Review GameTap praises MotB - 7/10

[Kingston]

Could you have released MotB as a stand-alone game?

 

[pug987]

I don't think the new camera modes deserve all the bashing they get. I didn't like the original camera modes at all but the new strategy mode is exactly the way I would want the camera to behave. I really don't see any major flaw in it although it may could have used a little tweeking. As for the character mode, I just used it to look at my characters and the backgrounds from a smaller distance.

The biggest problem with all those reviews is that they whine about the spirit meter. Just because they refuse to think they emediately bash a game that gives you a challenge. I've seen people (playing good characters) complain about the spirit meter and they hadn't even got eternal rest (the single most effective way to keep the spirit meter high when you're playing a good character)! I too have some objections about the way it was implemented (mainly suppress which I think should give only lawful and not good point - a lawful evil character would want to resist his hunger and there are already two more abilities that justly give good points, I hope this gets changed by a patch) but if I had to chose I'd definitely want the spirit meter in the game. And it's really not that hard to keep it under control. Second time you play the game it won't even be an issue. Now with these people complaining, the next time a company decides to implement an interesting, challenging and perhaps slightly controversial feature in their games they'll think twice about it.

 

[Ladonna]

Could you have released MotB as a stand-alone game?

Has any RPG been released where you start out as level 20 (That wasn't an expansion)?

 

[Helton]

Now with these people complaining, the next time a company decides to implement an interesting, challenging and perhaps slightly controversial feature in their games they'll think twice about it.

Good?

What's with the sycophantism? If the reviews aren't sky-high, if the sales aren't block-busting, and if people actually complain about crappy features we'll never get a decent game again!

Get off it. You don't have to be a non-thinking mouth breather to see the spirit-meter wasn't thought out well. It was a poorly implemented feature, it ruined the enjoyment for some people. That lowers scores.

 

[elander_]

I think the message is clear, you either do these games in the cinematic format they want or you are screwed. No mater how good the dialog or texts are, they will always find some lame excuse to give you a bad score.

Given that this expansion wasn't properly a success i expect Obsidian new Aliens rpg to a Mass Effect clone. It would be dumb for them to sell it with a camera perspective like NWN2. If the game is supposed to have an editor it would be nice if a strategy camera mode and a TB combat mode could be used for people who make mods but putting it on the main game would be committing suicide.

 

[Lumpy]

Could you have released MotB as a stand-alone game?

Has any RPG been released where you start out as level 20 (That wasn't an expansion)?

Baldur's Gate 2?

 

[Vault Dweller]

What's with the sycophantism? If the reviews aren't sky-high...

The reviews are decent, the scores aren't. I thought I already explained that point above. There is nothing wrong with 8/10 theoretically, but when most new games get 9.5-10, 8 means mediocre.

...and if people actually complain about crappy features we'll never get a decent game again!

Explain why it's a crappy feature. I played both good and utterly evil characters. In both cases the spirit system didn't hinder my progress. So, while it could have been better, there is nothing wrong with it except for the alignment adjustments.

It was a poorly implemented feature, it ruined the enjoyment for some morons.

Fixed.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Has any RPG been released where you start out as level 20 (That wasn't an expansion)?

Baldur's Gate 2?

You start at lvl 7.

 

[cardtrick]

Has any RPG been released where you start out as level 20 (That wasn't an expansion)?

Baldur's Gate 2?

You start at lvl 7.

Clearly you don't actually start at 20 in BG2. That obviously wasn't the point, though . . . Ladonna was asking a rhetorical question, implying that clearly MOTB couldn't be released as a standalone, since your characters don't start at level 1. Lumpy pointed out that in BG2 your characters started at the level they would have been at the end of BG1 . . . the actual number 20 was never important. (Especially since you don't start MOTB at level 20 anyway . . . it's really 18 or something.)

There are other and better reasons that MOTB couldn't have been released as a standalone:

1) The engine is virtually unchanged. You think the game got poor scores as an expansion? I imagine they would have been worse if the game were released as a full sequel using an old engine. That's the kind of thing reviewers love to pick on.

