[LP CYOA] 傳

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

The Abbess would have informed them if they didn't already know when she has set up the meeting.

The Abbess gave her word she would not reveal us. She seems the promise keeping type.

 

[Nevill]

What are C voters hoping for anyway? That GT would take one look at us and say you poor thing, here's some trick that can help with your qi (where we already killed our meridians and thus disabled most Wudang shit that would work)? That they'd tell us something magical about Zhang Jue or Shun's mission target or the WiB that we don't know, even though they didn't know about WiB and didn't know who was ZJ's apprentice before we told them? That they'd what, support our plans for any of our major missions, that we haven't even told them about? What could they possibly offer, except the one logical thing - we need you for something, something shady, so we can cut you loose later. Obey us, because we are the heads. Oh, also, you seem to be an abomination.

How about these?
1) Information network thousands of men worth.
2) Loredumps
3) A glimpse at people who can become either our greatest allies, or our greatest enemies, and it is yet undecided which.
treave summed it up well. You can read his post with a tally.

What are A voters hoping for? Getting laid by Qilin or by a mysterious Persian pwincess? It seems like A is based on "anything but the Great Taoist" more than on anything else.

 

[Baltika9]

1) Information network thousands of men worth.

And they'll be one hundred percent honest and straight up and respectful with us, because...
Honest question.

2) Loredumps

And they'll be one hundred percent straight up and respectful with us, because...

3) A glimpse at people who can become either our greatest allies, or our greatest enemies, and it is yet undecided which.

And they'll be one hundred percent stand up and respectful with us, because...

What are A voter hoping for? Getting laid by Qilin or by a mysterious Persian pwincess? It seems like A is bases on "anything but the Great Taoist" more than on anything else.

Now that's just insulting, we have laid out some very valid argument and questions.

Also, I admit to nothing about princesses.

 

[Tigranes]

Great, some actual arguments to engage with. (I mean that without sarcasm.)

1) And that network will be used to give us information about our ZJ mission targets? No. About Yuhua Hall? Well they'd ask, why? About WiB? They didn't know anything before and why will they tell us what they find out? There's no leverage we can use here.
2) Again, loredumps about what? (See above)
3) Sure, this is a valid point.

I read treave's summary which confirmed to me C doesn't have any merits about stuff we really want that is likely to happen. It's either stuff we want that has little reason to happen, or stuff we don't really want that bad.

My vote for A is predicated on the fact that (1) Qilin is someone we know to be trustworthy & competent about some things and not others, and this is right up her alley; (2) Qilin knows more about us than anybody else at the moment and thus we want to keep on her good side; (3) Qilin is likely to be a more helpful ally given her interest in us and her identity than heads of sects we won't meeet again for a while until we burst in and demand to beat up their students; (4) C is not only a choice lacking in positive merits, it is a choice with much more risk than all other options in the sense that Grand Taoist is not going to be pleased to see us. Anyone thinking he'll welcome us with open arms is deluding themselves about everything the setting has communicated to us.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

Nevill:
1) If their info network is so awesome, why do they need us at all? Wouldn't they have taken care of tthe WiB by now?
2) Yes, let's tell everything to the maniac's apprentice/aka the clown that ha been humiliating the sects on stage/aka the guy who has been running around town with a fake identity. He seems trustworthy. More likely we'll be given a little info and then cajoled into service.
3) Good point actually. Though if we want to ever finish Zhang's training (you do want that, right?) we'll probably meet them eventually when/after beating down their apprentices, so whatever.

The A voter is hoping to gain strengthen the bond between Jing and Qilin, avoid the GT putting his dick in our ass avoid the GT learning all about our qi too soon, and of course, learning the identity of the Persian so we can either know our enemy or make a friend.

Seems a bit more reasonable than, "Let's meet the old guys because they are powerful and will be just itching to share info and help with us because that's what privileged old people like to do best! They already know everything anyway!"...

