Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Cryomancer]

Baldur's Gate 2 starts already on the epic note in the intro, by establishing you as a son of a literal god. God of Murder on top of that. And the Hero of Baldur's Gate. Then you fight for a control over a city (more or less), break out from the mage-prison for the strongest known mages, see/fight creatures from other planes (the Githyanki), go through the Underdark, fight dragons along the way...

And BG3 doesn't start epic? Mindflayer spelljammer ship fighting dragon riders army is prety epic IMO.



Anyway, what part of Faerun the chapter 1 happens?

Would be amazing if we can see a little of Thay on BG3

 

[Harthwain]

And BG3 doesn't start epic? Mindflayer spelljammer ship fighting dragon riders army is prety epic IMO.

If BG2 starts epic, then why BG3 starting epic (even more so than BG2, one could say) is suddenly a problem?

 

[Cryomancer]

And BG3 doesn't start epic? Mindflayer spelljammer ship fighting dragon riders army is prety epic IMO.

If BG2 starts epic, then why BG3 starting epic (even more so than BG2, one could say) is suddenly a problem?

Din't said that is a problem. But you go from lv 1 to 10 on BG3, BG2 from 8 to 17~21(depending the class)

 

[Thac0]

And BG3 doesn't start epic? Mindflayer spelljammer ship fighting dragon riders army is prety epic IMO.

If BG2 starts epic, then why BG3 starting epic (even more so than BG2, one could say) is suddenly a problem?

Din't said that is a problem. But you go from lv 1 to 10 on BG3, BG2 from 8 to 17~21(depending the class)

Oof Illithids are pretty high to use as a BBEG against a 4 man level 10 party. A single Elder Brain is a deadly challenge (a hard bossfight thats decently winnable with good builds) for 4 lvl 10s, and the colonies have those surrounded by dozens of mooks.
I hope they dont let us fully resolve the Illithid plot at level 10 but not resolving it in the same game would be kind of a dickmove aswell. They have written themselves into a corner by using Illithids and level 10 cap.

 

[Cryomancer]

They have written themselves into a corner by using Illithids and level 10 cap.

And putting dragons in the initial cutscene. It creates expectancy. You don't fight dragons on BG1. Probably they will nerf Illithids and probably wrote the history without thinking on the gameplay(is a fault that over 99% of modern game devs commit, they don't care about making game mechanics a good reflection of game lore)

PS : I know that Illithids, liches and dragons aren't deadly as on 3.5e and 2e but still...

PS 2 : Dragons Dogma is one of the few games which did dragon fights right. They have a lot of nasty abilities.

 

[J_C]

They have written themselves into a corner by using Illithids and level 10 cap.

And putting dragons in the initial cutscene. It creates expectancy. You don't fight dragons on BG1. Probably they will nerf Illithids and probably wrote the history without thinking on the gameplay(is a fault that over 99% of modern game devs commit, they don't care about making game mechanics a good reflection of game lore)

PS : I know that Illithids, liches and dragons aren't deadly as on 3.5e and 2e but still...

PS 2 : Dragons Dogma is one of the few games which did dragon fights right. They have a lot of nasty abilities.

I blame current gamers. You can't give them a real low level campaign, every game has to be a massive explosionfest, where you are the biggest hero. You have to start with killing a dragon in the first game. And yeah, it sucks.

 

[Thac0]

They have written themselves into a corner by using Illithids and level 10 cap.

And putting dragons in the initial cutscene. You don't fight dragons on BG1. Probably they will nerf Illithids and probably wrote the history without thinking on the gameplay(is a fault that over 99% of modern game devs commit, they don't care about making game mechanics a good reflection of game lore)

And Adult Black Dragon is in the same danger category as an Elder Brain (both CR 14) in 5e. You could kill a dragon as the final boss of the game, since unlike Illithids dragons fight allone and dont make the fight infinitly harder by using thralls.

But I think the route they will take is that they make the protagonists super overpowered for level 10 due to the influence of the maggots compared to the normal world. A bit like in Planescape:Torment where the Nameless One gets permanent attribute upgrades, armor class upgrades and extra attacks thrown after him at every opportunity because of his background.

I personally dont mind too much since power fantasies are fun as long as the game has a hard difficulty, but i can see why it would turn some people off.

 

[Lacrymas]

Oof Illithids are pretty high to use as a BBEG against a 4 man level 10 party. A single Elder Brain is a deadly challenge (a hard bossfight thats decently winnable with good builds) for 4 lvl 10s, and the colonies have those surrounded by dozens of mooks.
I hope they dont let us fully resolve the Illithid plot at level 10 but not resolving it in the same game would be kind of a dickmove aswell. They have written themselves into a corner by using Illithids and level 10 cap.

