Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Tacgnol]

Pressing the pause button repeatedly, especially in harder fights, doesn't equate to "abusing" the pause button? What does that even mean? You're meant to be able to pause at any time for precisely the reasons you listed above..

You haven't seen Sensuki's Pillars of Eternity test, have you? Pausing the game every tenth of a second. Now THAT is abusing the pause button. :D

On a serious note, in the old IE game you didn't have too many active abilities, so the flow of the game was much better and you didn't have to pause that much. But in new games there are dozens of active abilities for every character, so if you want to be effective, you have to pause a lot. And that is just painful. That's why I also started to like turn based more. RTWP is only good if you don't have too many abilities.

Yeah, I had that issue with Kingmaker. Lots of classes are a bitch to control and micromanage on RTWP, but I ended up really enjoying using them on TB mode as you don't have to constantly stress about what they are getting up to when the game isn't paused.

 

[ItsChon]

On a serious note, in the old IE game you didn't have too many active abilities, so the flow of the game was much better and you didn't have to pause that much. But in new games there are dozens of active abilities for every character, so if you want to be effective, you have to pause a lot. And that is just painful. That's why I also started to like turn based more. RTWP is only good if you don't have too many abilities.

The IE series has been the only series with an acceptable implentation of the RTwP system. This is in contrast to TB, where while the amount of good TB RPGs are also small (I personally think there are only like 10-20 good RPGs, with everything else being a reach) there are varied implementations that are all good. JA2, Underrail, AoD, come to mind, as well as TB blobbers.

Yeah, I had that issue with Kingmaker. Lots of classes are a bitch to control and micromanage on RTWP, but I ended up really enjoying using them on TB mode as you don't have to constantly stress about what they are getting up to when the game isn't paused.

Add that to the list of reasons I thought KM was shit. Combat just isn't satisfying or intuitive like it is in the IE games.

 

[RapineDel]

Turn Based is the only option that would have worked without embarrassment on Stadia so it's pretty obvious that's why they've continued in that direction.

Everything from the Assets to the UI look like they're straight out of Divinity Original Sin 2 which is interesting.

I wonder if Larian started work on the game before Divinity OS 2 shipped and before they'd achieved what you'd say is as close as to mainstream success as they can get. I could see them just wanting to get this game shipped with a good enough reception to keep their reputation intact before moving back to a series where they don't have to share the spoils.

 

[Storyfag]

4 character party limit will be modded out on day-1. Just like they it was in DivOS 2.

What's the point of modding something so fundamental? If it's balanced for a size 4 party, such a mod would obviously break the balance.

Versimilitude is more interesting than balance.

 

[Jimmious]

Watched a bit more again, I'm liking it more and more. Not sure I'd say it's a BG sequel and it could easily have had a different name for me, but all the rolls and systems and verticality etc... Will be fun to play for sure.

 

[Verylittlefishes]

Really, 50 pages from yesterday?

 

[Shadenuat]

Actually why does Initiative work in different manner? Isn't every creature having different Initiative the whole point? They messed up it in DOS2 now again?

 

[Makabb]

that console UI

 

[Salvo]

Finally had time to watch the gameplay. Doesn't look good like BG1/2 BUT at the same time looks better than what modern bioware would do to BG. I will probably purchase the game. The visuals are "dosized" but that is it.

The unique problem is this attacks with 99% of chance to hit. Looks like they are rolling the dice 3 times and picking the higher value...

https://youtu.be/7bRyG5WpIMY

That's the Advantage / Disadvantage mechanic from DnD 5E. Shooting at foes when you are at a higher altitude gives you Advantage, meaning you actually roll TWO D20s and pick the best result. There's even a Feat called Elven Accuracy, which gives you three dices when you have Advantage, so your guess is not far off.

I'm honestly not worried about the mechanics, as it seems they were directly ripped off from the tabletop (good thing aswell), but rather the writing and the fact that Larian is advertising their brand of "humour". Akin to capeshit, having a joke every three phrases makes something LESS funny, not more.

 

[Jimmious]

Actually why does Initiative works in different manner? Isn't every creature having different Initiative the whole point? They messed up it in DOS2 now again?

Yeah that's the only thing that really bugged me. I don't get why they went for team initiative. I don't even get how could that be better even for multiplayer. Who plays first from the team? Is there an internal initiative roll if you are in multiplayer?

 

[Shadenuat]

Also here's on Concentration: https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/2bk746/50_concentrationwhat_is_it_and_how_does_it_work/

• You can concentrate on such a spell for the duration given.
  
  
• Feel free to move about the encounter and take any other actions whilst concentrating.
  
  
• But you can end it at any time at will.
  
  
• You can't concetrate on two Concentration Spells at once.
  
  
• If damaged, Save vs. 10+1/2damage each time damaged.
  
