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King Arthur - The Role Playing Wargame

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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The game these guys made before (Crusaders - Thy Kingdom Come or somesuch) got a lot of flak for being tedious.

I'm moving to my new apartment today and going to work afterwords. I'll fire it up for an hour or two tonight. Hopefully I'll level up so I can see that part of the game. I'd say this game looks promising so far.
 

treave

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Codex 2012
Goddammit 6 gigs. I already blew my bandwidth this month on Dragon Age. Guess I'll have to get it next month.
 

Grunker

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Okay, I got a chance to play some more. I'm pretty sure I've seen most of what the game has to offer feature-wise. The preview below is lengthy, so just read the parts you care most about... or skip to the conclusion. There are next to no spoilers.

Character development: Your knights have 5 basic stats, such as Fighting (their own strength in melee), Reign (how much gold they earn you and how much they lower the upkeep costs of your units) and Loyalty (the morale of the knight and his troops. Your knights have classes. I have a Warlord, a Champion and some dude I just got so I can't remember his class. When they level up, they gain one skill point, and you can use this to learn new active skills (such as Dragon's Eye which negates penalties for fog on your archers) or passive skills (such as Holy armor which shields your units). There are lots of skills - 15 for each class roughly. You gain XP after every battle - and ALL your units gain XP, even a basic unit of footmen. The basic units can level up in melee, defense, archey, stamina or devotion, the last of which lowers their upkeep-cost.

Management: Seems pretty okay, so far. You conquer cities and special areas (such as Stonehenge) within each province. These give bonuses and sometimes recruits are available (recruiting is the main way of expanding your armies). Units cost gold, and consume food and cost upkeep while you have them. Each turn consists of a season, and true to the arthurian universe, you rest in winter. So you can't attack in winter. Summer, autumn and spring all offer different bonuses/penalties depending on your actions. Winter is where you level up if any units gained XP. You also pay upkeep and that stuff in winter. While this all could be a staple of the series, I'm having lots of fun managing my little part of Brittania. It's horribly impeded by the GUI, though (see below). One of the innovative parts of this is the round-table screen. Here you can manage your knights, dismiss them, find wives for them (raising their loyalty), torture enemy knights you've captured, release them for ransom, kill them, and that kind of stuff. What I'm worried about is the recruitment; it seems you have to visit each city when recruitment is available, to add the forces to your army. While maybe realistic, it certainly isn't fun. It seems much a la returning to your town in heroes of might&magic; wasted turnes spent moving, recruiting, ending your turn, and then get to actually play.

Quests and objectives: There are two types of missions. The objectives are basically; "do you want to side with bad king or good king, christian king or old-faith king." Then you fight whoever you didn't side with. Sometimes it's a little more complicated, like: "Which city will you claim as your Stronghold"? Quests are a lot more original in this type of genre. They're basically little text-based minigames, where you meet several skill challenges. You encounter something on the overland map, read the quest, and then choose which knight in the army that encountered it who'll do the quest. You then have several options to how you will complete the quest. The options you have are based on the skills of the knight you chose. So some options are greyed out (if your knight doesn't have the skill) or red (if he will fail because his skill is too low). When the quest resolves, you gain rewards such as XP, CAREBEAR/EVUL points and so on. The C&C has no effect on the storyline, as far as I can see, except in terms on the morality-wheel. Besides that it only matters in terms of reward/how much effort it takes to get through the quest. For a game of this type however, I'm more than willing to forgive this.

For example, I sent my diplomatic knight on a mission, and only completed it by paying 2000 food to the resident lord, because I didn't want to use the Tyrant-option and I didn't have enough Christian-points for them to just trust me straight ahead. In the end it earned me a CAREBEAR-point, some XP, and so on.

The next quest I sent my fighting knight. I conviced a group of soldiers to join me, but only by claiming them in Christianity's name. My diplomacy was too low to convince them to join freely. This lowered the morale of the whole army, but granted me the units and some Christianity-points.

It's entertaining enough, and if it keeps the same amount of options throughout the game, it's definetely worth my time.

The writing: Is pretty "meh." It's your classic King Arthur setting, but I'm very thankful it's less "CLIVE OWEN WILL TEAR OFF YOUR BALLS!" and more the original saga. The setting is fucking solid - the writing itself not so much. As for how much you'll see; you'll see it in quests, objective-descriptions, the notes on storyline supplied by your advisor and small notes. There's also a story-compendium explaining what goes on. Kindda like the codex from Dragon Age. It's an okay read, but don't expect novelty.

