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Cutting shit up in real time (Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance)

bonescraper

Guest
So next-gen.
Well the game was on last-gen hardware.
Oh, so that explains PS2 graphics. Thank you, Jap apologist.

I don't know why everyone lowers their standards when it comes to Jap games. If it was a non-Jap game, people would surely comment on its shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.

But it's Japanese, so it's MAJESTIC ^_________________________________________________________________________________^
 

J_C

One Bit Studio
Patron
Developer
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Messages
16,947
Location
Pannonia
Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
So next-gen.
Well the game was on last-gen hardware.
Oh, so that explains PS2 graphics. Thank you, Jap apologist.

I don't know why everyone lowers their standards when it comes to Jap games. If it was a non-Jap game, people would surely comment on its shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.

But it's Japanese, so it's MAJESTIC ^_________________________________________________________________________________^
What's with the agressiveness? :lol: Who said anything about jap apologism? Cool down dumber, just because you found one ugly screenshot, doesn't mean the whole game is like that.
Does this look PS2 to you? It is not Crysis, but it looks ok for a last gen title.
metal_gear_rising_revengeance__ket_dlc_is_erkezik_aprilisban_1.jpg
 

Cowboy Moment

Arcane
Joined
Feb 8, 2011
Messages
4,407
So next-gen.
Well the game was on last-gen hardware.
Oh, so that explains PS2 graphics. Thank you, Jap apologist.

I don't know why everyone lowers their standards when it comes to Jap games. If it was a non-Jap game, people would surely comment on its shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.

But it's Japanese, so it's MAJESTIC ^_________________________________________________________________________________^

It looks kinda bad (as do most Platinum games), and the story is intentionally cheesy and over-the-top action movie nonsense with a sprinkle of Kojima navel gazing. Honestly though, who the fuck cares? Do you also complain that Paradox games have shitty looking 3D maps and no voice acting? How about Wasteland 2? Besides, MGR's production values work perfectly well for what it's trying to do.

The gameplay, on the other hand, is very good, as is the music.

Your one good point is the terrible tutorial, but then again, it's not fucking hard to go to the menu and read the HELP section to learn most of what you need to know. Only real flaw is making dodge a buyable skill, should've been baseline.
 
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
5,895
I've played a bit and I have to say I'm quite disappointed by the excessive amount of QTEs. The game is fast and fun, but QTEs are fucking awful and there's no justification for them at all given that the combat in the game is really good.

I'm still pretty early on, and maybe they'll cut down on the QTE wankfest as the game progresses, but I doubt it.

It runs well and looks alright. 60fps is all that matters to me in games of this type, so no complaints here.
 
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,585
Location
Motherfuckerville
I don't know why everyone lowers their standards when it comes to Jap games. If it was a non-Jap game, people would surely comment on its shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.

It's because the japs can actually deliver solid gameplay in action games.

Plus, this is the website whose holy trinity is deeply flawed games that do one/two things right. Why does everyone lower their standards when it comes to RPGs? If they weren't RPGs, would anyone tolerate Fallout/Torment/Arcanum's shit combat, shit voice acting, shitty documentation, shitty programming, etc?
 

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,396
I don't know why everyone lowers their standards when it comes to Jap games. If it was a non-Jap game, people would surely comment on its shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.

It's because the japs can actually deliver solid gameplay in action games.

Plus, this is the website whose holy trinity is deeply flawed games that do one/two things right. Why does everyone lower their standards when it comes to RPGs? If they weren't RPGs, would anyone tolerate Fallout/Torment/Arcanum's shit combat, shit voice acting, shitty documentation, shitty programming, etc?
The objective of this game is to beat shit up and watch if Raiden manages to look more gay than he already looks, it succeeded in both.
 

Cowboy Moment

Arcane
Joined
Feb 8, 2011
Messages
4,407
I don't know why everyone lowers their standards when it comes to Jap games. If it was a non-Jap game, people would surely comment on its shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.

It's because the japs can actually deliver solid gameplay in action games.

Plus, this is the website whose holy trinity is deeply flawed games that do one/two things right. Why does everyone lower their standards when it comes to RPGs? If they weren't RPGs, would anyone tolerate Fallout/Torment/Arcanum's shit combat, shit voice acting, shitty documentation, shitty programming, etc?

