Divinity Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition

[Plisken]

trying to get into this game, I really am but its just not grabbing my attention.

Does it get better? I've pretty much just reached fort joy and recruited a few companions, etc.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Does it get better?

nope

 

[TT1]

Does it get better?

yes

 

[Black]

Does it get better?

yes

When?

 

[Darth Roxor]

Does it get better?

yes

When?

after uninstalling

 

[TT1]

Does it get better?

yes

When?

After fort joy things get better.

 

[Black]

Does it get better?

yes

When?

After fort joy things get better.

Didn't notice.

 

[Stavrophore]

Its not better its more of the same. Its good that you can finally get all skillbooks.

 

[TT1]

Does it get better?

yes

When?

After fort joy things get better.

Didn't notice.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Play the game with open eyes next time

 

[Infinitron]

Division on Codex between those who think D:OS 2 is worse than D:OS 1 in basically every way, and those who think it just (majorly) screwed up some mechanics but is otherwise bigger and better.

Hmmm, maybe we could do our review as a dialogue between a representative of each side. Draq vs Roxor? :D

 

[Infinitron]

 

[Lahey]

Division on Codex between those who think D:OS 2 is worse than D:OS 1 in basically every way, and those who think it just screwed up some mechanics but is otherwise bigger and better.

Hmmm, maybe we could do our review as a dialogue between a representative of each side. Draq vs Roxor? :D

 

[Fairfax]

The heavy MMORPG influence has its psychological benefits with the average player, which certainly helped the game's reception and sales, but it'll hurt the game's...completion rate

Not entirely certain about that. http://steamcommunity.com/stats/230230/achievements http://steamcommunity.com/stats/435150/achievements
24% of D:OS Classic players finished Act 1. 30% have completed D:OS 2's act 1.

Of course there's a gap with the ending achievements but D:OS 2 hasn't been out long enough for most people to even complete it.

Nice of them to break down the ending achievements by difficulty to see where most of the audience is though. 1.1% for explorer, .7% for classic, and .2% for tactician so far.

7.8%. I'm right so far.

 

[Roguey]

7.8%. I'm right so far.

That's on easy. If you add the two other difficulties, it's much greater than D:OS's completion rate.

Edit: Though sure, some replays are involved. The achievement for entering the last big map of D:OS 2 is 14.8% whereas for D:OS it's 11.8%. Gain is a gain though.

 

[Fairfax]

7.8%. I'm right so far.

That's on easy. If you add the two other difficulties, it's much greater than D:OS's completion rate.

If you complete the game on a higher difficulty, you get the achievements from the ones below, so 7.8% is the total completion rate.

 

[Roguey]

If you complete the game on a higher difficulty, you get the achievements from the ones below, so 7.8% is the total completion rate.

Still a 1.4% gain. From what I've skimmed, a lot of people don't like Arx, so the loss can be blamed on content.

 

[Fairfax]

If you complete the game on a higher difficulty, you get the achievements from the ones below, so 7.8% is the total completion rate.

Still a 1.4% gain. From what I've skimmed, a lot of people don't like Arx, so the loss can be blamed on content.

I doubt Arx is the main culprit. Look at the drops between the major sections:

• 57.9% escaped Fort Joy
• 43% reached Reaper's Coast
• 18.9% reached the Nameless Isle
• 14.8% reach Arx
• 7.8% finished it

Almost half of those who reached Arx didn't finish it, which is a bad sign, but the drop between Reaper's Coast and Nameless Isle is far bigger. Doesn't mean Reaper's Coast is the worst area, it's just the point where the factors that made people abandon the game peaked.

As I said in my original post, I believe the MMO design is the main factor. The series of large areas is a lot for most people already, and to make it worse, each area has specific enemy/loot level ranges. Players are heavily encouraged to explore all maps in a specific order, which makes progression a drag. And then you have the terrible itemization, constant inventory management, dumb armour system, bloated stats, predictable and constant battles, mediocre side-quests, tons of dialogue, bad humour, etc. I don't think there's any flaw that makes people actively upset, only things that add up over time and make them lose interest.