The fighting: I don't know much about this, since this is my first wargame of its kind. I'm having fun, though. In my earlier post you can see how much has an effect on the outcome, and it really does. In my first "hard" fight (meaning outside of the tutorial battles), I fought the fae people for the first time. I was utterly crushed on my first three attempts (playing on normal), until I hid my archers in a forest, flanked their light infantry, and wedged into them. My archers got in a tricky situation because they had wargs, which were damned fast and broke off from the main battle as soon as they realized I had archers. I was too slow to hunt them down, so while, overall, I beat them soundly, I lost 3/4 of my archers in that battle. Damn. Maybe someone with more experience on wargames can give a better assessment of the combat. The only really bad part of the fighting is micromanagement. You can't just put your light cavalry in your heavy infantry group and move them at the same time, for example. If you do this, the cavalry will storm ahead all alone, because they're faster, and thus get killed in an instant. It's incredibly annoying that they won't wait for the rest of my guys, like in every recent RTS-game. You can do the CTRL-#-thing, but you'll want 5 or 6 groups in the large battles, and that gets a little tedious. The battles are RTwP however, so you can do the micromanaging while game is paused.

The GUI: Holy fuck that shit is confusing. Not only because of all the options. But the layout too. It'll take some time to get used to. I still misclick and stumble around in it after playing for 2-3 hours. It must've been hard making a GUI that could support everything you can do in this game, but shit. There is no intuitivity. It took me 15 minutes to find out how to split an army. It's easy enough to use once you figure it out, but there's no reason you shouldn't be able to do it from the armyscreen itself; instead you do it from the overland map by bringing up a menu-wheel. The same goes for the round-table screen (managing knights and so on), though it's more intuitive than stuff revolving around army. In the battles themselves it takes time to figure out the GUI too; withdrawal is extremely important for saving your knights, and you have to click a disengage button first. You can't just run away. They did this because pressing this button lose you some of your army, which is fair, but they could've implemented the withdrawal to the action of fleeing itself.

Conclusion (level of potential): There's potential for a gem, I think. But main worry so far is that the battles themselves will become really repetetive. If the character development is done right, this may be thwarted somewhat. I'm a bit pessimistic though. The management is the same deal; if it continues to surprise me with its complexity I'll call it a gem, but if it presents me with more carebear/evil kings to choose between, or quests that are handled by a) giving 2000 food, b) threaten or c) use diplomacy, it'll probably get really repetetive.

All in all though, I'm already certain it was a good purchase. I support the effort, which is considerable, no matter what.

My ability to judge the game is heavily diminished by the fact that this is my introduction to the genre, so I'd like to hear some thoughts on it by someone who's strong in stuff like Total War. The GUI, for example, might be something the whole genre suffers from as far as I know.
 

Zed

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Codex USB, 2014
Thanks for the writeup. I'll give it a try.
 

Grunker

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Oh, I forgot a small detail: At first, when you attack, you just ambush. That is, your army is placed on the battlefield and you win by either taking victory-locations or killing the opposing army. The attacker gets to choose from different battlegrounds (differantiating in stuff like amount of hills, plains, rivers and victory-locations).

Later though, depending on your morality, the game claims you'll have other options than just to ambush. I haven't seen this yet, but I'm pretty sure they're referring to stuff like converting parts of the opposing army and that kindda stuff. Which would be pretty cool.
 

Grunker

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Got to see a little more of the questsystem. It's really fun, and the quests I've been on so far have been very varied. Think those old quest-books: "If you want to talk to the prisoner, go to page 358"-type stuff, except that a) The skills of your knight play an important role, b) How you complete the quest has very varied results on the game state. The story-progression might not be that different depending on how you handle it, but the consequence at the end (the type of rewards you get, and what you lose) are pretty nice.

All-in-all, I'd call the quest-mini-game a win so far. There is still potential for repetetiveness, but I have yet to see any.

For those who want an example:

I was visiting a king who held his son captive. First, there is an option to sneak into the castle or approach banners glaring. Then, you choose who to talk to; the prince or his father. The prince will thereafter present you with two plans. You can accept one of those plans for a new objective, or turn him in to his father. The two plans are different from each other. If you turn him in, you can pay the father for some troops, or ask him to go easy on his population of Old Faithers, as well as just thank him and leave.

So, as you can see, there are plenty of choices. The type of consequence is, as mentioned, the rewards, and whether you lose troops, money or anger potential allies. There are plenty quests scattered throughout the land. I've got 6 on my map, and that's after completeting three others.
 

Trash

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Been playing it for a small bit. So far it reminds me of some wierd mix between those old Lord of the Realms games, Total War, King's Bounty and Space Rangers. At the very least it's original. Battles so far have been okayish. Graphically (and especially animation wise) it looks amateurish compared to the stuff you get in the TW games but the inclusion of spells is pretty awesome. The victory points also grant some interesting bonuses that could make some battles pretty interesting. The game does seem to railroad you quite a bit, but as I said it's very early day. I've only just managed to complete the tutorial and play an additional 30 minutes or so. It's a pretty intrigueing game so far.

PS: Writing might be meh, but it's miles above the typical engrish found in most Eastern European games.
 

getter77

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Oct 12, 2008
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Quests sound exactly up to par with the blurb on their mainpage that they were shooting for a Fighting Fantasy style.

