Forcing the console generation to enjoy the real stuff

[Topher]

I got someone new into HoMM3 and MoO2 a few years back; however, he's almost totally reverted and now plays HoMM5 instead... bastard.

Also, it's kinda funny that Fallout was pretty much my first RPG and I'm 25. I started gaming on my brothers hand me down 2600 and worked my up through my old PC486 and the various consoles but ended up sticking mostly to the PC and entirely skipped the N64/PS generation but I suppose the fact that I even own a 360 makes me a "newfag console tard" or something . Thing is that I believe you can enjoy the new and the old so long as you have good taste and aren't a total graphics whore.

Good taste is developed by the way because people sure as hell aren't born with it.

 

[Forest Dweller]

What's with all the non-rpg suggestions? PST seems to be the next logical choice. After that I guess either Fallout or Arcanum. Then I guess you can start with the increasingly dumbed down: first Bloodlines, then The Witcher and Obsidian games, and then Bio games. Finish with Oblivion.

Gothic 1 and 2 while fun are barely rpgs - they're mostly adventure games. More so with Gothic 1; I suppose Gothic 2 would be alright. Haven't played the third yet. Arx Fatalis I'm not sure about. Does that game have C&C and dialogue trees?

Also I would obviously suggested Deus Ex but he said he played it already and it's one of his favorite games. There is hope! I suppose you could throw in Deus Ex 2 later on if he hasn't played that one yet.

 

[Sonic The Hedgehog]

Vampire Bloodlines, Gothic and Morrowind are too easy again, it's not far enough from modern games.

It's allowing the child to hold onto the side for a few good seconds after he was thrown into the deep end.

Wizardry 8 is allowing somebody to forcibly push him underwater, for laughs.

 

[overtenemy]

NO MERCY

Star Trail.

Watching the the great spectacle that will be his entire party contracting and then dying of rabies will be entirely worth him swearing off good video games for the rest of his life.

 

[Sonic The Hedgehog]

What's with all the non-rpg suggestions? PST seems to be the next logical choice. After that I guess either Fallout or Arcanum. Then I guess you can start with the increasingly dumbed down: first Bloodlines, then The Witcher and Obsidian games, and then Bio games. Finish with Oblivion.

Gothic 1 and 2 while fun are barely rpgs - they're mostly adventure games. More so with Gothic 1; I suppose Gothic 2 would be alright. Haven't played the third yet. Arx Fatalis I'm not sure about. Does that game have C&C and dialogue trees?

Also I would obviously suggested Deus Ex but he said he played it already and it's one of his favorite games. There is hope! I suppose you could throw in Deus Ex 2 later on if he hasn't played that one yet.

What's with all the modern suggestions? If he's played Fallout 2 he doesn't really need to play any of the above minus one 3D first person title.

Tactical and old school RPGs are the order of the day after Fallout 2. No question that's where the detoxification process actually kicks in.

 

[sprayahen]

Good to see all this feedback

As the "console tard" Bruticus refers to at the start of this thread, I have to admit I'm impressed a simple experiment like this has drawn so much response. I've read through all the replies and found the solutions to my poor gaming taste to be thoroughly enjoyable. It's been suggested that I be shot, kidnapped, and even threatened with cock. Good stuff, but unnecessary. I'm perfectly willing to try new things, and FO2 is actually growing on me every time I play. And I absolutely will finish the game; as Bruticus said, I'll do so out of spite if I have to. Furthermore, I saw some great suggestions in here, and I know some of you definitely have a good idea how to turn on an outsider to RPG style gameplay. Suggesting Deus Ex and Thief really caught my eye; I've played both Deus Ex games and three games in the Thief series. Again, good stuff. Anyway, I appreciate everyone's feedback, and sincerely hope that the game I try after FO2 is a little more accessible but still respectable. I updated the blog with a new entry for those of you who want to keep up (sprayahen.wordpress.com), and any tips are greatly appreciated. By the way, I'm decidedly not emo in any way.

 

[SCO]

NO MERCY

Star Trail.

Watching the the great spectacle that will be his entire party contracting and then dying of rabies will be entirely worth him swearing off good video games for the rest of his life.

Blade of destiny my man.
Being lost in cities because all houses look the same is nice, but
having to check out all the houses to progress the main quest ... priceless.

But its a good game i enjoyed the traveling little scenes.
Reminded me of darklands. That you should play, because it is one of the most unique games in the history of gaming.

 

[DraQ]

Re: Good to see all this feedback

As the "console tard" Bruticus refers to at the start of this thread, I have to admit I'm impressed a simple experiment like this has drawn so much response.