  
• Lose Concentration if Incapacitated e.g. Death, Sleep, severe disorientation etc.

Otiluk Sphere is concentration. Magic Weapon is also concentration. huh.

 

[Tytus]

This isn't an issue for me though.

Yeah that's the problem. It isn't an issue for YOU. But to a learning manboon it is.

You're meant to be able to pause at any time for precisely the reasons you listed above. Plus, many of the things you mentioned can be avoided by turning off party AI, which is what I and I'd assume anyone else who has played IE games for a while does, and microing all your units in the particularly hard boss fights.

Yes, but because of how RTwP is structured the fight basically turns into a gimped version of a TB combat, thus defeating the sense of RTwP in it's entirely.

Wrong, and I'm surprised you don't see the inconsistency in what you typed. A player only has to resort to severe microing with tons of pausing in the hardest fights in the game. When it comes to the low level mobs that are meant to inhabit dungeons, and even the harder mid-level fights that are mini-bosses in the game, you can get away with having party AI on and just taking pauses when it's time to do normal things (switch enemies, cast spells, do special tactics, etc), which does not fit your definition of "heavily abusing the pause button". So using your logic, the game only becomes a "slog" when you're in really hard fights, and said fights are meant to take up a lot of time.

I'm surprised you don't see the biggest issue here. When you have a fight when you don't have resort to severe microing it's a boring trash mob auto-combat most of the time, basically making me fall asleep because I have nothing substantial to do. And in RTwP you have much much more trash mobs. Which is basically wasting my time. And when you encounter something more difficult you can't actually use the full potential a proper TB system would give you. RTwP is marriage of RT and TB giving you the worst features of both of them.

It is a feature mate. That's why it comes down to whether or not people enjoy RTwP or don't.

Yeah the feature should called Worst of Both Worlds.

Plenty of instances in hard, TB games, where fuck ups are due to shit RNG or the nature of your character build.

Character build is on you (thus enforcing my point), and you can't hold RNG shit against TB because you can be fucked by RNG Gods in RTwP aswell. Miss a couple of swings in a row and you might be dead.

kiting is an exploitation of the combat mechanics and shouldn't be used as a strike against the game/combat's quality (plenty of instances of great, TB games, having exploits in their systems). You're making claims but they're rooted in nothing.

It be should used as a strike because exploits only appear if the design itself allows it. And RTwP greatly encourages it. In TB this issue is nullified by the combat instances itself. Because all the enemies in the combat encounter are activated (exception to this is a retardation like Nu-Xcom pods, but that's a separate issue) you don't have such stupid shit like your party murdering two goblins only a room away and the rest of the horde is hearing their screaming and doing nothing because of bad design.

Disagree on a fundamental level. I expect there to be a ton of mobs if I'm fighting my way through Dragon's Eye, as the whole point is Yxuionemi is building up an army to enact her evil plans. It wouldn't feel right if there were only like 20 goblins and five serpent people plus one or two other special mobs that my party had to kill. Same thing applies to countless examples throughout the IE series. Durlag's Tower, Nashkel Mines, Dorn's Depths, etc. Trash mobs become an issue when they're time consuming to deal with, and the combat system isn't good enough to facilitate a player's enjoyment, even when they're in between the really fun combat encounters/quests/plot elements/etc.

You disagree because you are wrong

Sure tons of in situation like that is somewhat explainable but only somewhat. But what isn't explainable being outnumbered greatly in every encounter killing hordes of bandits and monsters before breakfast. It also an appeal to the lowest common denominator. Oh look you are basically a god murdering entire armies all by yourself is the quality writing for brain dead 13 year olds that think power fantasy stories are peak narratives. TB forces the designer/writer to make some excuse how can you fight an army without throwing hundreds of thrash mobs against you. And it's typically handwaves like "it's actually a battle and more fights are going around you" "rest of the army is being distracted somehow and you going to destroy the leadership/McGuffin." It makes the setting and story more grounded, more believable. RTwP encourages sloppy design not only in gameplay but also in the narrative. Thus it will always be inferior.

Lolk. You didn't name any issues, you named personal gripes you might have with RTwP that I, and others that enjoy RTwP, consider necessary and enjoyable aspects of the system.

Lolk. You seem to be unable to look past your personal tastes, and understand that aspects you enjoy about RTwP are inherently inferior to TB. But it's ok. Everyone can have their guilty pleasures

 

[vortex]

I liked the demo. Writing is the most jarring and edgy.
I disliked that vampire self-persuasion check. Wtf was that all about.

 

[Salvo]

Actually why does Initiative works in different manner? Isn't every creature having different Initiative the whole point? They messed up it in DOS2 now again?