 

[kazgar]

So lets ignore the people in C because they're all members of clubs that won't accept us and we're not sure what their motivations is and go help the person in A who's also a member of a club that won't accept us and we're not sure what their motivation is!

Brilliant!

 

[kazgar]

Recent pro A discussion is purely a "better the devil you know" situation.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

edit: sort of

So lets ignore the people in C because they're all members of clubs that won't accept us and we're not sure what their motivations is and go help the person in A who's also a member of a club that won't accept us and we're not sure what their motivation is!

Brilliant!

Ooo! Except she's already friendly with us and has helped us repeatedly! And she's a lot less likely to try and force us into service! Oh, and we get to learn the identity of the masked fighter and maybe solve the mystery without indebting (and possibly indenturing) ourselves to some of the most powerful people in the known world!

 

[Baltika9]

The difference here is, that the Persians are suspects that are very likely to be directly involved in this whole debacle, either scapegoats or the collaborators. It's in our interest to investigate one way or the other, if they are scapegoats, then we have a common enemy to work against and with Jing's and Quiling's social skills and cunning we can negotiate some collaboration; if they're our perpretrators, well, we're better prepared for what comes next.

Compared to the Masters, who right now are just peripheral and their only concern is that this shit is happening on their watch and they are already alerted to everything we told Yifang because she's Yifang, the Persians are much more useful.

 

[Zero Credibility]

The Abbess gave her word she would not reveal us. She seems the promise keeping type.

Actually, she didn't. She just told us not to worry because she doesn't gossip. Nothing there about not informing her peers if she finds it important enough to do so. The invitation that got send to us that they didn't know about, the masked assailants falsely declaring themselves disciples of the Maniac attacking people in the city they were supposed to keep peace in, and now an unknown technique used against us - yeah, she told them everything. Assuming our false identities even fooled them in the first place, that is.

 

[Nevill]

And they'll be one hundred percent honest and straight up and respectful with us, because...

Because the Abbess is there. Even if they won't be honest, she can relay the info to us through Cao'er/Yifang. But we must earn it first.

1) If their info network is so awesome, why do they need us at all? Wouldn't they have taken care of tthe WiB by now?

They might need us as much as we need them. Does anyone read this discussion anymore, or is everyone just pitching their choices?

 

[Baltika9]

And they'll be one hundred percent honest and straight up and respectful with us, because...

Because the Abbess is there. Even if they won't be honest, she can relay the info to us through Cao'er/Yifang. But we must earn it first.

And she would, because... You're assuming the masters owe us anything when they're the ones with all the advantages.

and maybe solve the mystery without indebting (and possibly indenturing) ourselves to the most powerful people in the known world!

Which leads me to my next question: what are our chances against Grand Tao if we team up with Zhang and fight him back-to-back?

 

[Nevill]

And she would, because...

Because she is on the good terms with us due to us saving both of her granddaughters. She trusted us with her family secret.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

The Abbess gave her word she would not reveal us. She seems the promise keeping type.

Actually, she didn't. She just told us not to worry because she doesn't gossip. Nothing there about not informing her peers if she finds it important enough to do so. The invitation that got send to us that they didn't know about, the masked assailants falsely declaring themselves disciples of the Maniac attacking people in the city they were supposed to keep peace in, and now an unknown technique used against us - yeah, she told them everything. Assuming our false identities even fooled them in the first place, that is.

She may not have sworn a blood oath, bt I don't think she'd reveal us unless absolutely necessary and right now there doesn't seem to be a direct connection to us. They WiB did attack us, but they did so incentily, suggesting they don't know our identity either and may be using our name as a scapegoat in order to rig the tourney. There would be no need for her to tell them. And again, even if she did, they do not know our face.

“Thank you, Abbess Miecao. I will take your words to heart. If I may, could I ask that you keep my identity a secret to those who do not know it, should you see me in Luoyang? I would prefer to introduce myself on my own terms.”

“Do not worry. I am a nun, not a gossip.” There is a twinkle in her eye.

