Game News In 2008 his swords become sharper still!

[mondblut]

Second,

Then the game must have been complete and utter shit in the first place...

Congratulations, you are. See, it is spelled "D-a-r-k_U-n-d-e-r-l-o-r-d". Not "M-o-n-d-b-l-u-t". Starts with a letter "Dee".

 

[Mareus]

Oh for crying out loud! Like some people have already said, you should be celebrating and not bitching about this. In fact you should be celebrating and not bitching about it even if they made you pay for it, because TW was already a great game and this extra effort from them just shows how dedicated they are not only to their customers, but more importantly to their product.

Maybe it is just me, but I would like to see this happening with all the games and I for one would gladly pay for it. I don't see how such practice could affect games negatively, especially if the game is already very good.

This is not just a patch. They went out of their ways to increase the overall quality of their product completely for free! Extra content, new voices, fixed dialogs and bugs, faster loading times, better graphic, ... what more could you want?! FOR FREE!!! So what if they hype it a bit? They deserve all the hype they can get. And I don't see them hyping it, they are just doing their job to advertise it, which is completely normal. What would you have them do? Go through all the trouble of making their already great game better, without even being allowed to advertise themselves a bit?! I swear, I don't know what is wrong with some of you people...

CDProjekt is the best thing that happened to RPG industry in the last 5 years. This bitching is indeed a new low for some people here.

 

[Jeff Graw]

But seriously, is anyone going to sit here with a blank look on their face and applaud a stupid trailer that shows fuck-all of the actual game? Without even venturing into "codex double-standards"-territory, that's pretty stupid, period. It's a stupid, meaningless trailer meant to hype up what is essentially a patch and that is stupid. It'd be stupid if it were a stupid, meaningless trailer hyping up an actual expansion because stupid, meaningless trailers are always stupid, but it's not even that.

Rational as always BN, but at this point that's a fairly minor part of the debate. Watch!

Now if I recall correctly, the main thing of Enhanced Edition - other than rounding up whatever bugs are left - is the redone text/voice-overs, right? Something that Atari fucked up, pretty much.
I think we can all agree them patching that is a good thing. Just like any patch is a good thing.

So, how long before the "we fucked up, so let's re-release a new version" becomes a standard industry treadmill? Behold, the future... BioShock: Enhanced Edition. Fallout 3: Enhanced Edition. Yet More Marketing Exercises™ for games we all bought last year.
It won't be long before we hear "It's okay, they'll fix it in the Enhanced Edition".

That's where the major point of contention is, and you can see how contrary DU and your comments are to one another.

It's also been pointed out several times that the enhanced edition is more than just 5000 new lines of voice acted dialog.

That's not mondblut (mouthblood?) you're quoting, it's DU.

That's true, but since they both said *exactly* the same thing I think we can forgive him this time.

 

[Lumpy]

Okay then, sorry about that.
What about this one?

Oh, so you *do* instist that TW is like Dungeon Lords instead, the game so broken on release it shouldn't have been released in its original shape and had to be redone all the way? Right?

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Wow, TW at release was a heap of useless shit unplayable broken crapfest?
Boy, I sure missed that part

Some people on the Codex have already commented that they "simply stopped playing" due to the long load times and other issues with the game. "Long and frequent loading times" were also raised in every review with some instances of loading being cited as 90 seconds to load a house as you walked in and if you realised it was the wrong house, you had another 90 seconds to wait just to walk out again. Those aren't the signs of a good, playable game.

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if the graphical overhaul came about because bad coding in that area was responsible for the long loading times in the first place. And if they're rooting around with that code and re-doing large areas of it, they may as well make it shinier (which quite frankly, no-one would ever pay for again anyway).

quite frankly, we would all rage against if as I said, Bethesda started doing this

We'd all rage if Bethesda started offering major updates for free instead of overcharging for small pointless ones?

... and hyping them as the greatest thing ever for a buggy, unfinished, poorly produced game in the first place, yes. Bethesda wouldn't get any points for telling everyone how they're "doing it for the fans" when they announce the GOTY edition and another opportunity to spend more money.

All you guys being so impressed that they're doing it for free need a reality check. Doing it for free isn't an option. It's mandatory. If they weren't fixing this shit up for free, the game would simply remain unplayable.

Beyond stupid... I think you're confusing The Witcher with Gothic 3.

See above.

You're guilty of the same fallacy and piss poor reasoning as that other moron. Please refer to my ass kicking of mondblut above.