Hey now, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. Also, only Arcanum's combat is truly shit, PST's is just mediocre and there's too much of it; and Fallout's combat, while simplistic, is quite fun and perfectly appropriate for a game without a huge focus on killing shit.
 

LundB

Mistakes were made.
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
4,160
shit story, shit characters, shit writing, shit graphics, shit voice acting, shit tutorial (that explains 10% of the game mechanics) and low production values.
I'll take something with good gameplay and all of those things being shit over the AAA Cinematic High-production value 100% Voice Acted Story-centric Immershun Experience any day.
 

Jaedar

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 5, 2009
Messages
9,901
Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
So is this game actually playable on PC with a mouse and keyboard?
 

Bahamut

Arcane
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,196
The objective of this game is to beat shit up and watch if Raiden manages to look more gay than he already looks, it succeeded in both.

Indeed
C94D7B60780DA08A0819B9621AFB808C610FE4D6


After geting used to controls (playing on a pad) im kinda enjoying it,

It looks meh but at least the port is decent,

Also pre-rendered cutscenes 21gb, the game 2,3gb :lol:
 
Joined
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Messages
1,876,074
Location
Glass Fields, Ruins of Old Iran
Hey now, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. Also, only Arcanum's combat is truly shit, PST's is just mediocre and there's too much of it; and Fallout's combat, while simplistic, is quite fun and perfectly appropriate for a game without a huge focus on killing shit.

Charismatic-Diplomatic-Pacifist-Sneaky-Hippie characters aside, on a normal playthrough of Fallout 1/2 you'll also kill a ton of things, making use of your vast number of combat-related skills.
 
Joined
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Messages
3,585
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Motherfuckerville
Hey now, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. Also, only Arcanum's combat is truly shit, PST's is just mediocre and there's too much of it; and Fallout's combat, while simplistic, is quite fun and perfectly appropriate for a game without a huge focus on killing shit.

I was mostly responding to typical Codexian negative hyperbole in kind, but I really can't see Torment's combat as anything but bad. I replayed it a few months ago and all the ways in which it failed stick out hard. In short, it's D&D without any of what makes the system appealing.

-Little in the way party formation. Hell, you're stuck with only three members for about 40% of the game, and one of them, Morte, is extremely one dimensional. The game is more than halfway over by the time you can access characters like Grace and Ignus, and even they don't add a ton of depth. It's also really annoying how little options the player has for equipping their character. Shit, only two "hidden" characters can even have ranged attacks...and neither can swap to melee.

Little choice in characters and not a whole lot of depth to the characters you can choose. It's like a bad jRPG.

-Boring enemies. I can count the number of baddies that do things besides melee on my fingers. The Necromancer, the Wizard Construct, Cranium Rats, Ravel, Trias, and TTO. All those nifty fiends and planar critters? Melee only. And even the "special" enemies are non too impressive, firing off a couple spells before switching to naught but simple beaters.

-Poor spell effect variety. Most spells are damage dealers, albeit extremely flavorful ones. There are a few status effect spells, but most enemies seem immune (or maybe it's the strange RNG in Torment that favors "extreme" rolls). Then there are a couple Save or Die effects, including a couple of Chromatic Orb style of spells.

-The worst pathfinding in the IE games. Even with nodes set high (32000) characters regularly get caught on one another and fail to attack. Given how melee-centric the combat is, this is annoying. At least in BG1/IWD1 you had ranged attacks if dealing with pathfinding wasn't your thing

I like the game, don't get me wrong. But the combat is, in fact, bad. That's not negative hyperbole.

So is this game actually playable on PC with a mouse and keyboard?

The game is built around precise directional inputs that would be a nightmare to do with WASD or the numpad. Definitely designed with an analog stick in mind.
 

Magellan

Augur
Joined
Sep 3, 2013
Messages
415
Location
Michigan
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015
This is indeed a goofy game with flaws, and without a ton of depth (not much to it besides fucking shit up). That being said, it's pretty damn fun, and it's worth the purchase!
 

Cowboy Moment

Arcane
Joined
Feb 8, 2011
Messages
4,407
The camera in MGR is kinda frustrating - it seems to work very well in open spaces, but goes absolutely crazy without room to maneuver. Just killed the Grad, and him along with those three dogs in the sewers probably made me die more than everything before them combined, just because of the way the camera behaved. With the dogs it was also getting used to their patterns while fighting three at once, and I eventually got it down to a point where I can repeat it consistently, but Grad was a terrible clusterfuck. Camera spinning around all the obstacles in the room while the boss himself drives around like crazy and suddenly transitions from ranged to melee, shit wasn't fun.

