Do you consider Disco Elysium an RPG?

[Vic]

Discuss why or why not.

 

[Harthwain]

Bro, you're late to the party.

 

[Vic]

Bro, you're late to the party.

let's settle this once and for all then.

Does the codex consider Disco Elysium to be an RPG or not? The votes so far are fairly even.

 

[BruceVC]

This has been debated several times before but its a good topic and still interesting

No I dont consider it a normal RPG, its an adventure game to me with RP elements. But its like asking is Kings Quest an RPG?

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Disco Elysium has neither combat nor exploration, and therefore is missing two of the three fundamental components (or sets of components) that define the RPG genre. It does borrow from RPGs character customization, in the form of attributes/skills that are utilized by the game, and character progression, in the form of experience that allows the player-character to gain levels and thereby increase said attributes/skills. However, vast numbers of computer games from various genres borrow these same elements, and in Disco Elysium the effects of these differences in character customization and development reside chiefly in the realm of providing the player with more or different flavor text. Moreover, Disco Elysium minimizes game mechanics in favor of extensive scripting, as is the case of the two pseudo-combats with Measurehead and the Tribunal, and the only "exploration" consists of moving the player-character around a relatively small area.

Though Disco Elysium isn't an adventure game, either, as in particular it lacks the puzzles that are vital to the adventure genre. Really, it's a digitized CYOA or gamebook.

 

[BruceVC]

Disco Elysium has neither combat nor exploration, and therefore is missing two of the three fundamental components (or sets of components) that define the RPG genre. It does borrow from RPGs character customization, in the form of attributes/skills that are utilized by the game, and character progression, in the form of experience that allows the player-character to gain levels and thereby increase said attributes/skills. However, vast numbers of computer games from various genres borrow these same elements, and the effects of these differences in character customization and development reside chiefly in the realm of providing the player with more or different flavor text. Moreover, Disco Elysium minimizes game mechanics in favor of extensive scripting, as is the case of the two pseudo-combats with Measurehead and the Tribunal, and the only "exploration" consists of moving the player-character around a relatively small area.

Though Disco Elysium isn't an adventure game, either, as in particular it lacks the puzzles that are vital to the adventure genre. Really, it's a digitized CYOA or gamebook.

So how would you classify Kings Quest or Quest for Glory?

 

[Darkozric]

 

[Nano]

Add a kingcomrade option, you fucking faggot.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

So how would you classify Kings Quest or Quest for Glory?

King's Quest is an adventure game series, while Hero's Quest Quest for Glory was intentionally designed as a hybrid of the adventure and RPG genres and therefore should be considered RPG-adjacent. Though the Quest for Glory games have more claim to being RPGs than a great many games calling themselves RPGs these days.

 

[Darkozric]

Disco is an isometric visual novel/CYOA. Quest for Glory on the other hand has combat. In QFG you use your skills to interact with the environment or to solve puzzles, in Disco they are dialogue driven.

Another wasted opportunity.

 

[Daedalos]

Of course it's an RPG: Let's review:

1. you play a role of a deadbeat downtrodden drunken cop that's got his life twisted and fucked up
2. There's PLENTY of skillchecks, skills, dialogue checks in the game
3. There's literal dice-rolls
4. There's plenty of C&C, good story, the dialogue system itself IS the "combat" mechanic if you will
5. You build your character in a character builder, you progress and level up, you use your skills in alot of places,
6. you explore the game

It doesn't have alot of traditional combat, and so the FUCK what? Combat isn't what defines a good RPG or even just an RPG to begin with.

It is NOT an adventure game, as adventure games tend to not have any of the above mentioned things in the game, other than exploring, clicking on shit, puzzles etc.

fuck y'all.

 

[Larianshill]

Too lacking in choices and consequences.

 

[fork]

It is not a question of opinion, but a matter of fact, that Disco Furry is not an RPG.
Thank you.

 

[whocares]

I will not eat the bugs. I will not live in a pod. I will not use 2FA.

 

[Jasede]

No combat
No sale

And if you tell me that one event at the end with the gun is "combat" please take a bath with your toaster.

 

[SunKing]

Yes and I am tired of people pretending its not

 

[Bloodeyes]

No. I liked the game a lot. I don't remember why I didn't finish it but I'll definitely go back to it and do that one day. I consider it an adventure game with many RPG mechanics. In the sense of being a game where you play a role, sure its got that covered, but I don't think RPGs are really about role playing as many understand it (playing pretend, acting). That's overly literal. RPGs are dice based dungeon crawlers where you kill monsters. The name is because you play a character that has a role (wizard, elf fighter etc). CRPGs are computer adaptations of those games. Due to the complete absence of combat this game isn't really the same genre as something like Fallout or Pathfinder: Kingmaker, both of which are pretty pure examples of the genre (whether you like the latter or not).