The Witcher: Enhanced Edition Interview:

In the Enhanced Edition, though, we focused on adding new functionality and fixing all known issues

Fixing all known issues? You mean, like a patch which other developers do for free all the time? How awesome it is for them to be fixing these known issues (a year after the game came out) for free!

The Witcher: Extra Content:

For example, aside from the game DVD, we are planning to include a DVD with a Mod Editor D'jinii, as well as two additional adventures, a video DVD with extended material concerning the making of the game, a music CD with 29 tracks from the game, a music CD with 15 tracks of music inspired by the game, an 80-page instruction booklet, a 112-page official guide written by the authors of the game, and a 50-page short story written by Andrzej Sapkowski. There will also be a map of the game world.

The Morrowind Game of the Year Edition included editors, new content, game-play tweaks and two complete expansion packs. This is different how? Because they re-did all the voices with a different guy?

The Witcher: Core Improvements:

• Loading times reduced by 80%.
  Improved game stability.
  Improved combat responsiveness.
  Vitality indicator problem resolved (did not display at times)
  Inventory and map texture caching (accelerated map and inventory load/ display)
  All corrections contained in game patches released to date

Tell me, if they weren't doing this for free (how awesome of them!), would you pay to have your game fixed? Chances are, you'd just be pissed you bought it in the first place.

It's a normal business practice

No it's not.

Somebody else already raised the UT3 --> UT2004 example.

Are you.... trying to look like a retard?

Read mondblut's original quote in context again:

And don't forget about NEW customers. Most of them wouldn't even consider giving a try to a year old game, and here comes a chance to market to them a new release all over again for a price of recording new voiceovers and compiling a new installshield package.

It's a normal business practice and I see nothing wrong with it, just suprised people are so enthusiastic and idealistic about it. Just another "GOTY version", optionally available as free download, that's all.

It's normal business practice to release your GOTY edition with more hype and another marketing opportunity to spend more money and offer a lot of the content for free download (excluding expansions). Morrowind did it and the UT2004 example is directed at that (UT2004 was basically a GOTY edition of UT2003 - another opportunity for fans to spend more money).

 

[Dandelion]

But seriously, is anyone going to sit here with a blank look on their face and applaud a stupid trailer that shows fuck-all of the actual game? Without even venturing into "codex double-standards"-territory, that's pretty stupid, period. It's a stupid, meaningless trailer meant to hype up what is essentially a patch and that is stupid. It'd be stupid if it were a stupid, meaningless trailer hyping up an actual expansion because stupid, meaningless trailers are always stupid, but it's not even that.

Yeah, internet is full of meaningful and interesting game trailers, how do I miss it?

(Anyway this is not what we're "arguing" about. Personally I didn't like that trailer, as I didn't like the single example of revoiced dialogue DU has linked)

Oh for crying out loud! Like some people have already said, you should be celebrating and not bitching about this. In fact you should be celebrating and not bitching about it even if they made you pay for it, because TW was already a great game and this extra effort from them just shows how dedicated they are not only to their customers, but more importantly to their product.

Maybe it is just me, but I would like to see this happening with all the games and I for one would gladly pay for it. I don't see how such practice could affect games negatively, especially if the game is already very good.

This is not just a patch. They went out of their ways to increase the overall quality of their product completely for free! Extra content, new voices, fixed dialogs and bugs, faster loading times, better graphic, ... what more could you want?! FOR FREE!!! So what if they hype it a bit? They deserve all the hype they can get. And I don't see them hyping it, they are just doing their job to advertise it, which is completely normal. What would you have them do? Go through all the trouble of making their already great game better, without even being allowed to advertise themselves a bit?! I swear, I don't know what is wrong with some of you people...

CDProjekt is the best thing that happened to RPG industry in the last 5 years. This bitching is indeed a new low for some people here.

*

 

[mondblut]

Okay then, sorry about that.
What about this one?

Oh, so you *do* instist that TW is like Dungeon Lords instead, the game so broken on release it shouldn't have been released in its original shape and had to be redone all the way? Right?

Good, then could you please read the whole post maybe?

I *don't* think TW was unplayable and had to be redone and republished as semi-new game the way Dung Lords was. Therefore, EE as free download is merely a patch (if it took a lot of effort to make it, well, too bad, they still owe it to customers) and EE as printed product is merely a "gold edition with latest patch, some added content and an used condom" like any other "gold edition".

 

[Sergei Quaid]

Long loading times = unplayable? Darn, when did this happen.

I do agree that the trailer was silly, though, but its still mighty nice of them to bring this stuff for free. Didnt they also promise around 15hrs of more 'things to do', wasnt that about what you could get off of MotB?