Maybe it's just me not being very experienced with dual analog sticks to just control the camera well manually, but I really wish developers would just let it pass through objects in these kinds of games. Or maybe just have like four locked camera angles, a button to switch between them, and use the right stick for combat control like in God Hand?

And MGR's directional parries exacerbate any and all camera problems, because parrying is so important.

Hey now, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. Also, only Arcanum's combat is truly shit, PST's is just mediocre and there's too much of it; and Fallout's combat, while simplistic, is quite fun and perfectly appropriate for a game without a huge focus on killing shit.

I was mostly responding to typical Codexian negative hyperbole in kind, but I really can't see Torment's combat as anything but bad. I replayed it a few months ago and all the ways in which it failed stick out hard. In short, it's D&D without any of what makes the system appealing.

-Little in the way party formation. Hell, you're stuck with only three members for about 40% of the game, and one of them, Morte, is extremely one dimensional. The game is more than halfway over by the time you can access characters like Grace and Ignus, and even they don't add a ton of depth. It's also really annoying how little options the player has for equipping their character. Shit, only two "hidden" characters can even have ranged attacks...and neither can swap to melee.

Little choice in characters and not a whole lot of depth to the characters you can choose. It's like a bad jRPG.

-Boring enemies. I can count the number of baddies that do things besides melee on my fingers. The Necromancer, the Wizard Construct, Cranium Rats, Ravel, Trias, and TTO. All those nifty fiends and planar critters? Melee only. And even the "special" enemies are non too impressive, firing off a couple spells before switching to naught but simple beaters.

-Poor spell effect variety. Most spells are damage dealers, albeit extremely flavorful ones. There are a few status effect spells, but most enemies seem immune (or maybe it's the strange RNG in Torment that favors "extreme" rolls). Then there are a couple Save or Die effects, including a couple of Chromatic Orb style of spells.

-The worst pathfinding in the IE games. Even with nodes set high (32000) characters regularly get caught on one another and fail to attack. Given how melee-centric the combat is, this is annoying. At least in BG1/IWD1 you had ranged attacks if dealing with pathfinding wasn't your thing

I like the game, don't get me wrong. But the combat is, in fact, bad. That's not negative hyperbole.

So is this game actually playable on PC with a mouse and keyboard?

The game is built around precise directional inputs that would be a nightmare to do with WASD or the numpad. Definitely designed with an analog stick in mind.

I guess that's true, objectively. I personally found it unobtrusive enough to not detract from the good aspects of PST, but that may have to do with my tolerance for bad RTwP? Also, the combat isn't really "good ideas, terrible execution", like in Arcanum, it's just thoroughly unremarkable. Playing Arcanum, I get frustrated at the potential within its systems, while PST combat I just go through mindlessly and immediately forget it.

But you are right, objectively speaking, it is quite bad. Thanks for making that clear to my selective memory.
 

abnaxus

Arcane
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Dec 31, 2010
Messages
10,854
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Fiernes

J_C

One Bit Studio
Patron
Developer
Joined
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Messages
16,947
Location
Pannonia
Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
So is this game actually playable on PC with a mouse and keyboard?

The game is built around precise directional inputs that would be a nightmare to do with WASD or the numpad. Definitely designed with an analog stick in mind.
They don't use the mouse for these precise directional inputs?
Even if mouse control is OK, it would be used for cameramovement. Precise directional input means that you have to be precise with the character control keys (WASD). And you can't use WASD in a 360 degree way.
 

nil

Cipher
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
317
WASD gives you 8 directions, which is more than enough for parrying, and attacks lock on to enemies automatically. I honestly doubt most people can aim with a stick more precisely without some indicator on the screen anyway. In fact, I think if they needed to, they would start complain about how imprecise the controls are.
Also, unlike with a gamepad (with default layout), you don't need to take your fingers off the attack buttons to adjust the camera.

