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Torment Beamdog's Planescape: Torment Enhanced Edition

Deleted Member 16721

Guest
I don't remember the character outlines in the earlier EEs (maybe they were introduced in Siege of Dragonspear which I haven't played yet) but I honestly think they look good and are an improvement in this one. I've spent a bit of time playing with the outlines both on and off, and I have to say that I prefer them on. When zoomed out the characters "pop" out of the screen a bit more, in a good way. Flame away but that is my honest opinion while I am playing the game. :)
 

Urthor

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Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
So I missed 48 pages, is this enhanced edition pretty much what Enhanced Edition always should have been, a UI reskin with modern hotkeys and better resolutions and nothing more, or have they done the usual Beamdog thing and slipped in a sheep-kin bisexual party member who is a mandatory companion for a portion of the story arc
 

Deleted Member 16721

Guest
So I missed 48 pages, is this enhanced edition pretty much what Enhanced Edition always should have been, a UI reskin with modern hotkeys and better resolutions and nothing more, or have they done the usual Beamdog thing and slipped in new content?

No new content at all, adds some convenience things. All the Enhanced features can be turned off if you want.
 

Junmarko

† Cristo è Re †
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When you put your logo and only your logo on something you claim ownership of it. That's where they take credit for something they didn't do.

Isn't this a result of WotC dangling the license around after it expired though? If Beamdog didn't pick it up, it'd probably be in the hands of Atari or EA.

They are known for sharky behaviour, that's why we barely see developers using D&D Settings any more.
 

Fairfax

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2015
Messages
3,518
CA - The original name was “Last Rites,” but it didn’t pass marketing (if I recall – it may have been b/c of a name conflict with something else, but it’s been so long, I don’t remember).

Probably because of this game:

 

Luckmann

Arcane
Zionist Agent
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Scandinavia
Julius Borisov has answered with some bullshit PR talk why they won't credit Black Isle: http://steamcommunity.com/app/46630...47030858/?tscn=1490814082#c135512931349368796
Julius Borisov said:
There're legal reasons why the store pages on Steam and on GoG.com only list Beamdog. We can't disclose more information on this front.

As I've mentioned here Bethesda somehow didn't have such problems. aVENGER puts on a brave face but he knows he works in a pathetic, parasitic company. What's annoying me the most is that Chris Avellone is taking part in this scam. Truly shameful display, going from a CCO to this.

Guess he felt that it was inevitable that Parasitedog will cash in on PST so he thought why not siphon some into my own pockets?

:mca:
Integrity?

:negative:
When you put your logo and only your logo on something you claim ownership of it. That's where they take credit for something they didn't do.

Isn't this a result of WotC dangling the license around after it expired though? If Beamdog didn't pick it up, it'd probably be in the hands of Atari or EA.

They are known for sharky behaviour, that's why we barely see developers using D&D Settings any more.
I'd even take EA over Beamdog. EA is at least competent in their evil.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

coldcrow

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1,717
You retards the original is more blurred and the EE is sharper, it is better
Are you a moron?
The data is rendered in 640x480 pixels, there is no way around it. Those screens only look as sharp because they display the pixels in the correct size for a 1920x1080 res. Hence you see three times the area. The original looked as sharp on a fucking 15" 640x480 monitor.
fucking retard troll
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
character outlines in the earlier EEs (maybe they were introduced in Siege of Dragonspear which I haven't played yet)

Intro'd in SoD, yeah. I dislike them but they can be turned off so there is no cause for complaint.
 

aVENGER

Arcane
Developer
Joined
Jan 26, 2007
Messages
218
I see a lot of people asking the question: "So if Beamdog didn't alter the story or the gameplay of Planescape: Torment, what did they work on for the EE?". A couple of notes in that regard.

First, PST used a very unique version of the Infinity Engine. Its codebase branched off even before BG1 was released, meaning that a lot of underlying systems were radically different from those present in BG2, IWD and by extension, our EE version of the engine. In particular, the PST spell system is nothing like the systems seen in the other IE games. It took us literally months of day and night effort just to get the spells to work properly in our version of the engine, especially given the fact that they were programmed solely for the 640x480 resolution. On top of all that, the PST spell system had a number of hardcoded features such as making specific spells function differently on certain planes (try casting Heal on Carceri or Baator and see how that turns out) so we had to painstakingly reconstruct them using the original source code and design documents.

Next, we had to rebuild the UI from scratch since it too was very different from what the other IE games used. Reconstructing all aspects of the UI for a native 4K resolution while retaining the original look and feel was a big challenge. We consulted Tim Donley (the original Lead Artist) and Eric Campanella (the original 3D modeler) to ensure that the style and tone of our UI remained faithful to the original game. In addition, we had Chris Avellone review and approve every single UI screen before it became final. The code for the PST UI was also very different from what the other IE games used (i.e. animated portraits that change as party members get hurt) so making that work required quite a bit of effort as well.