I dont really mind.

 

[Mareus]

Goddamit, loading times were a problem, but they didn't make the game unplayable. As for many people who have stopped playing the game, most didn't do that because of loading times. Many people stopped playing when they heard a new enhanced version is coming out. If they didn't hear this news, they would certainly finish it by now. Besides, many good games had the problem with loading times and many more issues. Bloodlines being one of them and I don't hear anyone here saying the game was unplayable because of bugs.

 

[DraQ]

If there is one thread proving the decline of the codex this is it.

Long loading times = unplayable? Darn, when did this happen.

It happened with the influx of ADHDtards whose heads would explode if they were forced to endure load times of tapes of old.

 

[Jedi_Learner]

Goddamit, loading times were a problem, but they didn't make the game unplayable.

They stopped me playing the game when it first came out. Patch 1.3 made the loading times acceptable for me.

 

[Trash]

DU is just being an asshole again. That and he has a rather terrible taste in games and humor. Hence the often moronic "newsposts" from our beloved Fuhrer.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Besides, many good games had the problem with loading times and many more issues. Bloodlines being one of them and I don't hear anyone here saying the game was unplayable because of bugs.

Ermm... Bloodlines was actually unplayable because of a number of bugs. Including one particularly nasty game-ending crash in the Society of Leopold. Volourn could probably fill you in on that. Might not have been him but I know a few around here experienced it.

Loading times were also heavily criticised. And for the record everybody complained about that too. Of course, Bloodlines didn't sell 600,000 copies like The Witcher did so Troika didn't have the money to fix all the bugs and ended up folding instead, hence the fan-made patches.

 

[Dandelion]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the loading time issue with the interiors isn't a pre-1.2 patch problem?
I'm pretty sure of it.
As far as I know that is the 1st thing they've fixed, and as far as I remember I had almost-istant loadings after that. (thanks to the use of caching or something similar)

And this tells a lot on how much someone here has played TW

 

[Mareus]

TW core improvements:

Loading times reduced by 80%.
Improved game stability.
Improved combat responsiveness.
Vitality indicator problem resolved (did not display at times)
Inventory and map texture caching (accelerated map and inventory load/ display)
All corrections contained in game patches released to date.

...(rant how this would make people pissed for buying the game in the first place)

1. The whole list of improvements is much bigger and as people already know, they include:
-new voices
-more dialogs
-extra content
-better graphics
-fixed bugs that were discovered after 1.2 patch
-improvements in character differentiation system
-clearer alchemy panel
-new adventures (what happened when Geralt was still a young Witcher)
-mod editor

and many other things. Fuck just watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvZH_fSZqyM

Patch my ass!

 

[Trash]

No, just moronic. He probably thinks his writing style is all witty and clever, but in reality it's a bit pedant and sad. Then again, going to the codex for news is silly in itself.

 

[mondblut]

Loading times were also heavily criticised. And for the record everybody complained about that too.

Mind you, these loading times were significantly lesser than in TW, and by nature of the game encountered much less often, since no "crash into 30 identical houses to find X" minigame so prevalent in TW was involved.

I endured the loading times in TW, but it was NOT a game-benefiting experience, that's for sure.

 

[Jeff Graw]

have already commented that they "simply stopped playing" due to the long load times and other issues with the game.

Irrelevant. That issue is already fixed and installing the EE isn't going to fix an issue that isn't there anymore. In other words, you can't use the argument "they have to release the EE or the game will be unplayable because of teh loading times" any more. Also, even unpatched I had no problems with loading times (2-5 seconds), but I actually defrag my hard drives from time to time...

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if the graphical overhaul came about because bad coding in that area was responsible for the long loading times in the first place.

You're confusing frame rates with loading times, and see above.

and hyping them as the greatest thing ever for a buggy, unfinished, poorly produced game in the first place, yes. Bethesda wouldn't get any points for telling everyone how they're "doing it for the fans" when they announce the GOTY edition and another opportunity to spend more money.

The difference being that the Witcher is already playable with the current patches and your one and only argument for why it's unfinished doesen't hold water.

In the Enhanced Edition, though, we focused on adding new functionality and fixing all known issues

Fixing all known issues? You mean, like a patch which other developers do for free all the time? How awesome it is for them to be fixing these known issues (a year after the game came out) for free!

More poor reasoning. There are always going to be issues in any game no matter how much attention the developers give to finding them. Most issues that would ever be noticed are fixed in patch 1.3 already, but now CDPR is evil when it tries to fix some of the minor remaining ones in a free mega-update? Again, your poor reasoning skills are showing through.