We, of the Codex, are bored (almost no decent RPGs being produced and nothing that would actually try to qualitatively improve the genre from it roots as simplistic dungeon crawls and PnP emulators without GM), jaded (crap being pushed as RPGs, players - mostly consoletards, actual ones - gobbling it up) and irritated.

By the way, I'm decidedly not emo in any way.

Good, but you may want to be a little bit of a sociopath to enjoy it here.

Vampire Bloodlines, Gothic and Morrowind are too easy again, it's not far enough from modern games.

It's allowing the child to hold onto the side for a few good seconds after he was thrown into the deep end.

Wizardry 8 is allowing somebody to forcibly push him underwater, for laughs.

I never really understood the whole "wizardy8 is teh hard" thing, TBH.

Ok, Arnika road could be a bit unforgiving, and the battles against Gregor and crabs in the gazebo overlooking the crash site were prone to turning into rape (Gregor battle would then be a positive example of inverse gangbang), but the game was easy to learn, had smooth interface and cool atmosphere. I was thrilled with it as my first encounter with the subgenre, though random encounters that plague this game may throw people off.


All in all we should show the best the genre has to offer - FO1&2 (and Arcanum, but it waits on my HDD waiting for me to have enough free time to start playing it) for nonlinearity, PST for storytelling, Wiz8 for the atmosphere of adventuring with party, Daggerfall, for huge, procedural world and labyrinthine dungeons, Morrowind for lore and exploration, and Witcher for a good example of good recent RPG plus interesting implementation of C&C.

Wrap it up with vanilla Oblivion - if he does scream in horror and throws stuff at the loathsome visage of it, his recovery from casualness is complete.

Also, throw the Anachronox in somewhere as it is the only JPG (not JRPG!) even the Codex agrees on being good.

 

[RatFink]

Gamers just have an almost compulsive desire to do everything and in games like Fallout and Arcanum you cant do everything.

exactly my problem hehe
thats why i played fo2 EXCESSIVELY.
always want to know how scenarios can play out differently..but i always end up playing basically the same character.
right now im trying a whole new approach with a mage in pst and its great fun.
im already excited to see how everything plays out when i give arcanum another spin..never came farther then the first town.

..to my shame i have to admit that my first contact with "rpg" was the first gothic shortly after it was released.
my computer was fucked at a lanparty..couldnt connect to anything :mystery:
so i decided to play gothic and was just killing stuff until level 7...then i got into the flow and started playing the story. i was hooked! next time that happened was fallout, after buying the 3 games box set, cause i was quite intrigued by the setting. at that time i couldnt get the first one to run so i started fo2 and didnt leave it for 2 months. i say its partly responsible for my bad grades in the graduation exams

so keep going mate! play the classics!

now im off to buy BBQ sauce. its ribs tonight

 

[Elzair]

Re: Good to see all this feedback

As the "console tard" Bruticus refers to at the start of this thread, I have to admit I'm impressed a simple experiment like this has drawn so much response. I've read through all the replies and found the solutions to my poor gaming taste to be thoroughly enjoyable. It's been suggested that I be shot, kidnapped, and even threatened with cock. Good stuff, but unnecessary. I'm perfectly willing to try new things, and FO2 is actually growing on me every time I play. And I absolutely will finish the game; as Bruticus said, I'll do so out of spite if I have to. Furthermore, I saw some great suggestions in here, and I know some of you definitely have a good idea how to turn on an outsider to RPG style gameplay. Suggesting Deus Ex and Thief really caught my eye; I've played both Deus Ex games and three games in the Thief series. Again, good stuff. Anyway, I appreciate everyone's feedback, and sincerely hope that the game I try after FO2 is a little more accessible but still respectable. I updated the blog with a new entry for those of you who want to keep up (sprayahen.wordpress.com), and any tips are greatly appreciated. By the way, I'm decidedly not emo in any way.

I vote again for Ultima VII. If you can get it running, it IS quite a bit more accessible than most RPGs the Codex considers.

 

[KalosKagathos]

Anyway, I try to put my points to good use, improving lockpicking, first aid, speech, and small guns primarily.

He still has so, so much to learn.

 

[DraQ]

Anyway, I try to put my points to good use, improving lockpicking, first aid, speech, and small guns primarily.

He still has so, so much to learn.

Hush. Improving speech right off the boat is a good prognosis in itself.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

What's with all the non-rpg suggestions? PST seems to be the next logical choice.

The terrible combat and page long dialogues are enough to make any person not used to rpgs to run away screaming for Todd's juicy teat.

Hush. Improving speech right off the boat is a good prognosis in itself.

The simple fact that only one of the skills is directly related to combat is already a great sign.

 

[Forest Dweller]

What's with all the non-rpg suggestions? PST seems to be the next logical choice.

