Interview Feargus strikes again: NWN, KotNR, and IWD2

[whitemithrandir]

R00fles! Sarcasm is only cool when I do it.

No.

No. The fact that they hyped it at all doesn't matter. Afterall, your point was that SP was the focus of the game. It wans't. First off, everyone with half a brain knows that MP was from the get go. Period. Secondly, there was no SP. At all. There was on;ly the OC which can be played both in SP or MP. Sorry, use the quotes all you want as it won't change the facts.

Alright, suppose your point that NWN was a primarily MP game is valid. Exactly what did Bioware do to enhance the MP experience?

GEE, COULD IT BE:
1. Lack of PW support
2. Totally moronic hardcoding of skills and metamagic feats
3. TERR-IFIC incompatibility issues of the toolset with graphics engine that wasn't fixed until 1.61
4. Total slaughter of prestige classes by making classes like Archmage (which rules dictate should have spell slots on level up as if she leveled up in her primary class) nearly impossible
5. Totally inflexible HARDCODED polymorphing rules
6. A toolset that 6 years can use to make dungeon romps, but expert programmers can't modify ANY of the core rules
7. Total slaughter of familiars, summoning spells, epic feats...
8. Inconsistencies with the PHb that modders can only gawk at but not fix
9. Not making room for custom placeables

Tell me Volourn, if MP was the primary focus of NWN, what exactly did Bio-bore do to support it?

 

[Vault Dweller]

Afterall, your point was that SP was the focus of the game.

My point, since you obviously missed it, was not whether SP (both in NWN and NWN2) was/is the focus or not, but specific promises given in regard to gameplay.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

R00fles! Sarcasm is only cool when I do it.

Just trying to expand my talents. Sometimes, the role of the boorish eurocommie with mental issues gets to you, and you have to find new forms of expression.

 

[Volourn]

*ignores the troll*


"My point, since you obviously missed it, was not whether SP (both in NWN and NWN2) was/is the focus or not, but specific promises given in regard to gameplay."

If that was the point of your post, you should have said so instead bring up the erroneous fact that SP was the "focus" when it was not.

Sure, they made promises, and ghuess what many agree with them and many don't. Some people actually prefer NWN OC to BG2. Then again, those people must be braindead right ebcause they enjoy a game you don't? R00fles!

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Anyway, it's indisputable that VU did a terrible job of publishing and then supporting the game.

Back then, the agreement was for IPLY to pay for distribution for a larger amount of the take of sales. The problem was, IPLY decided it didn't really want to pay for distribution, but still wanted the large take of sales and would possibly pay it back afterwards. VU wasn't to blame, it was IPLY's management that once again took a dive.

First off, everyone with half a brain knows that MP was from the get go. Period. Secondly, there was no SP. At all. There was on;ly the OC which can be played both in SP or MP. Sorry, use the quotes all you want as it won't change the facts.

There are numerous quotes and interviews solely about how great the campaign would be, even if you never played it online nor touched the editors in any way. There's quotes from before and quotes from AFTER the release about how great the single player was.

And yes, the OC is single player. Just because you can also play in multiplayer doesn't make it any less a single player game. Notice that everyone has to wait in line to talk to Aribeth to get missions. Notice that when greeted, it says, "Hero of Neverwinter", as opposed to "Heroes". Everything in that regard is singular. Saying that the OC wasn't single player is like saying BG and BG2 aren't single player campaigns just because you could play that hacked in multiplayer.

 

[Volourn]

"There are numerous quotes and interviews solely about how great the campaign would be, even if you never played it online nor touched the editors in any way. There's quotes from before and quotes from AFTER the release about how great the single player was."

Uh. Another one misses the point. I never said they didn't hype the OC. Not once. I was referring strictly to VD's "focus" point. but, hey, throw out more red herrings.


"And yes, the OC is single player. Just because you can also play in multiplayer doesn't make it any less a single player game. Notice that everyone has to wait in line to talk to Aribeth to get missions. Notice that when greeted, it says, "Hero of Neverwinter", as opposed to "Heroes". Everything in that regard is singular. Saying that the OC wasn't single player is like saying BG and BG2 aren't single player campaigns just because you could play that hacked in multiplayer."

No. there's vast differences between the OC and BG series when it comes to MP. BG2's MP was tagged on as an extra. The OC is designed for use as SP or MP. It was designed (mostly) for that in mind. Hence, all the crying when people found out that HOTU *was* SP only (though, MP is possible since that's what i'm doing now). There's a reason why the OC is tagged as the OC and SP campaign for the most part.

 

[Sarkile]

For someone who can tell everyone when they're missing the point, you sure seem to have trouble dealing with the fact that VD didn't say anything about Bioware focusing on singleplayer.

 

[Volourn]

Hahahahaha.


Exitium wrote: Honestly hmm what's wrong with focusing on the single player campaign of NWN2? I don't get you guys, sometimes. Would you prefer a focus on multiplayer, or what?

Vault Dweller wrote: Talk is cheap. Weren't we told exactly the same thing about the original NWN?


He's obviously stating in response to Exitum that we were told the focus of NWN1 was the SP.

Game over. You lose.

 

[Sarkile]

True enough. I think I confused the different NWN threads.