For example, aside from the game DVD, we are planning to include a DVD with a Mod Editor D'jinii, as well as two additional adventures, a video DVD with extended material concerning the making of the game, a music CD with 29 tracks from the game, a music CD with 15 tracks of music inspired by the game, an 80-page instruction booklet, a 112-page official guide written by the authors of the game, and a 50-page short story written by Andrzej Sapkowski. There will also be a map of the game world.

The Morrowind Game of the Year Edition included editors, new content, game-play tweaks and two complete expansion packs. This is different how? Because they re-did all the voices with a different guy?

And because Morrowind GOTY wasn't a free update perhaps? You're comparing apples and oranges.

The Witcher: Core Improvements:

• Loading times reduced by 80%.
  Improved game stability.
  Improved combat responsiveness.
  Vitality indicator problem resolved (did not display at times)
  Inventory and map texture caching (accelerated map and inventory load/ display)
  All corrections contained in game patches released to date

Tell me, if they weren't doing this for free (how awesome of them!), would you pay to have your game fixed? Chances are, you'd just be pissed you bought it in the first place.

The faster loading time is probably referring to the previous patch that fixed that issue, but if they improved it by another 80% then that's great.

Read mondblut's original quote in context again:

UT 2004 was not a free update, you dummy, it was a completely new full priced game that used a lot of content of its predecessor. There is absolutely no comparison to be made with TW:EE here.

 

[pkt-zer0]

The amount of effort that went into the patch? Don't be silly.

Any developers are supposed to put their maximum effort into their patches, aren't they?

Y'know, that developers are supposed to go to the same lengths as CDProjekt RED doesn't change the fact that most of them don't. When someone finally gets their shit straight, no wonder people point to it and say "See, this is how it's supposed to be done!". Having the proper attitude should not be met with derision.

Oblivion had half of its dialogues cut as well, did that get restored in an official patch?

Oblivion had dialogues? :shock:

Just illustrating the above point.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

There wasn't much wrong with the game in the first place, miles better than MotB and mass effect.

Most of the whining here about the game were all excuses by the faggots to pirate the thing.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

The whole list of improvements is much bigger and as people already know, they include

Check the thread genius. I linked the complete list of fixes.

-new voices

Wow. They changed all the voices to be slightly more gruff? I'm impressed.

-more dialogs

You mean slightly extended dialogues. I sure hope that doesn't turn out to be a complete waste of time.

-extra content

Which I understand comes in the form of two mods. One of which has already been released and is essentially the "how to" for the editor.

-better graphics

Officially, they've tweaked one character (Triss Merigold) and added in a bunch of animations to smooth stuff out.

-fixed bugs that were discovered after 1.2 patch

Bug fixes? So it's a patch then?

-improvements in character differentiation system

Apparently, people look at you when they're talking to you now.

-clearer alchemy panel

Sounds like a bug.

-new adventures (what happened when Geralt was still a young Witcher)

I *think* that's the one new mod which hasn't been released yet. The other one is by a group of Canadian modders.

-mod editor

Which was already released several months ago. You can download it here.

and many other things.

Nope, that's about it. Really, the extra words in the English dialogue (cunts and pricks, yay!) and the new voices. The soundtrack and so on is your usual GOTY stuff.

Fuck just watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvZH_fSZqyM

"First and foremost, these are all of the fixes that have appeared in previous patches, as well as fixes for new problems that were reported to us by gamers and our QA department".

"The second group, on the other hand, concern problems which really hindered gameplay, and that includes faster loading times, better inventory management... mod editor etc.."

Patch my ass!

You sure about that? Seems like a patch to me.

have already commented that they "simply stopped playing" due to the long load times and other issues with the game.

Irrelevant. That issue is already fixed and installing the EE isn't going to fix an issue that isn't there anymore.

So why are loading times reduced by 80% in the Enhanced Edition and why is it a "core feature"? You even said yourself that "the enhanced edition is more than just 5000 new lines of voice acted dialog". Yeah, it's some re-released mods and patch fixes bundled with your typical GOTY gear. How is it different?

In other words, you can't use the argument "they have to release the EE or the game will be unplayable because of teh loading times" any more. Also, even unpatched I had no problems with loading times (2-5 seconds), but I actually defrag my hard drives from time to time...

The developers said themselves, in that wonderful link that Mareus gave, that the Enhanced Edition "first and foremost" fixes bugs (including new bugs). Secondly, it addresses issues which "really hindered gameplay". So which is it? Is the game "really hindered" by all these issues or isn't it?

