combat and then just faded and could not be reviewed. The portraits don't even display status effects...

3. TNO has Morte and Dak'kon in the early game; Morte, Dak'kon, Annah, Ignus and Grace in the mid-game; and the option of taking Vhailor and Nordom in the late-game. They could have made combat interesting in all of these stages, but they just didn't. The reasons and excuses are irrelevant because they don't change the fact that PS:T's combat encounters are shit.

4. Curst was a rushed segment of the campaign and incomplete, with hordes of mindless aggro mobbing the party with no variation. It wasn't fun because neither the area design nor the repertoire of TNO and his companions facilitated genuine tactics.

5. Loot is thrown around like confetti and your companions generally look after their own gear; so apart from tattoos, a set of teeth and an earring they don't want for much.

You can even quaff an infinite number of charms within inventory mode and their effects stack (in the other IE RPGs you could only quaff or use one item per round).

6. It's a storyfag's RPG... there is nothing to see here for strategists and tacticians (i.e, fans of TRU D&D).

1. Fair poit, but if the combat was only trash mobs what was there to enjoy?
2. You really needed combat log to see how much dmg you did to trash mobs?
3. Morte was a fighter. Dak'kon was a half mage irc. Yet, non of the companions ware forced. Meaning that you could just go without them. I believe that its incredibly hard to make a tactical combat without hard counters and spellcasting. They used hard counters throught the requirements of magic weapons, but not through spells. Imo encouters are far from the best, but are also far from the worst.
4. Was chalenging for me in my first playthrough. For DnD veterans likely not so much. I agree about repertoire though, but as I have said it is very hard to do without focus on spellcasting, as changing to pitchfork/sword from axe will only add so much depth. Hordes of mindless agro with little relevant variation is the definition of combat in most games. If you come into Goblin cave you aint gona encouter beholders, drow, Yuanti and etc.
5. Anna's armors, weapons, FFG's weapons, armors and etc. There were things to buy. Yes, charms were plenty.
6. Yes story is the main focus, however, the combat and combat system is serviceable. True fans/veterans of DnD would tear through any IE. game on hardest without breaking much sweat. Guys solo Demogorgon FFS.

 

[Atlantico]

I don't see it as an either/or, the story that complements the gameplay and vice versa, is what I'm a fag for.

 

[Llama-Yak Hybrid]

Planescape is bad as a whole I don't know why do you like it in the first place.

 

[l3loodAngel]

Planescape is bad as a whole I don't know why do you like it in the first place.

Besauce mah favorit Dragons AGE 2 was nut inventued ago. And me sur likes Inovashun and Imershun and AAAkshun.

 

[Llama-Yak Hybrid]

Besauce mah favorit Dragons AGE 2 was nut inventued ago. And me sur likes Inovashun and Imershun and AAAkshun.

That's interesting because I've always viewed Planescape as DA2 of its time.

 

[Xzylvador]

That's interesting because I've always viewed Planescape as DA2 of its time.

 

[Llama-Yak Hybrid]

That's interesting because I've always viewed Planescape as DA2 of its time.

Same quality of content, inability of retards praising it to admit that they were wrong, mindnumbingly boring, I wouldn't be surprised if it inspired some serial killer as well.

 

[Xzylvador]

Hm, isn't this normally when someone quotes your join date...

 

[Rake]

Joined: Friday

 

[Llama-Yak Hybrid]

 

[Corporate_Jew_Master]

Story, it's all about the story.

You're too big of a pleb for that avatar. Choose a more fitting one, like Zhakarov.

Also, encounters shaped to fit into the story is the best option. The battlefield, the levelling, the CnC, it must all be interconnected. Else strategic choice of exp point investment, deployment of characters and abilities etc, it all becomes redundant. Powergaming is chink logic, it belongs to jrpgs.

 

[Corporate_Jew_Master]

Pretty standard for DnD. Pathfinding was also pretty standard.

Proud INTJ

Never ends.

 

[Abhay]

Gameplay focused person. Stories in games are added extras, something that helps to immerse the player with the game. If story is really bad then it can be easily overlook if the gameplay is solid and top-notch, but if the gameplay sucks then what good are these stories to a player? Since there are plenty of sources available outside gaming that offer far better experiences in stories to be had. There's no replacement for gameplay related things that allow you to accomplish so much by taking control of the character, which you can't experience in real life.

 

[Sweeper]

The storyfag is immunized against all dangers: One may call him a BioWarefag, Torment shill, CDPR drone, gayforMCA, harbinger of decline, it all runs off him like water off a raincoat. But call him a storyfag and you will be astonished at how he recoils, how injured he is, how he suddenly shrinks back: 'I've been found out.'"

 

[Cryomancer]

I an a immersionfag. And for me, lore > story.

 

[jebsmoker]

I an a immersionfag. And for me, lore > story.

great worldbuilding alongside stellar art design, music, and sound design all go towards making something believable

 

[fantadomat]

Ban all the combatfag degenerates! Because of them we have shit like diablo!

There is plenty games in the top list with poor combat and good story,there is no games with really shit story and good combat!
Thus the story is a lot more important than how good the trashmob cleaning is!

 

[Harthwain]

I think I care more about gameplay than I do care for the story overall (gameplay systems can make for a really good game), but I do like it a lot when the story is good (Legacy of Kain series comes to mind), so I am going to pick the option "OP iz retartet!101".

There is plenty games in the top list with poor combat and good story,there is no games with really shit story and good combat!

Battle Brothers? It doesn't really have "a story" and it's almost entirely combat-focused, and it's pretty good at it.

 

[eilef]

Story is more important to me. If a gameplay is not actively horrible and not ruining my experience of the game, i will like mediocre gameplay with great story way more than great gameplay with average story. Prime example for me is Dishonored 2 and Dishonored: Death of the outsider. Gameplay is good for me. But the story somehow managed to be way worse than in the first game, and Death of the outsider ruined one of the best characters in the franchise for me. They are still good games, but in my free time, i will be replaying Dishonored 1, not D2 and DO.

 

[Lilura]

Ban all the combatfag degenerates!

Spoiler

 

[fantadomat]

Battle Brothers

Sure,it is a decent game,but i won't say that it is one of the great rpgs. It becomes very repetitive after a bunch of battles.