Bethesda Releases Concept Art

[Mech]

its called "inspiration" in some circles...

It's called copying when you release it publically for profit. And yes, they're selling this game.

just because the concept art is derived from (or even partially copied from)

Try "traced with see-through paper".

another source doesnt mean the final product will be the same...

Then why did they release it?

it could simply be used as a stepping stone... *shrug*

You don't release stepping stones, you release finished concepts. That was a finished concept, with no body detail for effect.

You seem to know an aweful lot about what Bethesda does and is doing.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Just received this email from the real Pete Hines. He was responding to my question as to whether he has been posting over at rpgcodex recently.

**********

I may have created an account there at some point, but I haven't posted anything in the last few months, so I'd have to say imposter.

I get the impression a number of posters have a pretty well informed opinion of me and aren't interested in what I have to say over there.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Xxxxxxxxxx [mailtoxxxxxx@insightbb.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 4:07 PM
To: Pete Hines
Subject: Is it you?

Pete:

Have you been posting on the rpgcodex site? If not, there is someone impersonating you? Can you verify?

*******************************

*sign* Did you really believe that Pete would refer to TES fans as groveling and whining? Come on.

Edit: The subject is "is it you?" *rolls eyes*

 

[Chefe]

You seem to know an aweful lot about what Bethesda does and is doing.

You seem to know an awful lot about being an annoying, irrelevant fuck.

 

[WormGod]

I would just point you all to the Oblivion forums, but since you are direct haters of it, I will just repeat it here....

I did that concept. You claim it to be a ripoff? Hate to burst your bubble, but no, it's not. I used that great original piece as a reference since it was exactly what I was going for (hell, I even have the poster). Yes, the head is quite close, and for good reason. That head is just what I was aiming for. You are really barking up a cat-less tree if you think I used any other parts of that original work as reference though. Trust me, as artists, we are well tuned knowing copyright laws and copying isnt something that we shrug off. Knowing the limits to using a "reference" is something else we know much about. believe me, if I had the rights to that original piece, I would have loved to have used it in that 100% form that you claim it to be.

 

[Bosco]

I would just point you all to the Oblivion forums, but since you are direct haters of it, I will just repeat it here....

I did that concept. You claim it to be a ripoff? Hate to burst your bubble, but no, it's not. I used that great original piece as a reference since it was exactly what I was going for (hell, I even have the poster). Yes, the head is quite close, and for good reason. That head is just what I was aiming for. You are really barking up a cat-less tree if you think I used any other parts of that original work as reference though. Trust me, as artists, we are well tuned knowing copyright laws and copying isnt something that we shrug off. Knowing the limits to using a "reference" is something else we know much about. believe me, if I had the rights to that original piece, I would have loved to have used it in that 100% form that you claim it to be.

Yes, we noticed your very distinctive change from the original, which was tilting the wings upwards slightly.

 

[Pete]

Don't let them get to you, Gary.

 

[Bosco]

Don't let them get to you, Gary.

Us or lawyers?

 

[Zomg]

Hello hair splitting. We don't care if you get sued for copyright infringement, we care if you lazily snagged an art element from someone else's work.

Edit - I retard-spelled copyright several years ago and it has been sitting here wrong the whole time.

 

[Whipporowill]

Gee, that head is pretty much exactly the head of the original - or the refererence as you refer to it as. I'd say the overall concept is the basic same creature - albeit apart from the head, they're different renditions of the same "concept" - of an imp, daemon or what be it. You, as an artist, claiming to know that you know this and that about copyright et c - it's still not considered good manners to copy someone else's concept so blatantly, in a commercial matter at that. You're basically saying that taking even parts of someone else's vision and calling it yours, or your companys, is ok? Nice!

 

[Drakron]

Well WormGod if you like we can go back to bitching about spears being taken out because you "did not like doing animations that would not be used" ... but that was last month I think.

 

[HanoverF]

Reading "Bethesda Releases Concept Art" I thought maybe it was Fallout3 concept art, surely they aren't realeasing concept art of Oblivious, that ship has sailed...
:shock:

 

[HardCode]

I'm no expert, but those two images look damn the same. Drawing it in crayon the same as the original shouldn't make it a new concept.

 

[MrSmileyFaceDude]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

 

[Bosco]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

The concept of "it's still lazy art element snagging" seems to be lost on certain people with the name of a certain company under their avatars.

