Game News Bloodlines appears on sales charts

[dojoteef]

It's the controls that make combat unfun.

Are you saying the controls in Bloodlines make the combat crappy?

 

[Volourn]

A large part of it, yes.

 

[Sol Invictus]

They do, you know. When half your hits fail to connect for some spurious reason, all you're left with is a feeling of aggrivation.

 

[dojoteef]

Can you please explain? You can change the controls to whatever you want. I have mine set up exactly the same why I have normal FPS games set up when it comes to combat, so I'm not sure what you mean.

The only thing I find truly annoying is when the game changes views and/or changes weapons on you. If you are a gunslinger with a gun in hand and you talk to someone which causes a fight, if you try to attack them it forgets to put the gun back in your hand and you have to fumble around trying to get the gun you want out again while getting reamed.

So like I said, what about the control system don't you like?

 

[Volourn]

Everything. Duh. All I pretty much do is press attack button rpeeatdly. The only thing the combat seems to have done right are the special powers and the blood sucking.

 

[Seven]

Geez.. When Ex and I agree 100% it really proves how much of a marooon you really are.

Seriously, lighten up se7en.

Um... no, when Rex agrees with anything that any one posts then that's a pretty good indicator that you're fighting a lost cause. :wink:

PS, does any one have pics of Rex, not that I'm considering using photoshop, PM'em to me if you do.

 

[dojoteef]

They do, you know. When half your hits fail to connect for some spurious reason, all you're left with is a feeling of aggrivation.

What're you talking about? For melee, all the attacks hit their mark. Whenever I hit in melee combat but don't do damage it has this bluish sort of particle effect that I've come to recognize as meaning I did no damage, as opposed to having a spurt of blood which means you did damage. Whether or not they do damage is based on the Defense skill and the ability to sustain certain types of damage (Bash, Lethal, Aggravated). It's the exact same thing that happens for your PC. If your PC has enough points in each of the various appropriate statistics most attacks don't harm you.

If you're talking about ranged weapons if you don't have a high enough skill there is a chance to miss. If you miss it does no damage, if you hit it always does damage.

So what exactly is the problem with the system? I mean, did you want them to forgo the use of feats and abilities to determine success of combat? If so, wouldn't that just make it into a normal FPS with the ability to speak to characters instead of being an RPG? I'm almost certain if they went that route most everyone on this forum would be bitching. You knew what you were getting into when you bought the game, it had stats that determined the chance of actually doing damage.

Of course all that, has nothing to do with the controls which is what Volourn said he had a problem with.

 

[dojoteef]

Everything. Duh. All I pretty much do is press attack button rpeeatdly. The only thing the combat seems to have done right are the special powers and the blood sucking.

You do know there are different combos that you can do depending on which directional key you are pressing. It even tells you in the game that if you keep doing the same moves, the enemies will be able to defend against them, so it tells you it's best to vary up the moves. I'm not sure much more you could ask for in the game. What would you consider to be a better system. You can use disciplines and attack at the same time. Complaining about having to press the attack button all the time just doesn't make sense. You knew the game had RT combat before you bought it. There isn't a single RT combat game that I know of (including FPS/TPS and other FP RPGs) that doesn't require you to press a button again if you want to attack. If they took that ability away from you, no doubt you'd be complaining about that as well. If they made it like Dungeon Siege were you don't have press the attack button all the time, then it becomes an absolute bore. At least in Bloodlines you can do multiple different attacks at any give time (4 different combos and the use of disciplines).

Once again, I'm at a loss for the complaints. I'm not saying the combat is perfect, but I don't think the fault lies with the controls.

 

[Sol Invictus]

Geez.. When Ex and I agree 100% it really proves how much of a marooon you really are.

Seriously, lighten up se7en.

Um... no, when Rex agrees with anything that any one posts then that's a pretty good indicator that you're fighting a lost cause. :wink:

PS, does any one have pics of Rex, not that I'm considering using photoshop, PM'em to me if you do.