 

[Esquilax]

The Abbess can't help us, Nevill. With two other sect heads involved, she can't really put her neck out to help us if they both know we're Zhang Jue's apprentice. If they don't, then we might be in a good position, however. So really it depends on if Yifang told everybody, or just the Abbess - I'm hoping for the latter. Miecao can't make any overt moves to help us if they know we're Zhang's apprentice because it might make them suspicious as to why she's hearing us out when we're the guy who is in possession of an Emei sect treasure. From what they know, we took it, so the Abbess would have the least reason to trust us and the most reason to bear a grudge.

So lets ignore the people in C because they're all members of clubs that won't accept us and we're not sure what their motivations is and go help the person in A who's also a member of a club that won't accept us and we're not sure what their motivation is!

Chi Qilin has been rather accepting of us. The mysterious Persian fighters are secretive, but they are far more likely to be accepting of us than the heads of any orthodox sects whose granddaughters we haven't rescued from captivity will be. A lot of the reasons that Baltika9 mentioned are valid ones as well. We aren't going to be making friends with them right away, of course, but being that they are unorthodox foreigners, we have a much better shot of learning from them than we would from the established martial arts world here. They have an exotic style, so I think it's worth looking into because I feel that the benefits of C are dubious.

Now, I understand that a lot of the arguments in favour of A amount to disliking C, but I don't think that makes my position any less valid. If I feel that a particular choice is very bad, it's advisable to avoid it, no? Maybe it isn't a good idea to jump into the mysterious rift at times, and picking anything but that is better.

One thing that we can all agree on however, is that these orthodox types are such fucking dorks that they can't keep a secret to save their fucking lives. We ask Xuzhan and his monk buddies to shut the fuck up for one second, then Bai Jiutian introduces himself to us on only our second fight! We try and get Yifang to keep a secret, then we get summoned by three sect heads the next fucking day! This is ridiculous - why can't these guys stop snitching?

 

[Baltika9]

And if she wants anything out of us in collaboration with the other three, which is why she's with them in the first place, she won't be so soft with us to give shit away for free. If she wanted to do that, she'd have Yifang or Cao'er relay the information back to us already, or meet us in person. Instead, she's calling us out to a den of predators where we're the prey.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

One thing that we can all agree on however, is that these orthodox types are such fucking dorks that they can't keep a secret to save their fucking lives. We ask Xuzhan and his monk buddies to shut the fuck up for one second, then Bai Jiutian introduces himself to us on only our second fight! We try and get Yifang to keep a secret, then we get summoned by three sect heads the next fucking day! This is ridiculous - why can't these guys stop snitching?

Because it's hard to keep a secret when you keep a stick crammed so far up your ass that everything you eat tastes a little like wood?

 

[Tigranes]

Abbess is a decent sort and won't screw us over unless she has to, but she's not going to jump in and say HEY GAIS THIS GUY IS ALRIGHT HE HELPED OUT A TRICKY SITUATION INVOLVING MY OLD FLAME AND MY SECRET SCION BY SNEAKING INTO A SECT COMPOUND.

Better the devil you know? Why, what's wrong with that argument, as long as it's right? And it is right. There are no angels here and there's no free information or help or cake or vagina falling from the sky. We have two camps that all have their own agenda, but one camp we know and we know when we can rely on, another camp we don't and is much more likely to be stuffy and domineering.

 

[Esquilax]

Because it's hard to keep a secret when you keep a stick crammed so far up your ass that everything you eat tastes a little like wood?

I gotta say, I felt some regret for a while that I voted for the unorthodox route, but now I do not. If going orthodox means that we'd have to spend all day with boring nerds who have no sense of adventure, then I am glad we are as far away as possible from them. Say what you will about the likes of Chi Qilin being untrustworthy, Cao'er being creepy, Master Yao having a tenuous grip on his sanity, and Master Zhang being a savage motherfucker who has an even more tenuous grip on his sanity, at least those people are interesting, goddamnit!