It has so many RPG features that it really blurs the line though, I can see someone calling it an RPG and understand why. You've got dice rolls, character stats, top down perspective. So this isn't a strong opinion. I just think that the "role playing" thing is just a name and RPGs are more about builds, combat and dungeon crawling and loot. It has builds but no combat so its only half an RPG. The dialogue stuff is just what you do in town between dungeons, its the least important part of an RPG. This makes a whole game out of that, but its targeted at people who enjoy "role play" more than RPGs so I can see why many on the Codex don't like it.

It activates one's growing frustration at our hobby being usurped by people who'd be better served by an amdram club, group therapy or a sex RP chat room than dice based dungeon crawling game. Its still a good game though, for what it is.

 

[Nazrim Eldrak]

There seems to be more than one adventure game with RPG elements:

* "Disco Elysium"
* "Pentiment"
* "Quest for Glory"
* "Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis" (It has combat in places)
* Etc.

How about we decide what mechanics are essential to an RPG and how well represented they are, and then decide what kind of RPG it is?

For example, a game with RPG elements not defined as an RPG by its creator is not an RPG.
Easy as fuck!

Another example might be a dubious game that contains RPG elements but is labeled as an RPG by its creator.

Here we could add adjectives like:

* wRPG = weak RPG
* fRPG = Fake RPG
* pRPG = pseudo RPG
* lRPG = light RPG
* etc.

E.g. I would refer to Pentiment as nRPG = no RPG

 

[LarryTyphoid]

While it's admirable to exclude mechanics typical of a genre if you don't believe those mechanics would serve your game's premise (DE is an urban detective game, so there's not a lot of justification for RPG battles), and doing the opposite of that has led to a lot of stagnation in the genre (take JRPGs, which often include absurd amounts of battles even and especially when it doesn't fit the story), genres still have standards, and it's hard to see DE as belonging to the same genre as foundational CRPGs like Wizardry or Ultima. That being said, genres are mostly there for marketing purposes rather than factual categorization. If DE's devs had described it as an adventure game, while it would've been more accurate, the typical adventure game demographic is both not very large, and not very suited to games like DE; but there is a lot of crossover between fans of games like Fallout with DE (since, for most people, a lot of dialogue with character customization and skill checks are the defining aspects of RPGs). So Disco Elysium was correct to categorize itself as an RPG, not because it's accurate, but because it marketed the game more to its intended target demographic. For a lot of people who like Fallout, the combat is only an obstacle to what they actually came to the game for (dialogue and C&C), so to these kinds of people, DE removing combat is a complete improvement anyway. This kind of thing is why you get combatfags saying that storyfags are the harbingers of decline.

 

[Piotrovitz]

Disco Elysium has neither combat nor exploration,

the only "exploration" consists of moving the player-character around a relatively small area.

Not defending the CYOA-ness of Disco, but how would you define exploration then?

Sure the game world is relatively small, but there is definitely feeling of exploration.
You navigate through the world, clear the fog of war, find new NPCs/items/quests/etc, can accidentally stumble upon hidden areas etc - how is this not exploration?

 

[ropetight]

Sorcery has playing roles, basic stats and dice rolls, exploration, even a combat.
It is not RPG, even if RPS and Cuckaku repeated that hundred times - it is CYOA.

Combat in Disco Elysium is closer to insult sword fight from Monkey Island than, let's say, GoldBox games.
DE looks like an isometric RPG, but it is detective CYOA with some adventure and RPG elements.

 

[Piotrovitz]

I wouldn't even go that far and call it CYOA (thrown left and right here like a worst insult) - it's just a point & click adventure game, with RPG-lite elements added for flavor.

 

[boluch]

Would you consider Disco Elysium an RPG if it had a dungeon full of monsters or bandits or communists that had to be cleared to complete the main quest? Would it become an RPG if said dungeon existed, but could also be bypassed with a speech check? A goblin camp in the swamp? Hostile wildlife? A quest to kill the mob boss?

 

[Darkozric]

It's not a fucking adventure game. First and foremost, from a gameplay perspective there are no puzzles nor police problem solving. Secondly, even if we were to take the term "adventure" literally, there is no sense of adventure in Disco.

In Fate of Atlantis you get to travel to 5-6 countries in 3 different continents, now this is what I call a fucking sense of adventure. In disco you"explore" one tiny neighborhood with some faggots in it.

Oh yeah, and at the end you travel to a tiny mostly empty island, how exciting.

Anyone who says that disco is a point & click adventure, he should bathe with his toaster, as Jasede said.

 

[luj1]

No I dont consider it a normal RPG, its an adventure game to me with RP elements.

I grew up on adventure games. Adventure games have gameplay other than reading. Let us not insult them.