There's one in the People Database.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

What're you talking about? For melee, all the attacks hit their mark. Whenever I hit in melee combat but don't do damage it has this bluish sort of particle effect that I've come to recognize as meaning I did no damage, as opposed to having a spurt of blood which means you did damage. Whether or not they do damage is based on the Defense skill and the ability to sustain certain types of damage (Bash, Lethal, Aggravated). It's the exact same thing that happens for your PC. If your PC has enough points in each of the various appropriate statistics most attacks don't harm you.

Yeah, I picked up on this pretty early on in my playing the game. Even mentioned it in another post. You always hit as long as you're pointed in the right direction. If their defense roll is greater than your hit roll, no damage. Also there is a base amount of damage you can do, but the enemies defense vs. your melee also adds factors onto the damage, be it less or more. So, even if you do damage, it varies as well.

Firearms are different though. I've watched my shots actually miss. Not that they hit and did no damage. They simply missed. That's why I love the tracer effect on the firearms. This is not really a problem for me, even though I play alot of FPS titles. It's an RPG and I learned to deal with it. Defense does come into play though as far as damage is concerned, just like in melee.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

I really havent had a problem with playing the combat so far. I think the one bitch of it is like someone posted earlier about the conversation stuff and having to choose which weapon you wanted all over again. Other than that, no complaints.

 

[Jinxed]

I agree with dojoteef on what he wrote. Only problem is that binding the keys differently seems to take away from the combos, at least that's what SP wrote. I play a lot of FPS games, my direction keys are esdf so switching to wasd makes no difference.

What I wrote to Volourn about the combat model, is the engine in general, not the view. I compared it to max payne and that should already give you an idea of what I meant. In that game, you need to be close enough to the enemy and aim manually to strike. Same thing in Bloodlines. Only in BL the RPG element and blocking comes into play.

But overall, I don't like the melee combat because it feels chaotic. Ranged all the way for me.

 

[Roqua]

No. She was helpful. You are the idiot.

What type of jackass defends some one who posts' "Caution Spoilers Above" in a forum where you scroll down?

On a side, I hadn't found the cash my first time through, (and since it's the little things that make replaying so much fun) I have a right to call him/her on something stupid that he/she posted, so piss off.

I was smart enough to find the cash wasn't I. And if my horrible spelling and grammar wasn't a big enough hint that I'm an idiot I'll just set the record straight and tell you that I am an idiot. I'm stupid too, but at least I ain't gut no money. I also have a penis but you guys can keep reffering to me as a she if you would like.

 

[Seven]

Just cause you have a penis doesn't make you man.

OK, perhaps I was harsh in calling you an idiot; I get the point. It's not like I meant it though. You see here at the codex us (which is to say me) calling you idiot/stupid/gay is like saying welcome and enjoy your stay.

 

[Roqua]

When you appologize you sound like the girl everyone thought I was. I agree with your previous stance of, " I have a right to call him/her on something stupid that he/she posted, so piss off." There are two types of people in this world: people who finish what they start, ect.

 

[Dhruin]

Nice to see you're still entertaining, Roqua.

 

[Roqua]

Nice too hear from you in general Dhruin. Has anyone at rpgdot figured out the idiotic guest posts for news items are me? I can't wait till I finally finsih this semesterand am through with math and hopefullystart posting more regulalry at rpgdot and annoy everyone again. Calculus is such nonsense I want to stab myself in the eye with my useless calculator. Why in this day and age do I have to figure out this crap. There is no reason at all for me to learn this.

I failed my last test on Indefinite and Definite Intergers pretty badley. I got of 63 after a 12 point scale. I have a test tomorrow on the new crap that I am avoiding like a prostate exam. The test is on nonsense like area between two curves and crap that is all based off of the interger phooey that someone with a highly evolved and sophisticated mind like mine just doesn't grasp--because my mind realizes Humans have invented computers to do this jibberish for us. I work in finance, my job is numbers and algebra, but guess what? I plug actual numbers into an actual formula and get an actual answer. Its great. Real math for the real world. And when it gets a little too crazy good ole' MS Excel is there for me.

Calculus is made up jibber-jabber and my proof is every homework assignment I have semi-completed.