In the big RPGs Swen wants to surpass, players have a lot more freedom when it comes to doing side content, exploring or making progress in the main quest. In D:OS2, it's always clear that you have a lot more of the same ahead of you, and all systems are designed in a way to make the player follow the intended path. The big RPGs have flaws as well, but they can rely on different things to keep players hooked. BioWare focuses on characters, worldbuilding, cinematics and production values. Bethesda relies on open world exploration, heavily streamlined mechanics, a short main quest and mods. TW3 is a BioWare/Bethesda hybrid approach but better at almost everything they do. Obsidian used to rely on reactivity, companions, and writing.

D:OS2 is not particularly good at any of that. Codex claims D:OS1 had good combat (I didn't play it), but that's certainly not the case now. The game does gets a lot of mileage out of the sandboxy mechanics and co-op, but that's not enough to retain players for 50-60+ hours.

 

[Roguey]

The game does gets a lot of mileage out of the sandboxy mechanics and co-op, but that's not enough to retain players for 50-60+ hours.

On that note

Classic Playtime total: 34:40 (average) 13:03 (median)
Enhanced Playtime total: 28:34 (average) 09:13 (median)
II Playtime total: 56:19 (average) 34:27 (median)

That's a huge leap when it comes to the median.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[PEACH]

Reaper's coast has dampened my experience a lot so far. Playing the two games back to back has, in general, been pretty deflating, more and more as I trudge through the combat and the changes grow more and more difficult to put up with

I really want to love the game but 30 hours in my girlfriend and I have been discussing going back to DOS1 on tactician instead. Armor is retarded, initiative is retarded, gear bloat, railroading and 5% stat bonuses are retarded. I couldn't give a fuck less about stuff like the dopey rng loot simply due to how nauseating the combat and character progression is. Bigger fish to fry I guess.

Feel more disappointed than anything else though. How hard would it be to approach armor in a more nuanced way and design encounters in a way that doesn't make you want to turn the game off half the time. The art direction is way better, environments actually feel like locations, writing isnt as grating for the most part and etc but it's hard to give a shit when jack in the box ambushes, Shields Up / Fortify + autoattacks are the fundamental basis of every fight and the build depth is neutered beyond hope

Don't think I'm saying anything that hasn't been said a thousand times already but boy it bums me out that the game turned out to be the antithesis of what made the first one so fun and refreshing. I don't even want to revel in how shitty these things are, I just want a proper follow up to the first game

 

[Jedi Exile]

The Journal is still a big mess. Finished quests count as unfinished.

Spoiler

After attempted exorcism, Jahan actually joined me and came to the ship, but in the journal it is written that 'I refused his help' and decided to proceed without him.

 

[Tigranes]

10% completion rate for big RPGs is pretty par for the course, that is just the reality of the baseline, not something unusual or a failure.

The fact that 43% reached the Reaper's Coast is more surprising to me, given that we know with so many games, half the buyers never play more than a couple of hours. We don't have access to comprehensive data for comparison across the board, but I'd almost take that as good numbers.

 

[Roguey]

The fact that 43% reached the Reaper's Coast is more surprising to me, given that we know with so many games, half the buyers never play more than a couple of hours. We don't have access to comprehensive data for comparison across the board, but I'd almost take that as good numbers.

Yup, I checked most of the recent RPG stats and the median is typically around 12-16 hours or so (Tides of Numenera's is 6 Even Tyranny has around 13)

The kings of player retention are Bethesda of course. Skyrim and Fallout 4's medians are around 60 hours. Despite all the accolades, New Vegas and Witcher 3 have a "mere" 19 and 24, respectively. Elex has 21.

 

[Tigranes]

Skyrim's somewhere between real games and MMOs/Browser games when it comes to how it gets people to keep playing, so I'm not surprised. From a business standpoint that would be one of the datapoints showing them why they've got a golden goose in their formula, and why it's better for them to do that instead of real RPGs.

 

[Fairfax]

10% completion rate for big RPGs is pretty par for the course, that is just the reality of the baseline, not something unusual or a failure.

Not really:

TW3: 26.5%
Skyrim: 32%
DA:O: 36%
FO4: 25.2%
ME2: 56%
ME3: 42%
DS2: 33%
DX HR: 37.2%