 

[whitemithrandir]

No. there's vast differences between the OC and BG series when it comes to MP. BG2's MP was tagged on as an extra. The OC is designed for use as SP or MP. It was designed (mostly) for that in mind. Hence, all the crying when people found out that HOTU *was* SP only (though, MP is possible since that's what i'm doing now). There's a reason why the OC is tagged as the OC and SP campaign for the most part.

I have problems understanding where you're coming from. The original NWN OC was NOT designed for multiplayer. The module code was designed for both multiplayer and single player but the module itself wasn't. Can you play with more than one player online? Sure thing. Does the plot and mechianics in the campaign tailor itself to multiple players? No. In short:

The campaign can be played multiplayer, yes, but the plot, the npc's the mechanics were tailored to single player. So in effect, it was a single player campaign.

As for HoTU being a single player campaign: where'd you hear that? I went through it twice with my family on LAN.

 

[Volourn]

"where'd you hear that?"

R00fles!

 

[jiujitsu]

Is there no hope for a good rpg in our future?

 

[Vault Dweller]

Hahahahaha.


Exitium wrote: Honestly hmm what's wrong with focusing on the single player campaign of NWN2? I don't get you guys, sometimes. Would you prefer a focus on multiplayer, or what?

Vault Dweller wrote: Talk is cheap. Weren't we told exactly the same thing about the original NWN?


He's obviously stating in response to Exitum that we were told the focus of NWN1 was the SP.

Game over. You lose.

I meant that whatever Feargus said about great qualities of NWN2 was said before in regard to NWN. That's what I quoted and commented on in the news topic. I don't give a damn what they focus on as long as SP is decent.

 

[whitemithrandir]

"where'd you hear that?"

R00fles!

Unacceptable answer to my question. No seriously, what the hell are you talking about?

 

[Jed]

Can we get a "R00fles" filter on these boards?

Seriously, Volourn, I know you're a little batty and all, but whitemithrandir has made two non-ad hominem posts filled with good points and you've utterly failed to respond to them. What's up with that shit?

 

[FrankHorrigan]

Every village has to have an idiot.

 

[Talorc]

OC?

This has been shitting me off ever since I started reading about NWN -

WHAT THE FECK DOES OC STAND FOR?

I bought NWN Gold in a moment of weakness (It was well cheap and I was very bored) - which bit is the OC? Is it the part where you start out as an ugly looking noob adventurer, with no party, and have to go through a lame ass "tutorial" dungeon, till some unexplained bad guys pop in and try and kill the hot elf chick? I think thats as far as I got before I lost interest.

Does it get any better after that?

 

[Vault Dweller]

Official campaign. The answer to the last question is no.

 

[mr. lamat]

original campaign... not modified by fans with the toolset.

 

[Volourn]

VD, ok, that's much better. That is understandable. However, there's a big difference between NWN1 and NWN2 and that's the simple fact is that obsidian is focusing on the OC/SP/whatever you wanna call it from the get go no questions asked; and not just cutting in midswing because of bellyaching fans.

X, sorry, but I don't give seriosu replies to silly trolls.

I'll discuss things with you, VD,. and others; but not trolls. I'm anti troll. Period.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Granted, the fact that they are doing that helps, but what the results will be are unclear. NWN sucks not because Bio can't do better, but because they choose to for variety of reasons, while claiming the opposite. Feargus may do the same for the same reasons, and his latest games certainly don't prove me wrong.

Don't get me wrong though, I'm not saying that Obsidian/Feargus suck. I wish them well and hope that they will make great games. However, I wouldn't take any statements from him at face value, and that was my point. I guess, KOTOR 2 will show us what Feargus & Co are capable of.

 

[Jed]

X, sorry, but I don't give seriosu replies to silly trolls.

Your definition of "troll" seems to include anyone who disagrees with you. You should go into politics.
Don't ever let me hear you say how much you value debate or discussion.

 

[Volourn]

"they choose to for variety of reasons, while claiming the opposite"

No, they didn't do the opposite; at least not the way you imply. It's not like purposely "tanked" the OC out of spite. I'm sure when they were making it they felt that they could make it "as good as BG series"; but alas not even devs can live up to their "high standards" all the time. Of course, 'lest we forget, there are those Z(morons I'm sure) who actually prefer the OC over BG. Go figure.

As for Obsidian and NWN2; I've heard one thing from Feargus and co. that i dislike so far. So far, their design seems solid... We shall see..

"Your definition of "troll" seems to include anyone who disagrees with you. You should go into politics."
"
Nope. not true. Consdiering a good portion of this board disagrees with me yet I'm discussing with most of them perhaps you should be ask why is White being singled out instead of making things up like 'Volourn accuses everyone who disagrees with him of being a troll" when you know that isn't true.


Don't ever let me hear you say how much you value debate or discussion."

Or what? You gonna come to 644 Lakeshore Dr Unit 36 North Bay, Ontario, Kanada and teach me a lesson? I'll be waitin'...

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Waffle Status: Roffled.

 

[Vault Dweller]

It's not like purposely "tanked" the OC out of spite. I'm sure when they were making it they felt that they could make it "as good as BG series"

Not out of spite, of course. There are many reasons why developers release a crappy, in our understanding, game. MW is a good example.