Divinity Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition

[Brandon LaRocque]

10 hours in, and I'm hooked. I haven't played a proper RPG in years. It's kind of refreshing to finish work, drink some whiskey, and delve into this world a little bit.

 

[Tigranes]

Casuals dont compare indie isometric crpgs to other indie isometric crpgs. They look at a game and think it looks great or shit relative to all the other AAA shit they could be playing. Hint: context doesnt mean you take any selection of facts that you feel like wiping your ass with

Dude, this game's competition was CRPGS, not farmville... DOS wasn't bought by the general public. So i don't get the "casual" comment. Context is everything...

Wow

You don't get 1m+ sales by selling to hardcore grognards.

If you are selling to hardcore grognards, they don't care that this one has marginally 'better' graphics.

If you are selling to casual RPG players, then they think Witcher 3 and Skyrim looks way better than this shit

Hint: context doesnt mean you take any selection of facts that you feel like wiping your ass with

 

[Feargus Jewhart]

I'm not sure how have you managed to miss the Magister war crimes that are all over the place and their consequences, like the torture halls or Shriekers, or all the tortured spirits that can't possibly fathom that they're dead, or literally every instance of Voidwoken being allured by Source and killing absolutely everyone in the way for then to have Magisters fuck over the survivors or join the body count. I don't think that Mordus' hellspawn breeding grounds cave had ONE joke. It's even more flagrant with the Villain tag as you can get even more grim dialogue options if you so want, but sure, if you've managed to skim all over that, then yes I can kind of see that.

But that's exactly what I'm talking about - you have serious shit like that which should've been handled in somber tones. Instead they fuck it up with goofy voice acting and a color palette that looks like a Bob Ross painting. And then there's the 'humor'... It absolutely kills the atmosphere. Not everything has to be a written joke to fall into 'humor' - one example are those talking heads mounted on spikes in the marshland outside the fort itself. They're spiked in a circle around a trapped chest, and all of them keep wailing 'DONT OPEN DA CHEST! OPEN DA CHEST!' in their own individual version of autistic screeching. That fucking scene straight up killed my immersion. Disembodied heads shouldn't be played for laughs - unless it's something like a shit-talking 'mimir' from PS:T. The difference being that Morte is an example of a comedic sidekick, while Larian's severed heads are examples of body horror and nightmare fuel (at least the concept presents them as such... right before the execution itself craps all over it by trivializing the whole situation). And it just goes on and on.

I don't want to shit on the game too much because I wouldn't call it 'bad', but it's just all over the place, thematically. Though I gotta mention the tutorial ship - that area was done well. The murder mistery; Fane's lamentations; the other companions trading verbal jabs with each other and the player, etc. Not showstopper stuff, but competent. It struck a good balance of humor, writing, area design, and most important the themes associated with imprisonment and loss of freedom.

And then you get to Fort Joy, and it just goes to shit (visually and narratively).

That game is such a waste of a good engine (and tolerable ruleset).

Hello my friend. I got something for you to read.
"Humor as a Defense Mechanism in the Holocaust" and "Humor as a Weapon, Shield and Psychological Salve".
What does this mean? It means that even in the actual real world you live in, humans have a sense of humor even in the most grim situations. It's a defense AND a coping method, so realistically those heads acting in that way is very realistic.

It also means that you're just fucking edgy and want grimdark game #4345. Go play slenderman or something.

 

[YldriE]

The Gothic and Witcher series have tons of in-universe humor and it's thematically appropriate. I'm sorry if you cannot tell the difference between that and constant fourth-wall breaking "am I right guys?" narrator trash gags.

 

[SlumLord]

It's a defense AND a coping method, so realistically those heads acting in that way is very realistic.

I wasn't talking about realism, or lack of it. They could've played the heads scene for laughs -- and they did try -- but it comes off as amateurish to the point of parody. A more skilled writer could've pulled it off, but Larian obviously doesn't have the talent pool to draw from. Their dialogue is pedestrian at the best of times. I've no idea what Avellone contributed to the project, but it sure wasn't a lot judging by the tone of the game (and the execution). The gaggle of homeless bums they roped in for VO work doesn't help either.