2) More importantly, the NWN series revolves largely around the toolset. It doesn't make much sense to offer a standalone game in that context. You would dramatically increase the mod compatibility issues that are already going to be a problem. Not to mention: would the standalone MOTB allow you to play NWN2 mods? If not, why not? If so, why would you ever buy NWN2?

3) It's just too short. Standalone RPGs are expected to be sprawling, lengthy experiences these days. A 15-20 hour expansion wouldn't cut it.

EDIT: Compatability is not equal to computability. Fact.

 

[Micmu]

NWN 1's first expansion was intended to start as lvl. 1, too, IIRC.

 

[ricolikesrice]

3) It's just too short. Standalone RPGs are expected to be sprawling, lengthy experiences these days. A 15-20 hour expansion wouldn't cut it.

sarcasm ?

Jade Empire and Mass Effect (well dont know for sure as i didnt play it, but the (p)reviews are talking about 18-30h, no ? ) are just as long/short as MOTB and IMHO offer less replayability (JE atleast, cant tell for ME) which should be taken into account when talking lenght too.
Oblivion did maybe have 10-20 hours + an extra 100 hours of LARPING for morons.

i ll agree on that MOTB might not have worked well as a standalone for different reasons, but that point strikes me as odd....

 

[Elwro]

Don't you start really high level in Pools of Darkness or Chaos Strikes Back?

 

[Volourn]

"You're being rather silly cupcake, why would you dwell on the negatives when there are so many positives to consider?"

I believe in telling the truth. Even with games I really like, I have no problem pointing out things I dislike (ie. NWN OC's having ph@t lewt in barrels or BL's HORRIBLE combat).


"I don't want to sound pretentious but am I the only one here who really liked NWN2?"

I like(d) NWN2 too. But, don't tell Obsidian fanboys that. They won't believe you.


"The original camera controls for the boxed, unpatched version on NWN2 were virtually IDENTICAL to NWN1 and yet many seemed to hate them, even the community members, who ironically claimed to love the camera controls in NWN1. Many people claimed the controls were different, but remember, I have the code and I know the truth . "

Heh. I'm one of those people. And, while the camera controls may have been technically the same as NWN1's; they surely felt different. I do know I can't play NWN2 for hours on end like NWN1 simply because I get annoyed having to fight the camera. I'm used to it now; and so it's manageable now; but not a preference.


"It was a poorly implemented feature, it ruined the enjoyment for some morons.

Fixed."

Yeah. they're morons because they parrot your opinions. L0LLIGAGZ!


"Jade Empire and Mass Effect (well dont know for sure as i didnt play it, but the (p)reviews are talking about 18-30h, no ? ) are just as long/short as MOTB and IMHO offer less replayability"

JE may be 'short'; but don't bash its role-playing or replayability. For a so called 'action rpg'; it does a better job of that stuff than most so called 'full fledge rpgs'.


@ Spirit Meter: I haven't played much since getting the SM (I'm still *really* early in Act 2); but from what i've seen and heard I like the concept overall. However, from the sounds of it, they got it to effect alignments way too much. I'll see though. Obviously, though, it doesn't break the game since it is still completeable. *shrug*

 

[elander_]

I don't noticed anything but could anyone explain in a rational way what's the big difference between NWN1 camera and NWN2? The man said the two modes are virtually the same so if it doesn't feel the same then the problem is certainly not from the game but from some dumbfucks with Alzheimer who can't remember what they have played in the last month.

How do you go changing something based on a forum feedback from guys that may not have even played the first NWN1? Listen to a forum community blindly can only lead to disaster.

 

[Futile Rhetoric]

I believe in telling the truth. Even with games I really like, I have no problem pointing out things I dislike (ie. NWN OC's having ph@t lewt in barrels or BL's HORRIBLE combat).

First off precious, sometimes you'd be better off by not telling what you think is the "truth"; it'd result in a whole lot less dumbfuckery.