I played the game up to the dog boss. I was doing well, then I ended up near a wall, with him constantly attacking from off screen. All in all, I messed around for about 2 hours with the game. Some notes:
-Surprisingly, the game makes you feel ridiculously weak. The weakest enemies can survive 30 slashes, but you can die from a few kicks, you can easily get stunned, and most attacks send you flying.
-My 9 years old nephew looked at it and concluded that I'm playing as a girl.
-Heavy attack means holding the sword with his foot. Great.
-I actually liked the codec conversations, but listening to all of them may take more time than finishing the levels
-Enemies seem to be wielding ultra high tech machetes
-You can cut off toes, feet, legs and hands for amusing results.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

Notorious Internet Vandal
Joined
Jun 1, 2008
Messages
34,585
Location
Cell S-004
MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Haven't used the good ol' square-triangle-circle-x buttons for attacks in 3D games in a long time myself.

Also by far the funniest (and easiest to rip on) part about Raiden in this game is that ridiculous overdone Baleman voice he speaks with.
 

Bahamut

Arcane
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,196
Also pre-rendered cutscenes 21gb, the game 2,3gb :lol:

:balance:

So this is a Kojima game after all,how big is the Steam download?

Well actually
Download 23,3gb
Installed 25gb

Also this cracks me up
LOOK AN TEH DRAMA (kojiima-made trailer)


And the real game is like
75A8DC4E1B17417B515E85E353DC1ACE81D327D1


And this cutscene with Raiden being edgy as fuck :lol: (JACQ TEH RIPPERZ MUAHAHAHAH)
 

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,396
Also this cracks me up
LOOK AN TEH DRAMA (kojiima-made trailer)

Immature with MELODRAMA and faggotry turned to eleven but still manages to be cool as hell. The story is bonkers and full of cliches but when campyness reach a critical level, you can't stop smilling each time they come with more and more crazy shit.:lol:
 
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
14,306
Holy fuck, what the hell is with the camera? Can anyone tell me how to get it to lock on to an enemy and fucking stay locked on? It says "LKD" yet it still jumps around every 2 seconds and makes playing impossible.
 

Cowboy Moment

Arcane
Joined
Feb 8, 2011
Messages
4,407
Holy fuck, what the hell is with the camera? Can anyone tell me how to get it to lock on to an enemy and fucking stay locked on? It says "LKD" yet it still jumps around every 2 seconds and makes playing impossible.

It's terrible in closed spaces, and there's no way to fix it. It's tolerable against relatively stationary enemies, but against ones who move around rapidly, have fun.

Also, have fun doing multiple parries against a boss while the camera pans around you for no reason, great fun.

I just got done raging about a certain elevator ride, where the camera constantly spins, and there's a bunch of flying enemies shooting missiles at you, whom you can't target, because according to the game, your target is the one dude on the ground who's not even in your field of view. And then you have those fucking gorillas and their awesome "guess in which direction to parry, bro" jump attacks.

That this is followed by a very shitty bossfight which actually managed to make me hate both blade mode and analog sticks, an impressive accomplishment.

Platinum Games are basically Clover's successors, right? I can definitely see the parallels to God Hand in MGR, they design great action gameplay, but then sometimes seem to not realize what kind of enemy and level design complements that best. I am dreading MGR's last boss, given how awful the one in God Hand was.
 
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
14,306
Was stuck on 3 robots in the sewer level for a while, couldn't get past them (and the optional fight with the flamethrower guys) without chomping through several HP items. They move around all the time and you lose your lock constantly. Then I realized you could simply sneak up and stealth kill them all :oops:

I just can't believe there is no way to hold a lock on an enemy. Why can you not lock on? All I want to do is target one enemy and grind them to dust before moving on, but the camera jumps around and I lose track of who I wanted to fight.

Platinum Games are basically Clover's successors, right? I can definitely see the parallels to God Hand in MGR, they design great action gameplay, but then sometimes seem to not realize what kind of enemy and level design complements that best. I am dreading MGR's last boss, given how awful the one in God Hand was.

God Hand's final boss was awful? I wouldn't know, I chained the God Hand on them both infinitely and they never touched me :smug:

The bosses and single enemies in general don't seem so bad so far. You can simply mash and block anything (at least on a keyboard, GL with analog sticks). The trouble is when more targets show up and you can't find the boss.

Currently Mouse controls are screwed up and basically unusable, but I think if mouse support was fixed the game would play perfect with KB/M.
 

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