As for being edgy and grimdark, well yeah fucker, of course I like those kinds of games! They're usually done competently and deal with relatable themes. Humor is for infants and women - the bland, boring, stale 'quirky' bullshit that's crept into game writing over the last decade, and corresponds in tone to the dumbing down of society at large. And note that I said 'humor', not bantz. Characters shit-talking each other and trading verbal jabs is the kind of quality I'd like to see in games (and which was present during golden age of CRPGs), but it seems that caliber of writing is out of reach of the modern penmonkey.

They should keep their quirky bullshit reserved for Tumblr, where it belongs.


Incidentally, here's the lead writer for both DOS1 and 2: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm6675296/

'Sarah Baylus', who's from the States and got the job because guys from Larian 'liked her' (LOLOLOLOL).

https://www.headstuff.org/entertain...h-sarah-baylus-lead-writer-at-larian-studios/

Spoiler

'...a voracious interest in ancient and medieval history and mythology'

Have we found the perfect mate for Sawyer? :D

Their children would bring Balance(TM) and Humor(R) to CRPGs, ushering in a new era of social pandering and postmodernist deconstruction!

 

[Strange Fellow]

Humor is for infants and women - the bland, boring, stale 'quirky' bullshit that's crept into game writing over the last decade

Wasteland (1988)

 

[SlumLord]

^It's old so that automatically makes it good, m I rite?

GTFO with that garbage, Fallout was ten times the IP Wasteland ever was. At least they joked about whores and STDs. Cassidy alone has more bantz and testosterone than the entirety of Larian, Inexile, and Obsidian put together.

Spoiler

We're gonna get nothin' but decline until the Biorejects at Failsidian start resembling this IRL...

 

[RK47]

Joined: Sunday

 

[SlumLord]

Joined: Sunday

Yes, and? Should I mention in every post I make that I've been lurking the Dex from 2011 onward? Would that make my opinion hold more weight? Fuck arguments and rebuttals, right?

Cretin.

 

[Strange Fellow]

Should I mention in every post I make that I've been lurking the Dex from 2011 onward? Would that make my opinion hold more weight?

When it's as dumb as this? I dunno, seniority goes a long way, but it can't work miracles.

 

[SlumLord]

When it's as dumb as this? I dunno, seniority goes a long way, but it can't work miracles.

Honestly I have nothing against people enjoying Larian's DOS series. That's personal preference. But nobody can deny their writing is objectively bad. It's not even on par with Obsidian's PoE (as flowery and detestable as it is), and that's pretty damning on its own.

Larian's lead writer is a californian airhead millennial who makes Carrie Patel look like Proust, and who got into the industry because a bunch of overworked virgins form the studio liked the way she looked. There's 50 people on the Codex who could write circles around the woman, but she got in because MUH VAGINA (what else is new?). I'm pissed because I can't enjoy the game due to her (and others like her) shit writing. And Larian made a good engine/ruleset, which is wasted on a game like DOS1/2.

I'm mad because I care.

 

[Feargus Jewhart]

When it's as dumb as this? I dunno, seniority goes a long way, but it can't work miracles.

Honestly I have nothing against people enjoying Larian's DOS series. That's personal preference. But nobody can deny their writing is objectively bad. It's not even on par with Obsidian's PoE (as flowery and detestable as it is), and that's pretty damning on its own.

Larian's lead writer is a californian airhead millennial who makes Carrie Patel look like Proust, and who got into the industry because a bunch of overworked virgins form the studio liked the way she looked. There's 50 people on the Codex who could write circles around the woman, but she got in because MUH VAGINA (what else is new?). I'm pissed because I can't enjoy the game due to her (and others like her) shit writing. And Larian made a good engine/ruleset, which is wasted on a game like DOS1/2.

I'm mad because I care.

Google tells me she's been working at Larian since 2013 or so in various roles, among other things she was a writer in D:OS and did design work for Dragon Commander. She wrote Lohse and Malady, who were both good and interesting so I can't say she's outright bad. You do realize a lead writer doesn't write everything in the game and it might be that someone else came up with the talking skulls that you so detest?