And because Morrowind GOTY wasn't a free update perhaps?

Everything in the Morrowind GOTY that wasn't an expansion pack was available for download for free (IE: The patches and game editor).

UT 2004 was not a free update, you dummy, it was a completely new full priced game that used a lot of content of its predecessor.

mondblut was talking about companies milking their games with the GOTY release, dummy (just like The Witcher is doing).

 

[Jeff Graw]

There wasn't much wrong with the game in the first place, miles better than MotB

If it weren't for the fact that TW's vaunted choices and consequences completely fell apart in the endgame you might be right. I really hope they fix that in the EE, but I don't really see them doing another ending cutscene. Hopefully I'm wrong.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

There wasn't much wrong with the game in the first place, miles better than MotB

If it weren't for the fact that TW's vaunted choices and consequences completely fell apart in the endgame you might be right. I really hope they fix that in the EE, but I don't really see them doing another ending cutscene. Hopefully I'm wrong.

MOTB is still based off of nwn2 which means the actual gameplay still left much to be desired, shit fighting, shit performance, shit camera and atrocious art.

 

[Jeff Graw]

So why are loading times reduced by 80% in the Enhanced Edition and why is it a "core feature"?

I already replied to this, but you conveniently forgot to quote my response, you twit. I'll explain it to you one last time: They're probably referring to one of the previously released updates. It makes some sense because the EE "mega-patch" likely includes all of the patches to date. TW took a lot of flak for its loading times when it first came out, so it comes as no surprise that they would advertise improved loading times in the EE even though it's been fixed already. If they managed to decrease the loading times yet again, even better, but as it stands now the loading times are already quick with the current updates. Get it through your skull this time, and please come up for another argument on why TW is currently unplayable if you want to be taken seriously. Loading time is no longer an issue.

that wonderful link that Mareus gave, that the Enhanced Edition "first and foremost" fixes bugs (including new bugs). Secondly, it addresses issues which "really hindered gameplay". So which is it? Is the game "really hindered" by all these issues or isn't it?

As I said before, all games have bugs, no matter how polished, and there will always be new bugs to squash. Because CDPR says that hunting bugs is a top priority does not mean that the game in it's current form is some kind of buggy mess. That's idiot logic. As for issues that hindered gameplay, they're probably talking about the new alchemy and inventory screens (the previous alchemy screen was pretty unintuitive) as well as the tweaks to the combat system. They might be referring to load times too, but again, that's already been fixed in updates. They might even be referring to the bad translation job by Atari. Almost all games have issues that hinder gameplay, but that doesen't make them "unplayable". Again, idiot logic.

Everything in the Morrowind GOTY that wasn't an expansion pack was available for download for free (IE: The patches and game editor).

And everything that was offered for free on the web pales in comparison to what CDPR is offering in the EE update. Some new items and a castle that broke a bunch of mods; that sure fundamentally changed the Morrowind experience... not. Compared to the enhanced graphics and animation, gameplay changes, interface tweaks, redone dialogs and voice overs in the EE it's not too impressive looking. In any case, the GOTY for Morrowind wasn't free so you're still comparing apples and oranges.

mondblut was talking about companies milking their games with the GOTY release, dummy (just like The Witcher is doing).

Releasing a free mega-update and putting new versions of the game on store shelves isn't the same as taking a full priced failure of a game, adding a couple new game modes and a shitload of maps, and rereleasing it as a completely new game for full price without any kind of upgrade path from the original game. Not even close. One is rewarding the consumer, the other is shafting him. That you would even think such a comparison is valid makes me seriously ponder how weak your reasoning must be.

MOTB is still based off of nwn2 which means the actual gameplay still left much to be desired, shit fighting, shit performance, shit camera and atrocious art.

Yes (but the outdoor art in MotB was very good if you had powerful computer) all those things are true, but it was still the superior RPG, and that's what counts around here, right?

 

[Mareus]

If you, DU, think it is a patch, fine! But I don't agree with you. The mod alone is worth all the advertisement they get, and people get to play it completely for free! It sure beats $0.90 to $12.99 per plug-in.

Don't forget all the additional content like map, music CD, etc. if you actually buy the TWEE for which the price is also symbolic.

I can't believe we are even arguing about one thing that everyone should be happy about.

 

[Rat Keeng]

Good things come to those who wait. Now, being that I was one of those who waited, I see no problem with this. My only dilemma now is; do I buy the Enhanced Edition, or do I wait for the Ultimate Edition?

 

[Trash]

DU just tries to be all cool and edgy. This thread sucks as much as the newspost.