Vapourware Daggerfall Unity isnt Vaporware

[Average Manatee]

I'm a bit surprised that he wasn't curb-stomped by batshitsda, yet. As this is what they very much enjoy.

Since it is an engine that uses the existing assets of Daggerfall, Bethesda don't really give a shit (similar to Exult).

Not even that. Daggerfall is freeware now. You can get it on the Bethesda site.

 

[Misconnected]

There was some talk earlier in the thread about just what exactly beta means in the context of this project. The XL guy has been nice enough to spell it out. Beta, to him, basically means it's "feature complete". How much he'll work on it when it hits that stage (and it's historically a pretty good idea to add at least 3 months to his projected release dates) remains to be seen, but there's various improvements he'd like to make at some point. However, the beta version should be the everything the original game was (but possibly almost as buggy).

The project also has a modding community. At least for the time being it's not terribly active and mostly cosmetics stuff, but a fair pile of people are poised to mod the fuck out of it when the beta hits.

Not even that. Daggerfall is freeware now. You can get it on the Bethesda site.

As Maiandros mentioned, the XL project all but has official sanction from Beth's legal department, and as proactive as Bethesda has been, it seems pretty clear they don't care about the games they've released as freeware. So XL should be fine.

That said, normal usage rights & restrictions don't go away just because something is made freeware by the owner. Not only do you not necessarily have the permission to modify and redistribute any/all parts of it (or even do it just for private use, depending on where you live... poor Americans), you don't necessarily have permission to distribute the original work either. IANA copyrights lawyer, and even if I was I wouldn't be an American one. I also can't be arsed to check exactly how Beth went about releasing the old games as freeware. But an owner typically wouldn't forfeit their rights entirely, simply because it might somehow, someday, in some way, cause a problem for them they could have avoided by retaining some degree of control of the work.

 

[Turjan]

That said, normal usage rights & restrictions don't go away just because something is made freeware by the owner. Not only do you not necessarily have the permission to modify and redistribute any/all parts of it (or even do it just for private use, depending on where you live... poor Americans), you don't necessarily have permission to distribute the original work either. IANA copyrights lawyer, and even if I was I wouldn't be an American one. I also can't be arsed to check exactly how Beth went about releasing the old games as freeware. But an owner typically wouldn't forfeit their rights entirely, simply because it might somehow, someday, in some way, cause a problem for them they could have avoided by retaining some degree of control of the work.

I wouldn't worry too much. Bethesda didn't do anything against DaggerfallSetup either, and that includes the full game. Then again, the site isn't in the US.

 

[Misconnected]

I wouldn't worry too much. Bethesda didn't do anything against DaggerfallSetup either, and that includes the full game. Then again, the site isn't in the US.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply there was anything to be worried about. I'd be very, very surprised if Beth legal ever said a single word about XL. Like I said, it appears they don't give a toss about the games they've released as freeware.

I only wanted to point out that freeware almost never means "it's everyone's, to do with as they please." Especially not for works that started life as commercial software.

 

[Kukulkan]

What motivated Beth to release Daggerfall and Arena as freeware in the first place? They could have milked who knows how much money from GOG sales.

 

[Turjan]

What motivated Beth to release Daggerfall and Arena as freeware in the first place? They could have milked who knows how much money from GOG sales.

I'm pretty sure they have been regretting this on a regular basis. They also completely changed their stance on discounts. Nowadays, it's hard to get Morrowind for the price you paid three years ago.

 

[Kahlis]

I don't understand why a company that seems to almost deliberately want to deny the existence of their older, superior games (I could be wrong, but you know how it feels sometimes with these AAA developers who give the most canned PR talks) would make it so easy for them to be accessible to the public, either. I'm actually curious about what they're going to do for the 20th anniversary as Morrowind is still pretty "current" and producing some money for them. Battlespire and Redguard bundled together might be okay.

Maybe they've been secretly working on Eye of Argonia all these years? I'd be more enthusiastic about that than TES VI, at this point.

 

[Misconnected]

It was part of a PR stunt to make themselves look like more attractive potential owners of id.

- Yes that's a joke. But it was also the first thing that popped into my mind when id joined Beth.

 

[Kukulkan]

I don't understand why a company that seems to almost deliberately want to deny the existence of their older, superior games (I could be wrong, but you know how it feels sometimes with these AAA developers who give the most canned PR talks) would make it so easy for them to be accessible to the public, either. I'm actually curious about what they're going to do for the 20th anniversary as Morrowind is still pretty "current" and producing some money for them. Battlespire and Redguard bundled together might be okay.

Maybe they've been secretly working on Eye of Argonia all these years? I'd be more enthusiastic about that than TES VI, at this point.

Perhaps a GOG release?

 

[AgentBJ09]

Maybe it's me, but the screenshots remind me a lot of Heretic when it's run in the Doomsday Engine. Still, I've got the vanilla game installed, so I'll see what the difference is with the mod installed.