Lastly, the scripting language that PST used is fairly different from that of the other IE games. Meaning that we had to implement all of the PST-specific engine functionality related to NPC AI behavior into our engine and then test it thoroughly to ensure that nothing unintentionally broke due to the vast differences in the codebase. To make sure that everything went right, we had QA repeatedly test and re-test every single quest, item, spell and area in the game. In the end, I instructed QA to do side-by-side playthroughs comparing the original PST to PST:EE to ensure that no unintentional changes were made. There's a lot more that we did beyond what was mentioned here, but this should give you a rough idea of the PST:EE development process.

TL;DR
The codebase of the original PST was vastly different compared to the other IE games. We couldn't just take the story of PST and slap it into the SoD engine, it took us months and months of hard work to get everything working properly.
 
Last edited:

Junmarko

† Cristo è Re †
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I'd even take EA over Beamdog. EA is at least competent in their evil.
Yeah, we'd have a fucking pay-to-win, Planescape MMO. You think that is better than getting a Director's Cut? :|

Julius Borisov has answered with some bullshit PR talk why they won't credit Black Isle: http://steamcommunity.com/app/46630...47030858/?tscn=1490814082#c135512931349368796
Julius Borisov said:
There're legal reasons why the store pages on Steam and on GoG.com only list Beamdog. We can't disclose more information on this front.

As I've mentioned here Bethesda somehow didn't have such problems. aVENGER puts on a brave face but he knows he works in a pathetic, parasitic company. What's annoying me the most is that Chris Avellone is taking part in this scam. Truly shameful display, going from a CCO to this.

Guess he felt that it was inevitable that Parasitedog will cash in on PST so he thought why not siphon some into my own pockets?

:mca:
Integrity?

:negative:

Wow. Who were you calling "parasites" before? Fuck me...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
Heal on rest option: Makes resting more convenient.

This is a newbie feature that should have never been added to the Infinity Engine (BG2 and IWD added it and now it's in PST:EE).

It trivializes consumable use and Grace healbotting; plus TNO (and later Dak'kon) can regenerate. There is no need for it.

But here's a Q: is TNO regen in EE faithful to the original; as in, regen like a troll at high con scores?
Did you eliminate infinite consumable use in inventory mode?
 

aVENGER

Arcane
Developer
Joined
Jan 26, 2007
Messages
218
Heal on rest option: Makes resting more convenient.

That's turned off by default. You have to manually turn it on if you want to use it.

But here's a Q: is TNO regen in EE faithful to the original; as in, regen like a troll at high con scores?
Did you eliminate infinite consumable use in inventory mode?

No changes were made to TNOs regeneration or to the way item use functions. As I've said before, the gameplay in PST:EE is exactly the same as it was in the original PST.
 

mastroego

Arcane
Joined
Apr 10, 2013
Messages
10,407
Location
Italy
Beamdog already re-published a beloved game and injected SJW crap into it.
I don't care what they're doing now - whatever it is, I just hope it doesn't sell.

Also the game can be perfectly played already.

Just my humble take, to each their own.
Cheers.
 

Junmarko

† Cristo è Re †
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Beamdog already re-published a beloved game and injected SJW crap into it.
I don't care what they're doing now - whatever it is, I just hope it doesn't sell.

Also the game can be perfectly played already.

Just my humble take, to each their own.
Cheers.
I haven't bought any of these Enhanced Editions, so I don't know the specifics. But wasn't all that crap in SoD - their pointless "inter-quel" thing?
 

mastroego

Arcane
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Beamdog already re-published a beloved game and injected SJW crap into it.
I don't care what they're doing now - whatever it is, I just hope it doesn't sell.

Also the game can be perfectly played already.

Just my humble take, to each their own.
Cheers.
I haven't bought any of these Enhanced Editions, so I don't know the specifics. But wasn't all that crap in SoD - their pointless "inter-quel" thing?
Could be, not sure. Details.
Still they unveiled their agenda (besides parasitism, that is).
 

Junmarko

† Cristo è Re †
Patron
Joined
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Messages
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Beamdog already re-published a beloved game and injected SJW crap into it.
I don't care what they're doing now - whatever it is, I just hope it doesn't sell.

Also the game can be perfectly played already.

Just my humble take, to each their own.
Cheers.
I haven't bought any of these Enhanced Editions, so I don't know the specifics. But wasn't all that crap in SoD - their pointless "inter-quel" thing?
Could be, not sure. Details.
Still they unveiled their agenda (besides parasitism, that is).
Yeah I agree, I was on board with everyone during that.

But, all the people who were responsible left the company - apparently. The rest have done a 180 in their approach to this. Yeah, maintain scepticism - but also give credit where it is due. If their next project is as insulting as SoD, then act appropriately.