Your posts sound a lot like
>I can't enjoy because someone with a vagina wrote it in a way I don't like

By any chance are you Anita Sarkeesian undercover trying to bait Codexers into saying retarded shit for a hit piece by saying retarded shit?

Anita, pls go. No one cares about the gender of the writer when discussing quality, try reddit or 4chan.

 

[SlumLord]

No one cares about the gender of the writer when discussing quality

Far be it for me to tell companies whom they should hire, but if you watch some of the newer presentations and talks from devs (Tim Cain, Avellone, Swen, etc.), they all touch on equal gender representation in game development, and how their companies make an effort to pigeonhole as many women as possible into dev roles. And it's not just talk - they're committed to this. Which is synonymous with a drop in quality of said games because they're not hiring on the merits of skill. There was an interview with Sarah where she mentions how she got freelance work with Larian a while ago, and despite it being trivial work she nonetheless got a full-time position because (and I'm paraphrasing here) '...they guys from Larian liked me'. What are the odds some grognard from the Dex (who probably has 10x her skill) would've been offered the same? But yeah, bitch is easy on the eyes so they invited her and she pozzed the game seven ways to Sunday (listen to some of her interviews, she's the quintessential retarded millennial snowflake wamyn).

You know why we never have incline anymore? Because games used to be made by skilled fanatics who lived and breathed their work, not social strivers and English lit rejects who exist only to inject their personal version of marxist drivel into the medium.

I'm not saying Sarah is that bad, but she's a dumb Californian airhead who thinks quirky = humor = fun. And as the lead, it's her job to oversee the other penmonkeys in order to ensure a degree of quality in their work. Which, IMHO, is steaming pile of garbage in the DOS games.

Again, contrast Fort Joy to Spellhold in BG2. The difference is like night and day. And BG2 had idiotic humor as well, but there was also room for introspection, reflection, even a bit of philosophical discussion. And the game made it work together, because these things complemented each other.

What does DOS have? More of the same, only in different shades, all the fucking time. There's no narrative overlay, no overarching themes, no main premise to offer a theses/anti-thesis/synthesis trifecta that works so amazingly when executed well.

>inb4 storyfag

Yes, DOS1/2 has enjoyable TB combat but the immersion is non-existant.

I can't enjoy because someone with a vagina wrote it in a way I don't like

False. Here are two females who produce competent work:
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1897248/
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm2824501/

Anita Sarkeesian undercover trying to bait Codexers into saying retarded shit for a hit piece by saying retarded shit?

Since when do codexians give half a shit what that squinty-eyed gypsy whore thinks or wants or says?


TL;DR: nepotistic hiring and dumb wamyn ruining vidya

 

[Lacrymas]

I don't think writers of Larian's caliber know what Marxism is or how to inject its agenda.

 

[Jimmious]

Ah I see, one more of these people came. Marxists, agendas and SJWs and stuff. Where do you all breed?

 

[SlumLord]

Ah I see, one more of these people came. Marxists, agendas and SJWs and stuff.

Nigger I've been lurking for years, get off your high horse. And if games like Tranny or PoE (or even D:OS to an extent) don't make you wonder wtf is going on with their writing, then I don't know what to tell you. Man-hating feminist companions, tranny NPCs, thinly-veiled political agendas, etc. Fuck me, I just wanna play well-made RPGs! And the Codex is one of the few places on the entire net where you can vent without getting a banhammer to the face for defying the Current Year agenda.

But enough about that, I don't want to derail the thread further.

I had high hopes for D:OS2 because Chris was on the writing team, and he's got a very good relationship with Swen. I thought they'd make a kickass game, both narratively and mechanically. But it seems even Avellone ran out of creative steam. They bamboozled me out of 50 euros that I spent on the game, only to be greeted with a visual and narrative clusterfuck (do note that Swen's pre-release interviews made mention of improvements to the overall tone of the game, as well as the writing... they advertised it toward a more mature audience, but it just didn't deliver).

Not every game has to be grimdark. But if your story revolves around gods, high magic, assassins, secret societies, power struggles, and magical-themed enslavement, then you better make sure it's done well!