I'm hoping the illithid thing is a red herring. I really have no idea where they are thinking of taking this, but I feel like it's nowhere good or lore-friendly.

 

[Cryomancer]

I blame current gamers. You can't give them a real low level campaign, every game has to be a massive explosionfest, where you are the biggest hero. You have to start with killing a dragon in the first game. And yeah, it sucks.

Well, if the game is 100 hours long, you should only have a change to take out a adult dragon at around 75 hours playtime.

Being strong is far more satisfying if you experienced being weak... Gothic 1/2/3 does it amazingly well.

I personally dont mind too much since power fantasies are fun as long as the game has a hard difficulty, but i can see why it would turn some people off.

I love when crazy stuff exists but the player doesn't have monopoly over this crazy stuff. Imagine if only you could use .45-70 brush guns on new vegas and other powerful firearms. The game will be boring...

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For me, they should raise the level cap AT LEAST to 12~15. IS not that crazy high where you can solve 99% of problems with a Wish spell but is a solid pick to have some chance with a lot of help from NPC's against a elder brain.

Also, fighters will probably hit level 5 on chapter 2. From that to the end game, they will only have two attacks per turn.

 

[Thac0]

I blame current gamers. You can't give them a real low level campaign, every game has to be a massive explosionfest, where you are the biggest hero. You have to start with killing a dragon in the first game. And yeah, it sucks.

Well, if the game is 100 hours long, you should only have a change to take out a adult dragon at around 75 hours playtime.

Being strong is far more satisfying if you experienced being weak... Gothic 1/2/3 does it amazingly well.

I personally dont mind too much since power fantasies are fun as long as the game has a hard difficulty, but i can see why it would turn some people off.

I love when crazy stuff exists but the player doesn't have monopoly over this crazy stuff. Imagine if only you could use .45-70 brush guns on new vegas and other powerful firearms. The game will be boring...

------------------------------------

For me, they should raise the level cap AT LEAST to 12~15. IS not that crazy high where you can solve 99% of problems with a Wish spell but is a solid pick to have some chance with a lot of help from NPC's against a elder brain.

Also, fighters will probably hit level 5 on chapter 2. From that to the end game, they will only have two attacks per turn.

Level 12 would be a really good breakpoint, since at level 13 you get spells like Teleport which start to unravel the game a bit and the gameplay really begins to change. Being restricted to 6th level casting means the meanest spell you will unleash is a Desintegration. Thats fine.
Lets hope they change their mind.

 

[Fedora Master]

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

 

[Thac0]

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

Yes, Chaotic Command shuts most of their bullshit down.
https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Chaotic_Commands
Also there are enough magic resistance items to make them annoying but beatable.

 

[Cryomancer]

Level 12 would be a really good breakpoint, since at level 13 you get spells like Teleport which start to unravel the game a bit and the gameplay really begins to change. Being restricted to 6th level casting means the meanest spell you will unleash is a Desintegration. Thats fine.

Teleport and other spells are rarely adapted into CRPGs. On DDO, it is just a "cost free" fast travel, it can't save your skin or be used on quests, even dimensional door is just a QoL utility spell... Note that the usage of high tier magic on 5e is far more limtied than 3.5e, a lv 20 wizard can cast a wish. a lv 20 3.5e wizard can cast 4 wishes per long rest.

lvl 10 is a bit weird in the context of D&D, I suggest 9.

Why 9? Dark Sun : Shattered Lands? The final battle of that game was a pain in the ***.

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

Stop Time or like i call : ZA WARUDO!!!

 

[Lacrymas]

Lvl 10 in 5E is an ok breakpoint since basically all classes get something special then. D&D is best played low-level.

 

[Fedora Master]

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

Yes, Chaotic Command shuts most of their bullshit down.
https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Chaotic_Commands
Also there are enough magic resistance items to make them annoying but beatable.

That's disabling them directly, but there's no spell that defends against brain sucking directly right?

 

[Shadenuat]

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

drinking potions of Int/Genius theoretically should slow it down and give you some extra rounds?

 

[Cryomancer]

D&D is best played low-level.

Not true. If D&D is kobold/bandit slaying on sword coast, yep. If is epic adventures, like trying to escape the 6th layer of Carceri, then dealing with devils on city of embers and eventually getting involved into the blood war and so on, no, D&D is not best played at low levels. HotU is considered better than NWN1 and is epic level. MoTB is the best expansion to NWN2 and high to epic level too.