My answer ends up being some jibberish with squigly lines with mostly letters. It means absolutly nothing. The prof says my jibberish is wrong and says his jibberish is the right jibberish. Jibberish=incomprehensible and useless data transfer. How can you call my jibbberish wrong? It is every bit as incomprehensible and useless as his. I just want a C, I don't care why anyone's jibberish is better than mine. The sooner I am done with this class the sooner I can seek psychiatric help and hopefully get some closier and forgive whatever knucklehead decided I had to take it for my major in the first place. I have learned nothing and I strongly believe calculus has made me stupider and half the man I used to be.

 

[dojoteef]

I'm not sure why you have to learn it Roqua (could be because some finance actually requires the use of Calculus), but you can't really say it's useless. Mathematics is the basis for all the graphics and physics that gets put into games including RPGs. It's also the basis for other algorithms that are used such as AI stuff like A* pathfinding and all that sort of jazz, so it is good that there are people who know mathematics very well.

Humans have invented computers to do this jibberish for us.

That statement is only partially true. Computers can't do a lot of the complex mathematics that humans do (at least we haven't figured out a way to program computers do them yet). It's true computers can do some Calculus, but there are plenty of problems computers can't solve.

Anyway, I hope you do get your C, good luck.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Yup, they're right. When you swing with melee or unarmed, you automatically hit your target - and often anything remotely near your target. That's the main reason I don't find an awful lot of fault with the combat in Bloodlines.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

When you swing with melee or unarmed, you automatically hit your target - and often anything remotely near your target.

Have you noticed whether or not you do damage to the others around your target if you hit them?

Just today I was swinging away with my katana at Enemy A when suddenly Enemy B runs up to join the fray, there was also Enemy C in the background using a pistol. Well, I hit A for a whopping lot of damage and swung through also striking B, who also took damage, but not as much. C was firing away at the time though and could have easily hit B and did the damage instead of me, so I am not sure.

BTW, I love stealth kills with the katana. Comes with it's own soundtrack.

 

[Volourn]

"You do know there are different combos that you can do depending on which directional key you are pressing. It even tells you in the game that if you keep doing the same moves, the enemies will be able to defend against them, so it tells you it's best to vary up the moves. "

I know this. Seriously, I simply don't have time to play press the key for combo attack. I just swing the attack button. It's attack, attack, attack. No strategy at all and no fun at all. The controls are unituitive for me. It's probably a FPS thing which is too bad sicne I can enjoy RT combat just fine if done right. For starters, I much prefer the mouse to the keyboard. Gargh.

 

[Sol Invictus]

The combat in Bloodlines and Gothic are pretty shoddy, if you ask me. This is after 20 hours of play, too. I had hopes for Bloodlines at first, hence my position that the combat in Bloodlines was decent, but not great, in the beginning. But after much experience with the game I'd have to change that position somewhat.

If they (Troika) want to deliver an action real time experience, the combat should damn well be on par with Jedi Academy's - which is the standard for melee real time combat.

I'd go with the Guild Wars and World of Warcraft style of combat (select new target, attack, and then use special abilities) over a frantic clickfest any day of the week. That combat is much more suited for an RPG, in any case, because it allows the game to calculate rolls based on your statistics instead of how well you are at mashing your mouse button or pressing the W key to move forward to hit the enemy.

 

[EEVIAC]

Have you noticed whether or not you do damage to the others around your target if you hit them?

Definately. I can clear out at least three of those chinese ninjas at a time with the katana. I remember doing the same with the sledge.

BTW, I love stealth kills with the katana. Comes with it's own soundtrack.

For all the bad press I really liked the temple. The whole map had a Enter The Dragon feel that I enjoyed (shouldn't have been compulsory though,) and the katana stealth kills added to that. The biggest disappointment for me in the weapons department is the absense of a chainsaw.

 

[Whipporowill]

You know what - I was thinking the same thing. A chainsaw would SO fit in the game - it'd be useful against vampires for one thing, and it'd be damned funny.

And I kick ass with my katana, I can most definitly hit several monks with a slash.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

I also wouldn't mind a chainsaw. Would definitely make the final part of the Plaguebearer quest and the Cemetery quest alot more fun.