It makes no sense doing it here though if you actually care about this game and the people from Black Isle who gave that company it's reputation. Whether Beamdog took the logo off because of W.o.t.C or whatever, doesn't matter, as it's outweighed by them getting MCA to lead the project.

If anyone disagrees, then I'm not sure on what you could possibly define "Black Isle".
 
Last edited:

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,259
I see a lot of people asking the question: "So if Beamdog didn't alter the story or the gameplay of Planescape: Torment, what did they work on for the EE?". A couple of notes in that regard.

First, PST used a very unique version of the Infinity Engine. Its codebase branched off even before BG1 was released, meaning that a lot of underlying systems were radically different from those present in BG2, IWD and by extension, our EE version of the engine. In particular, the PST spell system is nothing like the systems seen in the other IE games. It took us literally months of day and night effort just to get the spells to work properly in our version of the engine, especially given the fact that they were programmed solely for the 640x480 resolution. On top of all that, the PST spell system had a number of hardcoded features such as making specific spells function differently on certain planes (try casting Heal on Carceri or Baator and see how that turns out) so we had to painstakingly reconstruct them using the original source code and design documents.

Next, we had to rebuild the UI from scratch since it too was very different from what the other IE games used. Reconstructing all aspects of the UI for a native 4K resolution while retaining the original look and feel was a big challenge. We consulted Tim Donley (the original Lead Artist) and Eric Campanella (the original 3D modeler) to ensure that the style and tone of our UI remained faithful to the original game. In addition, we had Chris Avellone review and approve every single UI screen before it became final. The code for the PST UI was also very different from what the other IE games used (i.e. animated portraits that change as party members get hurt) so making that work required quite a bit of effort as well.

Lastly, the scripting language that PST used is fairly different from that of the other IE games. Meaning that we had to implement all of the PST-specific engine functionality related to NPC AI behavior into our engine and then test it thoroughly to ensure that nothing unintentionally broke due to the vast differences in the codebase. To make sure that everything went right, we had QA repeatedly test and re-test every single quest, item, spell and area in the game. In the end, I instructed QA to do side-by-side playthroughs comparing the original PST to PST:EE to ensure that no unintentional changes were made. There's a lot more that we did beyond what was mentioned here, but this should give you a rough idea of the PST:EE development process.

TL;DR
The codebase of the original PST was vastly different compared to the other IE games. We couldn't just take the story of PST and slap it into the SoD engine, it took us months and months of hard work to get everything working properly.
All that work while few mods give the most important improvement making all that work obsolete. If only you didn't force people to buy your version of PST, maybe 'Dex would leave you alone.
 

FeelTheRads

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2008
Messages
13,716
I appreciate the answer, even if I consider all that work pointless, but I will say that you praise quite a lot what you did in a year. Maybe you should tell us how many of you worked on it so at least one can sympathize. Because PST was done in a year or so. Doing a mod in a year, by paid people, doesn't really impress.
 
Last edited:

Lacrymas

Arcane
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Messages
18,729
Pathfinder: Wrath
Yeah, all that hard work sounds really pointless. To truly "enhance" PS:T you have to fix the combat. More resolutions and a new UI are trivial surface things. If PS:T came with good combat and encounters it would be mindblowing.
 

Falksi

Arcane
Joined
Feb 14, 2017
Messages
11,022
Location
Nottingham
Yeah, all that hard work sounds really pointless. To truly "enhance" PS:T you have to fix the combat. More resolutions and a new UI are trivial surface things. If PS:T came with good combat and encounters it would be mindblowing.

Boom, nail on the head.
I've tried for years to get into it, but the combat is just so spazzy it puts me off too much to continue.
Fair play to those who can ignore it, but I can't unfortunately.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
Look at it this way... the pathing routine has been improved to +Siege of Dragonspear lvls; which is to say, the best the IE has seen. There was no point making a tactics or SCS mod with the original's shitty pathing routine. Now, there just might be.
 

aVENGER

Arcane
Developer
Joined
Jan 26, 2007
Messages
218
Look at it this way... the pathing routine has been improved to +Siege of Dragonspear lvls; which is to say, the best the IE has seen. There was no point making a tactics or SCS mod with the original's shitty pathing routine. Now, there just might be.

There are a couple of reasons why PST:EE should be easier to mod than the original game. First off, it's built on top of the engine that was used for the other EE games (though PST:EE uses a more advanced version) which means that modders can access the game's mechanics a bit more easily. In addition, they will automatically benefit from all of the inherent engine improvements like the advanced scripting language (which enables more complex AI behavior) and the improved pathfinding code that you mentioned.

Second, unlike the original game, PST:EE comes with a fully functional debug console. This makes it much easier for modders to test their content in-game prior to releasing it to the public.
 

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