 

[Whipporowill]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

Well, behind closed doors you can have a picture of a bottle of coke as your "concept art" if you mighty well feel like it, but having it as a piece of marketing material, which you can't deny it's being used as - it sort of steps (leaps/skitters/flutters or whatever concept art does) over that concept borderline and turns into something else entirely, I'd say.

 

[Balor]

He-he-he, I've started quite an uproar.
Nobody expect the Spanish In..., ahem, I mean Planescape nerds.

Well, if spears not enough, that will serve as ultimate proof that WormGod is a fine example of slacker .

 

[Zomg]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

You might want to talk to someone about taking it off of the webpage then, because just this moment it's promotional, not concept.

Edit - Why did anyone even bother to redraw the same figure in a different pose for internal use? Just hand a printed-off scan of that D&D cover around next time. "Make it look like this up to the edge of liability." could be written on the bottom.

 

[WormGod]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

Clearly MSFD. I am going to go trade in this silly human skin I wear for something else. God forbid I look like another human. :shock:

Tell you all what.... I will replace the head with a pumpkin. No wait, that would resemble a pumpkin too much.

Regardless of what you all think the final product is (which you should know, we are not in the business of selling concept art), concepts are scraps that then go on to orthos, modeling, then texturing. The margin for difference is clearly visible. Of course, at that point, if it is still a little gray man with wings, I am still a crook. *sigh* I cant win.

 

[Drakron]

Yes you are.

But we let that slide if you create spear animations and sex animations as well.

 

[Balor]

Indeed, we'll forget this little incident, just give us spears, and we promise to complete the game at least once with charactes that use spears exclusively .
Expecially since you have spare half a year now.
_____
Btw, it begins to remind me a situation with 'left-handed ejecting ports' in STALKER, and it cannot be a good sign.

 

[Whipporowill]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

God forbid I look like another human. :shock:

Silly logic will get you nowhere. And for a guy that claims to know about copyright, you should be aware of the fact that human appearance can't be copyrighted.

Tell you all what.... I will replace the head with a pumpkin. No wait, that would resemble a pumpkin too much.

Noone owns the right to pumpkins unless, say God exists and he called that one - which is to say highly unlikely.

Regardless of what you all think the final product is (which you should know, we are not in the business of selling concept art), concepts are scraps that then go on to orthos, modeling, then texturing. The margin for difference is clearly visible. Of course, at that point, if it is still a little gray man with wings, I am still a crook. *sigh* I cant win.

The moment it's used in a promotional or marketing facility - it stops being concept art, per se. You might be lazy, but I'd say it's marketing that puts the company logo on and stuff... that might be more up crook alley.

 

[Shagnak]

The concept of "concept art" seems to be lost on some folks here

Tell you all what.... I will replace the head with a pumpkin. No wait, that would resemble a pumpkin too much.

What a completely crap argument.
There is a difference between copying some generic entity and copying directly someone else's original creation. That head is so directly copied you may as well have xeroxed it (maybe you did).

This would be fine as in-house concept art, but you are essentially using this as marketing now.

While you're there, why don't you just directly copy some Stephen King tracts and put them in a "story concept" section, and see what happens. And then not just base some bits on it, but actually use well-known parts of it in your marketing without any obvious crediting.

You guys present your public face like a bunch of rank amateurs.

 

[Chefe]

Clearly MSFD. I am going to go trade in this silly human skin I wear for something else. God forbid I look like another human. :shock:

You're joking right?

So you're allowed to copy other people's art, pass it off for your own, and then make oddball reasonings when questioned?

Shit, are you guys hiring any new artists? Where do I sign up? I've got drawing skillz, but I suck at coming up with fantasy ideas. If all I have to do is copy other people's work, then this will be a breeze!

Mock Interview:
Todd: "Well, Eduardo the Sex Hunk, imagine I'm a fan. I say that your concept art looks just like a piece by Louis Royo. What do you say?"
Me: "Oh yes, they're exactly the same. God forbid I use a pencil to draw. I'd better trade it in for finger paints."
Todd: "That doesn't make any fucking sense. You're hired!"
Me: *flexes muscles*



Anyways, I will forget this whole thing if you implement spears. And elf boobies.

 

[merry andrew]

Anyways, I will forget this whole thing if you implement spears. And elf boobies.

Elf boobies aren't in?

 

[Stella Brando]

Why would elves not have boobies? This is what Beth really ought to be concentrating on, imho.