The terrible combat and page long dialogues are enough to make any person not used to rpgs to run away screaming for Todd's juicy teat.

I found it more accessible than Fallout because the combat was easier (for fuck's sake, you're immortal) and there was always something interesting (and interesting characters) around every corner. Unlike parts of Fallout where the bleakness can seem a bit boring if you're not talking to people. And the writing should just suck you in if you have any taste. As far as the reading walls of text thing, that's only an issue for someone who doesn't really read books. And didn't the OP say this guy is a reader? In all honesty I think for someone who reads a lot PST is a better opener for them, since you mostly just have to worry about the dialogue.

 

[DraQ]

Before too long I come across my first rat, and am pleasantly surprised when one smash with the crowbar ends the battle, splattering blood in the process. Makes me feel pretty powerful, really.

I am reminded* of the 2001 opening scene with the crude bone club being raised in the air in a gesture of new-found power, then the shot of spinning bone thrown into the air cuts to the shot of rocket.

*Sigh*

They grow up so fast.



*) Everyone who wasn't is, obviously, a faggot.

 

[Hory]

Re: Good to see all this feedback

I vote again for Ultima VII. If you can get it running, it IS quite a bit more accessible than most RPGs the Codex considers.

In what way? I ask because I've never played it and am considering it.

 

[nomask7]

Re: Good to see all this feedback

As the "console tard" Bruticus refers to at the start of this thread, I have to admit I'm impressed a simple experiment like this has drawn so much response. I've read through all the replies and found the solutions to my poor gaming taste to be thoroughly enjoyable. It's been suggested that I be shot, kidnapped, and even threatened with cock. Good stuff, but unnecessary. I'm perfectly willing to try new things, and FO2 is actually growing on me every time I play. And I absolutely will finish the game; as Bruticus said, I'll do so out of spite if I have to. Furthermore, I saw some great suggestions in here, and I know some of you definitely have a good idea how to turn on an outsider to RPG style gameplay. Suggesting Deus Ex and Thief really caught my eye; I've played both Deus Ex games and three games in the Thief series. Again, good stuff. Anyway, I appreciate everyone's feedback, and sincerely hope that the game I try after FO2 is a little more accessible but still respectable. I updated the blog with a new entry for those of you who want to keep up (sprayahen.wordpress.com), and any tips are greatly appreciated. By the way, I'm decidedly not emo in any way.

Gothic 2: Night of the Raven would be a good next-step. As in the Fallouts, there are different ways of getting ahead, and different paths, metaphorical and otherwise, you can take to achieve goals and beat the game. It has no level-scaled monsters / loot, so you have to be careful in your work as a part-time courier, but the rewards can be real (that is to say, rewarding). Travelling in this game is interesting, challenging, the game world is compact and detailed, and the monsters aren't there to be hunted as they would in a holiday monster-hunting hobby game but are there rather to be avoided as you would expect in any realistic game world.

Other things you should know: in the ini file, the developers recommend using the default controls because it's more challenging and fun, I used them when I first played the game as an RPG noob and I concur, it's more fun; the game was designed for melee fighters (it's not nearly as interesting nor challenging if you specialize in bows or magic); there's lots of stuff to find out, you can find most of that stuff out by reading 'net tutorials and walkthroughs if you want to spoil the experience; the combat controls may seem clumsy at first, but whatever they may seem, if you accept that the game developers knew what they were doing (and they did) and just play the game, you may find that the experience will be much more fun and rewarding than what more beginner-friendly systems can achieve (i.e. the balance and controls in G2: NotR are by far the best I've come across, and the learning curve is about the same as in learning real sword fighting, except, of course, compressed in time to the point of being reasonable in a forty-hour game, plus you don't have to learn it very well, since it's not a monster-hunting game; the worse fighter you are, the more challenging and fun the travelling).

P.S. If you have trouble with graphical glitches, use older display drivers, or even an older graphix card.

P.P.S. DO NOT USE MODS, NOR THE UNOFFICIAL "PATCH".

 

[nomask7]

Anyway, I try to put my points to good use, improving lockpicking, first aid, speech, and small guns primarily.

He still has so, so much to learn.

And how is that a bad thing?

In before power-gaming larpers.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

BG 2.

I thought about BG2 but I didn't really like it all that much. It's over hyped IMO and was thinking PST would be a better choice as far as the infinity engine goes. I'm wondering if I shouldn't mix things up though, give him a different style RPG like Arx Fatalis or something. Reading his blog after he tries to cast a few spells in the heat of a battle would be hilarious.

PST will bore him to tears. Seriously, even some people here didn't have the patience to finish it. BG 2 is a lot more fun and casual while still being an old-school RPG.

 

[Phelot]

BG 2.