I'd rather Larian made a light-hearted version of The Black Company (with a shitton of in-party bantz and humor) which I'd play the fuck out of, than try to tackle epic stories that fall flat on their face.

 

[Feargus Jewhart]

Nigger I've been lurking for years, get off your high horse. And if games like Tranny or PoE (or even D:OS to an extent) don't make you wonder wtf is going on with their writing, then I don't know what to tell you. Man-hating feminist companions, tranny NPCs, thinly-veiled political agendas, etc.

 

[SniperHF]

Yes, and? Should I mention in every post I make that I've been lurking the Dex from 2011 onward? Would that make my opinion hold more weight? Fuck arguments and rebuttals, right?

Cretin.

A proper lurker would have been expecting a "Joined" reply and would have ignored it instead of getting

 

[SlumLord]

Feargus Jewhart


SniperHF
Lol, 'proper lurker'. Bitch what do you think this is, grade school? People here always used to fling shit at each other, but at least they'd engage. If it were up to me, I'd ban anyone who posted in a thread without moving the discourse (forward or back, it don't matter as long as it's moving).


But to keep slightly on topic, sure, keep feeding shitty devs like Larian money, so they can rape the genre and hire more cucks and cunts. Then y'all bitch how there's no incline. Dumbfucks.

 

[TemplarGR]

Feargus Jewhart


SniperHF
Lol, 'proper lurker'. Bitch what do you think this is, grade school? People here always used to fling shit at each other, but at least they'd engage. If it were up to me, I'd ban anyone who posted in a thread without moving the discourse (forward or back, it don't matter as long as it's moving).


But to keep slightly on topic, sure, keep feeding shitty devs like Larian money, so they can rape the genre and hire more cucks and cunts. Then y'all bitch how there's no incline. Dumbfucks.

Total lack of taste in clothing, red fluorescent hair, and non-existent breasts, yup, those are female devs alright...

Damn i should have picked another profession...

 

[SlumLord]

Total lack of taste in clothing, red fluorescent hair, and non-existent breasts, yup, those are female devs alright...

Damn i should have picked another profession...

I dunno, Sarah's pretty cute. I'm kinda tsundere for her. I'd rape her but gently, lovingly... and then we'd cuddle afterwards.

 

[TheImplodingVoice]

Worked for Google and Facebook and decided to pursue love of writing. Clearly progressive, red hair and most likely a feminist. Fuck this shit

Also : https://www.siliconrepublic.com/start-ups/diversity-in-gaming-event-dogpatch-labs so she is a feminist cunt and most likely is part of cucking Larian (that's if Larian hasn't always been faggsvile). These progressive bitches need to get the fuck out of gaming and go ruin some other medium.

 

[DraQ]

Nigger I've been lurking for years, get off your high horse. And if games like Tranny or PoE (or even D:OS to an extent) don't make you wonder wtf is going on with their writing, then I don't know what to tell you. Man-hating feminist companions, tranny NPCs, thinly-veiled political agendas, etc.

Waah! I want muh monocled herp-derpeegees of old!!!1

 

[TemplarGR]

Worked for Google and Facebook and decided to pursue love of writing. Clearly progressive, red hair and most likely a feminist. Fuck this shit

Also : https://www.siliconrepublic.com/start-ups/diversity-in-gaming-event-dogpatch-labs so she is a feminist cunt and most likely is part of cucking Larian (that's if Larian hasn't always been faggsvile). These progressive bitches need to get the fuck out of gaming and go ruin some other medium.

Oh God... So SHE is responsible for the TRASH lore and story in DOS games... It figures...

Also:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aposematism

 

[SlumLord]

Clearly progressive, red hair and most likely a feminist.

Read the second paragraph: '...with an MLitt in Hebrew...'

You know the old saying: "The jew cries out in pain as he strikes you!"

Also, from the link you posted:

'To mark International Women’s Day on 8 March, some of the leading women within the Irish gaming industry will come together at DogPatch Labs in Dublin to highlight what women are bringing to the table in game development.'



Answer: it starts with a 'd' and rhymes with 'mine'.


DraQ
Bro, you sound like more of a fag with every year that goes by. Hit the gym once in a while, it'll do you good.