D&D 5E Discussion

[LeStryfe79]

Give us some examples of High AC builds an how they failed. Wouldn't those same characters have had high saves as well like monks? Is 3.X so terrible that nobody uses attacks?

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Invincible_Monk_(3.5e_Optimized_Character_Build)

 

[Grunker]

Give us some examples of High AC builds an how they failed. Wouldn't those same characters have had high saves as well like monks?

Give me an example of high AC builds and how they work.

At mid/high levels the dangers you face are spells and your problem is how to deal damage. High AC builds focus on stopping something that rarely happens in 3E (low THC attacks) and all give up the ability to deal effectively with most kinds of opponents.

I love playing characters with static bonuses, so I've built quite a few, both netdrawn quote-unquote "top-tier" and edperimental stuff. Like the mon-with-shitload-of-vows/that-prestige-class-that-can't-wear-many-items-but-get-stat-boni. You can get to ridicoulously high AC and saving throws, but mostly by sacrificing reasonable ways to interact with your opponent.

 

[Grunker]

I actually have an antipaladin in my WotW playthrough (see sig) who focuses on high AC, but just as a secondary measure that is sometimes relevant. Far too many ignore AC altogether for him to just go YOLO on AC, again this in a game where the characters are so experimental they would probably get their asses kicked by well-constructed CORE chars.

 

[LeStryfe79]

Can't you get like a 50 strength in 3.X? That character would probably still hit a high AC character a couple of times a round.

 

[Grunker]

Can't you get like a 50 strength in 3.X? That character would probably still hit a high AC character a couple of times a round.

Not on level 8, no

 

[LeStryfe79]

Shit!

 

[Stompa]

Give us some examples of High AC builds an how they failed. Wouldn't those same characters have had high saves as well like monks? Is 3.X so terrible that nobody uses attacks?

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Invincible_Monk_(3.5e_Optimized_Character_Build)

That's a pretty funny experiment, but for actual play the build is awful. Only 2 skill points, no items, zero damage, no means to tie up opposition and force it to attack you instead of that squishy wizard over there. VoP in general is one of the worst trap options in 3.5 unless your DM is very stingy or magic items flat out don't exist .

 

[Grunker]

It's pretty close to a build I ran with in the cormyr trilogy once. It sucked, but I didn't die

 

[Stompa]

It's pretty close to a build I ran with in the cormyr trilogy once. It sucked, but I didn't die

I've ran only through the first part of Cormyr with a fairly unoptimized party (started it as duskblade with a buddy playing beguiler, then beguiler left and some ungodly combination of rogue and wizard joined, and then newbies playing bard and sorc came in before the swamp castle). Wasn't particularly hard, though GM softballed us a few times, like when he didn't instakill my elf when he fell through shadow portal in the Temple of Mystra and just made him black instead.

 

[Grunker]

It is easily The hardest I've played, but then Our GM upped The difficulty.

 

[Spectacle]

Once you hit around 8th level, armor class doesn't matter as much as it used to. You start encountering some big monsters that might have a +11 to hit, which means they hit the average AC of 16 on a 5 or better. Your abilities and hit points are going to be far more important in 5e once you are out of the lower levels.

Get your AC to 21 and that big monster needs a 10 to hit, for a 1/3 reduction in damage, and it also means that anything you do to imposed disadvantage on it's attacks will have a much bigger effect.

Grunker I did a high AC build in NWN2, a dwarwen defender with a tower shield and pretty much anything else I could do to squeeze out extra AC and defences. It worked quite well, most enemies could only hit me on a 20, and I had enough regeneration to tank those occasional hits forever. I'd never play a build like that in PnP though, winning by wearing out your enemies is too boring at tabletop combat speeds

 

[Grunker]

So it turns out video games work rather differently than P&P sessions.

Who da thunk it?

 

[Incantatar]

Rename thread to 3.x discussion?

 

[LeStryfe79]

WTF

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1509124610/darkplane-a-campaign-setting

Darkplane: A Campaign Setting
by Graham Ward


Weird horror, cosmic mystery, and occult intrigue take center stage in this massive new setting for 5th edition.