 

[Wyrmlord]

What motivated Beth to release Daggerfall and Arena as freeware in the first place? They could have milked who knows how much money from GOG sales.

I am guessing they did the right thing.

Guy who played Oblivion gets curious and tries Arena and Daggerfall. Attachment to series becomes stronger, even if he does not completely like the game. Guy who played Oblivion now purchases Skyrim on 11/11/11 and also purchases Morrowind, which he had earlier never tried. It's that simple.

Sure they lose out on sales of Daggerfall and Arena, but they gain big on the Elder Scrolls brand. They impress on the player that this is a two decades old series with a vast lore behind it, and that each new installment is not to be missed. [It's called loss leaders and cross-selling. My parents do this all the time, selling products at a loss, because people will purchase them with other goods out of increased interest.]

Why else did so much of Morrowind lore make it to Skyrim, even though much of Morrowind lore didn't make it to Oblivion? Bethesda must have seen that Oblivion boosted cross-sales of Morrowind. They then knew that something of that Morrowind promise must make it to Skyrim. So they include dwemer ruins and whatnot. Daggerfall and Arena boost that cross-selling momentum.

 

[Jaesun]

The consoletards who like current Bethesda games, would play daggerfall for about 3 minutes and become so fucking confused and would turn it off, so they are not losing any money on Daggerfall being free.

 

[Blaine]

Yeah, in Daggerfall you can't spent forty-five minutes lovingly sculpting the androgynous features of your transsensual/polyamorous gay/lesbian elf-identified being, and there are no consensus-approved, feelings-safe, horribly written sex scenes to pursue, so....

 

[Broseph]

Sad how consolified some people are. I was a consoletard not two years ago and even I don't find Daggerfall to be particularly difficult. You can run through the first dungeon in about five minutes if you know what you're doing. As for the rest of the game, it's mostly a matter of paying attention.

 

[Kukulkan]

What motivated Beth to release Daggerfall and Arena as freeware in the first place? They could have milked who knows how much money from GOG sales.

I am guessing they did the right thing.

Guy who played Oblivion gets curious and tries Arena and Daggerfall. Attachment to series becomes stronger, even if he does not completely like the game. Guy who played Oblivion now purchases Skyrim on 11/11/11 and also purchases Morrowind, which he had earlier never tried. It's that simple.

Sure they lose out on sales of Daggerfall and Arena, but they gain big on the Elder Scrolls brand. They impress on the player that this is a two decades old series with a vast lore behind it, and that each new installment is not to be missed. [It's called loss leaders and cross-selling. My parents do this all the time, selling products at a loss, because people will purchase them with other goods out of increased interest.]

Why else did so much of Morrowind lore make it to Skyrim, even though much of Morrowind lore didn't make it to Oblivion? Bethesda must have seen that Oblivion boosted cross-sales of Morrowind. They then knew that something of that Morrowind promise must make it to Skyrim. So they include dwemer ruins and whatnot. Daggerfall and Arena boost that cross-selling momentum.

I don't get it. If you went through the pains of getting the games to run nice and well on Dosbox they would have also quite likely bought it off GOG. Honestly if Beth wants to do more good things they'd release Arena and Daggerfall as free games on GOG so no more of that Dosbox hassle. Though the launchers exist but not everyone knows they exist.

 

[PetrusOctavianus]

The consoletards who like current Bethesda games, would play daggerfall for about 3 minutes and become so fucking confused and would turn it off, so they are not losing any money on Daggerfall being free.

How can anyone get confused in Daggerfall? It's not like the wilderness is just an immense featureless mass of nothingness...

 

[Lyric Suite]

The starting dungeon is probably enough to deter modern gamers, and that's one of the easiest dungeons in the game. In the end, this is what Daggerfall was. A dungeon crawler, not a LARP simulator.

 

[Taxnomore]

Daggerfall is just a 3D roguelike. I always viewed it as such.

 

[Xi]

http://xlengine.com/blog/

Looks like he's aiming to get it to Beta in the first part of 2013. A fully playable game with bugs. Pretty excited about this. ;P

 

[Lyric Suite]

A fully playable game with bugs.

Well, considering Daggerfall was also released while still in beta, i guess we can congratulate the guy for retaining the spirit of the original to its fullest.

Or not. Just fucking be done with it god damn it.

 

[Kirtai]

A fully playable game with bugs.

A completely faithful reproduction of Daggerfall then, assuming it has enough bugs.

 

[Kukulkan]

Daggerfall is just a 3D roguelike. I always viewed it as such.

I think it would be interesting if a perma-death mod or feature becomes available.

 

[dibens]

perma death in a bethesda game? you are fucking crazy.

 

[Kukulkan]

perma death in a bethesda game? you are fucking crazy.

All the more fun.

 

[Lyric Suite]

As fun as smashing your balls with an hammer.