I do wish the devs would be more vocal and such though, as after release support/content could really do something like this a solid.
 

burrie

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Aug 16, 2005
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Holland
Grunker said:
It took me 15 minutes to find out how to split an army. It's easy enough to use once you figure it out, but there's no reason you shouldn't be able to do it from the armyscreen itself; instead you do it from the overland map by bringing up a menu-wheel.
Could you please tell me how you managed to do that? I just can't get the bloody 'split army' option to appear anywhere.
 

Grunker

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burrie said:
Grunker said:
It took me 15 minutes to find out how to split an army. It's easy enough to use once you figure it out, but there's no reason you shouldn't be able to do it from the armyscreen itself; instead you do it from the overland map by bringing up a menu-wheel.
Could you please tell me how you managed to do that? I just can't get the bloody 'split army' option to appear anywhere.

Yeah, it was a pain. Go to the overland map, and make sure nothing is selected. Then right-click the army. Up comes a menu wheel with some options. This is also the way you recruit later on.

Could you, in turn, help me in my other thread? :roll:
 

Trash

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Not to mention that army management only becomes available after you finished the tutorial/start. You get it after defeating the Northerners in the adventure battle when you go and visit the Lady of the Lake.
 

Malakal

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Wait tutorial is mandatory? Fuck I never do those things, figuring everything yourself is half the fun. Not to mention that it adds to difficulty.
 

Trash

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Well, the tutorial is integrated into the game. The first couple of turns you're led by the hand through the first steps. After that the game opens up more options (like raising troops) as you complete objectives.
 

Ghoulem

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Nidaros
So far this game is only available on STEAM (combination of dream and steal, wot?!) and the likes. It says on the site that physical copies of the game will hit stores in the coming months. Are they waiting for the steam version to pay the production cost, or get them the necessary financing? Because they would lose a lot of potential sales by not shipping before christmas..right?
 

Grunker

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Got to see the full-fledged managing: You can upgrade units, research new units, build buildings in you capitals, research laws, decrees, new spells and tech.

Ghoulem said:
So far this game is only available on STEAM (combination of dream and steal, wot?!) and the likes. It says on the site that physical copies of the game will hit stores in the coming months. Are they waiting for the steam version to pay the production cost, or get them the necessary financing? Because they would lose a lot of potential sales by not shipping before christmas..right?

Now I don't know but I think indie games don't sell extramuch during christmas. The reason for extra sales in christmas is casual gamers getting games and hardcore gamers being bought games by relatives. Indie games don't make much on that I believe. I think it's easier to release on digital, and they probably just wanted to get the game out as fast as possible.
 

Burning Bridges

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(without having played) I must say the campaign still promises to be fantastic, but the battles worried me from the beginning (too small area, too much magic, too little tactics). Anyone heard something about demo?

And yeah, definitely not buying anything with Steam. They can shove that shit in their asses.
 

burrie

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There are some random quests that pop up from time to time. That, and you have a morality scale of Rightful/Tyrant and Old Faith/Christianity which is decided based on the decisions that you make during quests and what objectives you complete(ie. side with a tyrant king to gain some artifacts and alot of gold or rescue the rightful ruler of the province and gain his allies as support). From what I can see in the Chronicles screen, these decisions will lead to different quests/storyline as well, but I can't really say how different the game will feel if you play as a tyrant when compared to a rightful king.

Well, the Morality Chart shows that you unlock different units and options based on your standing, so that should make some difference in gameplay.

Have to give props to Neocore for fixing the 'crash after every battle' bug in less than two days. The game was unstable at first, but the first released patch removed any bug for me.
 

Grunker

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MetalCraze said:
Is it linear or has at least some kind of randomly generated stuff/replayability?

As above. The game basically generates random quests like battles, diplomatic instances, trade and the little text-quests I spoke of before. It also generates more or less random problems you can respond to; drought, flood, rebels and stuff like that.

The main game itself is very linear when you want to move it forward; but to do that there are very large chunks of managing and taking care of less important battles in between. Those can be handled in a myriad of different ways, and how well you manage them obviously have an effect on how well you take on the next main objective.
 

Kate_Neocore

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Nov 26, 2009
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Thanks for RPG Codex for dealing with King Arthur.
The official forum for the game will be launched soon. We’ll let you know if it’s available, you can also visit that one if you like.
In one or two days a new patch will be available (fixing bugs and resolution problems, game-balancing, new difficulty level: beginner, etc.)
Keep on playing and have a lot fun.
We’re asking everybody who have problems with the game to send the detailed configuration (hardware&software) description to support@kingarthurthewargame.com
 

Grunker

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Kate said:
new difficulty level: beginner,

Much appreciated. I have... eh, a friend who's losing a lot. No really. I'm so bad at this game. Maybe it's just not my genre.
 

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