I remember what it was like to be a Dungeons & Dragons fan in the 90's. D&D's a game about sweeping imaginary worlds populated by strange people and dotted with wonder and mystery. Back then, there were tons of different settings to play in. They came out almost yearly: Ravenloft, Dark Sun, Al-Qadim, Planescape, Birthright. What these settings all have in common is a unique genre and style embodied in each.
Well, times change. Here we are in 2015 and no campaign setting products in sight. But you and I can change that!

 

[Night Goat]

He's got a point, there don't seem to be any official releases on the way besides adventures. Where are the campaign settings?

 

[LeStryfe79]

Looks awesome. I don't trust it.

 

[Melan]

It seems 5e has a conservative release schedule on purpose; they would like to avoid inundating the market. (Although this was also the plan with 3.0, and look where that ended.)

But do we really need official 5e settings? For generic D&D fantasy settings, it is more important to teach GMs to develop their own from the ground level. For something more out there, there is a wealth of published worlds which can mostly be used with any edition after minimal conversion. I don't know how a True Official 5th Edition Approved setting (likely another rehash of GH or FR) would help.

 

[Caim]

Thus far they mentioned Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Eberron, Dragonlance and Planescape (alongside a very bizarre and incorrect interpretation of Sigil) in the DMG, but no settings so far. Unless you count the FR Tiamat campaign.

 

[Archibald]

Well its easier to have well developed setting if everyone starts from same base. Person A likes setting X, but changes few details about it, Person B also likes setting X but changes some other things about it. They share their ideas (on dnd forum for example) and improve their setting further based on the ideas of what other person changed.

 

[Ulminati]

I actually have an antipaladin in my WotW playthrough (see sig) who focuses on high AC, but just as a secondary measure that is sometimes relevant. Far too many ignore AC altogether for him to just go YOLO on AC, again this in a game where the characters are so experimental they would probably get their asses kicked by well-constructed CORE chars.

Don't antipaladins get a profane bonus to all saves like regular paladins? If so he's likely also high AC.

Anyway, the most reliable way to tank in d&d is soaking. Big pool of HP, good will/fort saves to make sure you don't get incapacitated. Plentiful self-healing.
For pathfinder, the ideal would be to run a tiefling paladin. You can even get a bloodline like Rakshasa that gives you a +cha bonus for your saves and smites. Use the alternate favoured class bonus to get +1hp healed by lay on hands when used on yourself. Soak damage->heal self as swift action as necessary. You could even go a step further and use shield other to share hp pool with a backup tank. Or off-tank by shielding the main tank and doing ranged damage.

 

[Grunker]

I actually have an antipaladin in my WotW playthrough (see sig) who focuses on high AC, but just as a secondary measure that is sometimes relevant. Far too many ignore AC altogether for him to just go YOLO on AC, again this in a game where the characters are so experimental they would probably get their asses kicked by well-constructed CORE chars.

Don't antipaladins get a profane bonus to all saves like regular paladins?

Yep, they do. The biggest disadvantage to playing antipaladin is that Touch of Corruption sucks major ass compared to Lay on Hands.

 

[Ulminati]

True. Lay on hands - especially with the tiefling +lvl bounus is awesome.
Paizo really shouldn't have made LoH a swift action to use on self. Healing + full attack is too stronk.

 

[Grunker]

I dunno, I really like it. IMO the problem is that the other melee non-caster classes should have similar powerful tools. I also threw my antipaladin a bone and houseruled that if he ever found a way to become undead, he could use ToC on himself as a Swift.

 

[Irenaeus]

I really like how the DMG treats the multiple settings already published and helps you develop your own. It almost makes me develop my own setting just for fun.

Thus far they mentioned Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Eberron, Dragonlance and Planescape

And Mystara and Ravenloft. And yes, even Spelljammer.

Edit: They also mentioned Birthright.

 

[LeStryfe79]

Irenaeus What kind of setting would you make?