Secondly, no one is lying; the negatives (and there are some negatives, yes) get mentioned less because people generally enjoy the game. You see, if I've just had the best sex of my life, and you point out to me that the lady in question had a queer-looking birthmark on her arm, I may even agree with you, but I quite obviously won't let that change my opinion of the overall experience.

 

[Volourn]

Your rhetoric is futile.

 

[Helton]

The reviews are decent, the scores aren't. I thought I already explained that point above. There is nothing wrong with 8/10 theoretically, but when most new games get 9.5-10, 8 means mediocre.

That's what happens when you cut a sentence into fragments, they lose their meaning. I'm not going to debate the woes of rating inflation with you. I honestly don't care.

Explain why it's a crappy feature. I played both good and utterly evil characters. In both cases the spirit system didn't hinder my progress. So, while it could have been better, there is nothing wrong with it except for the alignment adjustments.

The alignment adjustments were off. It encourages metagaming. It could have been better is exactly my point. You concede that and still pretend you're contradicting me, why?

Is it because I used the word "crappy"? Hyperbole. People complain about it and they're ruining the genre ZOMG!. That's stupid and sycophantic.

Now with these people complaining, the next time a company decides to implement an interesting, challenging and perhaps slightly controversial feature in their games they'll think twice about it.

And if Obsidian had "thought twice" we might have gotten a better implemented Spirit-Hunger.

It was a poorly implemented feature, it ruined the enjoyment for some morons.

Fixed.

Lol you made a funny!

 

[Vault Dweller]

I honestly don't care.

You care enough to discuss this subject apparently.

The alignment adjustments were off. It encourages metagaming. It could have been better is exactly my point. You concede that and still pretend you're contradicting me, why?

Is it because I used the word "crappy"? Hyperbole.

There is a difference between a decent feature that *could* have been better and a bad/poor feature that *should* have been better.

People complain about it and they're ruining the genre ZOMG!. That's stupid and sycophantic.

If you say so.

And if Obsidian had "thought twice" we might have gotten a better implemented Spirit-Hunger.

What exactly is the problem with the spirit meter? Other than the already mentioned alignment that upset your delicate sensibilities so.

 

[Futile Rhetoric]

While the alignment change on Suppress is incredibly annoying, it also makes perfect sense; it should require considerable mental control to suppress your hunger -- mind over matter and all that.

 

[Futile Rhetoric]

Your rhetoric is futile.

It's not just a clever name, hon. The nickname was chosen exactly because the internet is a big bad place filled with dumbfucks not unlike yourself. You aren't telling myself or anyone else anything new, and pointing it out does not make you seem any less a fool.

 

[HanoverF]

While the alignment change on Suppress is incredibly annoying, it also makes perfect sense; it should require considerable mental control to suppress your hunger -- mind over matter and all that.

And considerable mental control is only the domain of the Lawful Good?

 

[Futile Rhetoric]

While the alignment change on Suppress is incredibly annoying, it also makes perfect sense; it should require considerable mental control to suppress your hunger -- mind over matter and all that.

And considerable mental control is only the domain of the Lawful Good?

No, it's lawful. Suppress is also good because you choose the considerable effort over feeding on a soul.

 

[Keldorn]

"The REALLY sad thing is that all those morons who gave it 7-8/10 acknowledged that it was a pretty good game, better than most shit they saw in years. Yet their scores ensure that it will be awhile until we see games like that again."

And, those whine about it should get 9s or 10s or how much 'better' than it is than x gaem (usually Oblivion is the target) tend to ignore MOTB's faults.

Don't get me wrong. It's a good game; but overrated.

Apparently, you rate it lower than 2 Worlds...

 

[Volourn]

Don't make stuff up Keldorn. It's embarassing.

 

[Keldorn]

Don't make stuff up Keldorn. It's embarassing.

Yet your smug, self-induced aura of pseudo-invincibility, your self-induced complex of elitist superiority and your self-induced myopic response to your own self-induced sense of infallibility is rather amusing...

...even if you DO rate 2 Worlds (slightly) lower than MotB.


BTW, without the brilliant & progressive minds "making stuff up" and willing to risk appearing foolish, there would be no CRPG's.


meep-meep.