Yes, it looks like your party and enemies act as one entity with stacked initiative, which is retarded. It makes every advantage one could gain with initiative (Improved Initiative, Higher Dex) completely useless due to the fact that by the nature of how adventures work, you're going to end up outnumbered most of the time, and each additional enemy is a potential + 1~20 to enemy initiative, while Feats / Perks like "Alert" (the new improved initiative) give like +5.

 

[FranticDistortion]

People who think the following, are the problem;

1. We need a bg sequel.
2. We need an IE game
3. Bg is defined by rtwp gameplay
4. DnD games should be rtwp
5. 3d and verticality (which is a bogus word
Btw) are a deterrent.
6. Party size should be x. Yeah, no.

BG story is over. o effing ver. Get over it. A new D&D game must be turn based because guess what, D&D is turn based. BG was in error to make a round based game. There is nothing wrong with 3D or having actual effect of that 3D which psuedo intellectuals call verticality. It is there in the rules And if it affects gameplay all the better. Party size has to do with gameplay balance. Are encounters designed well wrt a party size? Then that party size should be expected.

You might have concerns about the art direction and writing and mechanics. Those are genuine points. All other nostalgia goggles stuff is pure bs. Get effing over it.

Wizards Of The Coast wanted BG game for Dem dollar bills, so it was happening no matter what. I think Larian was the best case scenario, because alternatives were Obsidian or Inxile. Big win overall.

 

[NJClaw]

People who think the following, are the problem;

1. We need a bg sequel.
2. We need an IE game
3. Bg is defined by rtwp gameplay
4. DnD games should be rtwp
5. 3d and verticality (which is a bogus word
Btw) are a deterrent.
6. Party size should be x. Yeah, no.

BG story is over. o effing ver. Get over it. A new D&D game must be turn based because guess what, D&D is turn based. BG was in error to make a round based game. There is nothing wrong with 3D or having actual effect of that 3D which psuedo intellectuals call verticality. It is there in the rules And if it affects gameplay all the better. Party size has to do with gameplay balance. Are encounters designed well wrt a party size? Then that party size should be expected.

You might have concerns about the art direction and writing and mechanics. Those are genuine points. All other nostalgia goggles stuff is pure bs. Get effing over it.

Yeah man, because 3d doesn't impact the art direction. Sure.

 

[ScrotumBroth]

This looks like DA:I and judging by the first dialogue quality the pinnacle will again be fucking a bull person.

 

[Tytus]

This looks like DA:I and judging by the first dialogue quality the pinnacle will again be fucking a bull person.

At least it's not Witcher 3 dialogue system. Pick one or max two responses or ask more about the issue.

BG3 actually seem to give a little more room for roleplaying.

 

[Efe]

was able to watch 5 minutes until russian military started bombing ours in idlib and government literally shut down internet...

 

[Riddler]

4 character party limit will be modded out on day-1. Just like they it was in DivOS 2.

And completely break any semblance of balance and encounter design.

 

[conan_edw]

70 pages in a day? that's very hard to catch on. Anyway, it doesn't seem to have anything to resemble Baldur's Gate so I don't know why did they bother with using it rather than having their own ip in FR. With that said, I'm really impressed with what I saw, I'm not that of a fan of BG anyway.
The writing doesn't seem to be that interesting but I really didn't care that much either, the gameplay really seem to be solid. Sneaking in D:OS wasn't that useful and I really like the new system. The dynamism and environmental interactions seem to also be a steup up from D:OS, and most importantly now we have a way better ruleset that's faithfully implemented. I may not be in the majority here but I really prefer the 3D environment with verticality, I think they add a lot to the gameplay.
As much as I hate Early Access but I will get into this day one :D, it could the most excited I have been for an upcoming game.

 

[J_C]

was able to watch 5 minutes until russian military started bombing ours in idlib and government literally shut down internet...

That is a bit harsh reaction to this gameplay reveal, don't you think? I mean, it's a bit disappointing, but bombing people because of it?

Anyway, it doesn't seem to have anything to resemble Baldur's Gate so I don't know why did they bother with using it

Brand recognition.

 

[fantadomat]

This looks like DA:I and judging by the first dialogue quality the pinnacle will again be fucking a bull person.

At least it's not Witcher 3 dialogue system. Pick one or max two responses or ask more about the issue.

BG3 actually seem to give a little more room for roleplaying.

LoL witcher 3 dialogue is light years ahead of this shit. here you don't even know if it is a dialogue option or some inner monologue option,it is even worst than the sarcastic fallout 4 shit. At least in fallout 4 you do know that you will say something.

 

[Tytus]

4 character party limit will be modded out on day-1. Just like they it was in DivOS 2.

And completely break any semblance of balance and encounter design.

This is what you get for making a BG3 w 4 character party game just so you can include the DivOS 2 multiplayer.

 

[Tytus]

That is a bit harsh reaction to this gameplay reveal, don't you think? I mean, it's a bit disappointing, but bombing people because of it?

They wanted to prevent the disappointment.