I thought about BG2 but I didn't really like it all that much. It's over hyped IMO and was thinking PST would be a better choice as far as the infinity engine goes. I'm wondering if I shouldn't mix things up though, give him a different style RPG like Arx Fatalis or something. Reading his blog after he tries to cast a few spells in the heat of a battle would be hilarious.

PST will bore him to tears. Seriously, even some people here didn't have the patience to finish it. BG 2 is a lot more fun and casual while still being an old-school RPG.

Just curious, what was boring about it? The writing? It occurs to me that people either abandon it quickly due to all the writing (or they don't like the style for whatever reason) or they absolutely love it.

 

[Bruticis]

BG 2.

snip...

PST will bore him to tears. Seriously, even some people here didn't have the patience to finish it. BG 2 is a lot more fun and casual while still being an old-school RPG.

Really? See I found PST to be more compelling because of the story. I wanted to progress just to get more. BG2 was OK, don't get me wrong, but it got pretty dull for me about mid game.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

BG 2.

I thought about BG2 but I didn't really like it all that much. It's over hyped IMO and was thinking PST would be a better choice as far as the infinity engine goes. I'm wondering if I shouldn't mix things up though, give him a different style RPG like Arx Fatalis or something. Reading his blog after he tries to cast a few spells in the heat of a battle would be hilarious.

PST will bore him to tears. Seriously, even some people here didn't have the patience to finish it. BG 2 is a lot more fun and casual while still being an old-school RPG.

Just curious, what was boring about it? The writing? It occurs to me that people either abandon it quickly due to all the writing (or they don't like the style for whatever reason) or they absolutely love it.

I just couldn't get into it. You'd have better luck asking someone smarter as to why it isn't a compelling game (maybe DU) but yeah I guess the walls of text have a part in it. You sit down to play a computer game, you want to play a computer game. Stopping every 5 seconds to read all that text breaks the pace, not to mention the combat was abysmal.

 

[DraQ]

BG 2.

I thought about BG2 but I didn't really like it all that much. It's over hyped IMO and was thinking PST would be a better choice as far as the infinity engine goes. I'm wondering if I shouldn't mix things up though, give him a different style RPG like Arx Fatalis or something. Reading his blog after he tries to cast a few spells in the heat of a battle would be hilarious.

PST will bore him to tears. Seriously, even some people here didn't have the patience to finish it. BG 2 is a lot more fun and casual while still being an old-school RPG.

Just curious, what was boring about it? The writing? It occurs to me that people either abandon it quickly due to all the writing (or they don't like the style for whatever reason) redding being teh hard or they absolutely love it.

I just couldn't get into it. You'd have better luck asking someone smarter as to why it isn't a compelling game (maybe DU) but yeah I guess the walls of text have a part in it. You sit down to play a computer game, you want to play a computer game. Stopping every 5 seconds to read all that text breaks the pace, not to mention the combat was abysmal.

of

 

[Phelot]

BG 2.

I thought about BG2 but I didn't really like it all that much. It's over hyped IMO and was thinking PST would be a better choice as far as the infinity engine goes. I'm wondering if I shouldn't mix things up though, give him a different style RPG like Arx Fatalis or something. Reading his blog after he tries to cast a few spells in the heat of a battle would be hilarious.

PST will bore him to tears. Seriously, even some people here didn't have the patience to finish it. BG 2 is a lot more fun and casual while still being an old-school RPG.

Just curious, what was boring about it? The writing? It occurs to me that people either abandon it quickly due to all the writing (or they don't like the style for whatever reason) or they absolutely love it.

I just couldn't get into it. You'd have better luck asking someone smarter as to why it isn't a compelling game (maybe DU) but yeah I guess the walls of text have a part in it. You sit down to play a computer game, you want to play a computer game. Stopping every 5 seconds to read all that text breaks the pace, not to mention the combat was abysmal.

I can see that. Personally, I loved the reading maybe because I like it when they describe a character or body language in depth while still leaving room for the player's imagination.

I genuinely enjoyed hearing all the weird and crazy shit that goes on as well as all the revelations and turns in the story. It was more like an adventure game, though I am one of those rare people that enjoyed the combat. Plain and simple action-RPG albeit with certain broken parts.

 

[DraQ]

I can see that. Personally, I loved the reading maybe because I like it when they describe a character or body language in depth while still leaving room for the player's imagination.

I genuinely enjoyed hearing all the weird and crazy shit that goes on as well as all the revelations and turns in the story. It was more like an adventure game, though I am one of those rare people that enjoyed the combat. Plain and simple action-RPG albeit with certain broken parts.

I didn't enjoy combat itself, but the combat music helped build the atmosphere and spell animations were cool.