Keep in mind that descend to arvenus goes up to lv 13.

 

[vonAchdorf]

Lvl 10 in 5E is an ok breakpoint since basically all classes get something special then. D&D is best played low-level.

I prefer low-level play in all RPGs, but especially D&D always had a fan base who liked epic high(est) level gameplay.

 

[Lacrymas]

Just like I said, best played at low levels.

HotU and MotB aren't good because they are high level, the high levels actually detract from the experience.

 

[Thac0]

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

Yes, Chaotic Command shuts most of their bullshit down.
https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Chaotic_Commands
Also there are enough magic resistance items to make them annoying but beatable.

That's disabling them directly, but there's no spell that defends against brain sucking directly right?

Chaotic Command despite the strange name is a priest spell that shields you from all of their stuns and stuff. It makes killing them very fast very easy.
I dont think there is a way to counter the draining despite just high defenses and killing them fast. Summons help. I waltzed through them with a hasted and mind shielded Minsk without major problems.

 

[Fedora Master]

You know, I thought about my BG2 experience... And I never figured out how to prevent Illithids from brainsucking Minsc to death. Is there even a defense against that attack in BG2 other than summoning hordes of skeletons/cloud spells?

Yes, Chaotic Command shuts most of their bullshit down.
https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Chaotic_Commands
Also there are enough magic resistance items to make them annoying but beatable.

That's disabling them directly, but there's no spell that defends against brain sucking directly right?

Chaotic Command despite the strange name is a priest spell that shields you from all of their stuns and stuff. It makes killing them very fast very easy.
I dont think there is a way to counter the draining despite just high defenses and killing them fast. Summons help. I waltzed through them with a hasted and mind shielded Minsk without major problems.

Oh right I was thinking of Chaos and Confusion spells, my bad

 

[Fedora Master]

Just like I said, best played at low levels.

HotU and MotB aren't good because they are high level, the high levels actually detract from the experience.

Those games also don't turn spellcasters into Literal Gods because the versatility of magic just isn't there.
Still, it's fun to blast assholes with Isaacs Greater Missile Storm

 

[Gargaune]

It kick off with meeting elminster after escaping candlekeep and searching for a contact with the harpers.

Ehh, sort of. Technically speaking, you meet an "Old Man" with a peculiar speech mannerism. If the player catches on to who that is, that's a different story.

Baldur's Gate 2 starts already on the epic note in the intro, by establishing you as a son of a literal god. God of Murder on top of that. And the Hero of Baldur's Gate. Then you fight for a control over a city (more or less), break out from the mage-prison for the strongest known mages, see/fight creatures from other planes (the Githyanki), go through the Underdark, fight dragons along the way...

It's a direct sequel, featuring the same protagonist, and that's precisely why I mentioned it as "even Baldur's Gate 2" - a campaign where you've been established as "a son of a literal god" and the "Hero of Baldur's Gate", and it still has a somewhat more subdued introduction. You start off as the prisoner of a strange, powerful mage, move on to sign up with an organized crime outfit, and the more outlandish stuff you mention comes as you progress through the game.

Most of those plots I mentioned, when looked on in their entirety, have a gradual escalation to their stakes and circumstances to match your mechanical growth with the narrative progression and keep things interesting. BG3, however, looks like it will introduce content of a more extraordinary nature right off the starting line. I've seen Schumacher make slower starts and I worry Larian might try and cram in too much "awesome" stuff all at once and make it the opposite of awesome.

 

[Cryomancer]

HotU and MotB aren't good because they are high level, the high levels actually detract from the experience.

How do you plan to make a history about a key figure send to solve a bloody war between drows in underdark where one of then control a archdevil, then the charname needs to escape the 8th circle of hell to stop a prince of hell, and can kill single handily a mindflayer colony, a beholder army, a demilich and a dracolich strange cult without making him epic strong?

The power of friendship? Nerfing the mephistopheles to the level of a kobold?

 

[Lacrymas]

HotU and MotB aren't good because they are high level, the high levels actually detract from the experience.

How do you plan to make a history about a key figure send to solve a bloody war between drows in underdark where one of then control a archdevil, then the charname needs to escape the 8th circle of hell to stop a prince of hell, and can kill single handily a mindflayer colony, a beholder army, a demilich and a dracolich strange cult without making him epic strong?

I don't plan on doing that and wouldn't do it. Sounds terrible.