I seriously hope Bro Fu doesn't become as lame as Yifang once he gets into an orthodox sect. He would be the only cool orthodox sect member we've met at this point.

 

[Baltika9]

Yeah, that's quite the menagerie, ut they really do feel like family of a sorts. And, strangely enough, there's no real backstabbing going on between us, mostly harmless pranks and perving (except Zhang, of course, nothing he does is harmless. That's just how he rolls.). Compared to the back-room politics and double-facedness of the sectarians, I now see why these worlds hate each other so much:

(1:50-3:00).
At least the unorthodoxes are keeping it real.

 

[Zero Credibility]

The difference here is, that the Persians are suspects that are very likely to be directly involved in this whole debacle, either scapegoats or the collaborators.

The problem I have with A is that I don't agree with your assessment of that being very likely. It's possible, sure. But so is that they have no connection with our attackers beyond that they are both here and carrying masks, and I find this explanation the most likely of those presented so far. Foreigners that far from home being the collaborators to local conspirators and then risking exposure by participating in the tournament just doesn't sound convincing to me. And as for scapegoats, well why bother when they are already making one of us?

 

[Baltika9]

The difference here is, that the Persians are suspects that are very likely to be directly involved in this whole debacle, either scapegoats or the collaborators.

The problem I have with A is that I don't agree with your assessment of that being very likely. It's possible, sure. But so is that they have no connection with our attackers beyond that they are both here and carrying masks, and I find this explanation the most likely of those presented so far. Foreigners that far from home being the collaborators to local conspirators and then risking exposure by participating in the tournament just doesn't sound convincing to me. And as for scapegoats, well why bother when they are already making one of us?

Okay, but why are they wearing their masks and doing their codename bullshit? The foreigners from the Ashina and Tibet had no problems with their nationality, so why are these guys keeping it a secret. Dude, they're shady as fuck one way or the other and warrant investigating, "well maybe they're just shy" doesn't cut it under these circumstances, there are only so many coincidences before they stop being coincidences.

 

[Zero Credibility]

Well, why are we carrying a mask? Seriously, we already know that somebody shows up in a mask every single year. Are they all conspirators? No, they have their own motives to hide their identities - they think it adds to their reputation, they are trying to hide their identity because of shame or whatever. In this case it could simply be that they are trying to hide the fact that they don't look oriental at all a secret.

 

[Esquilax]

The problem I have with A is that I don't agree with your assessment of that being very likely. It's possible, sure. But so is that they have no connection with our attackers beyond that they are both here and carrying masks, and I find this explanation the most likely of those presented so far. Foreigners that far from home being the collaborators to local conspirators and then risking exposure by participating in the tournament just doesn't sound convincing to me. And as for scapegoats, well why bother when they are already making one of us?

I agree with you, it's quite likely that the Persian fighters are unrelated to the impostors trying to sully our good terrible name. At this point, we can't really confirm either way, as their general secrecy and weirdness seems to indicate that they also have something to hide. On the other hand, the other foreign fighters had no problem competing openly. I'm inclined to think that they're shady, but ultimately unrelated to our WiB problem, though of course I can't be sure.

Well, why are we carrying a mask? Seriously, we already know that somebody shows up in a mask every single year. Are they all conspirators? No, they have their own motives to hide their identities - they think it adds to their reputation, they are trying to hide their identity because of shame or whatever. In this case it could simply be that they are trying to hide the fact that they don't look oriental at all a secret.

Yeah, but guys who show up in masks are usually random idiots, these guys all work together and they're actually really good. Another question I'm wondering about is, "why would they hide the fact that they don't look oriental at all?" Their appearance makes them stand out, and they don't want to get noticed. Why is that?

But really, I like A because I want to gain an understanding of their skills, and ultimately either befriend them if they turn out to be harmless or learn enough about them to defeat them if they prove to be a threat to us. And of course because I think C is bad, but I think we've covered that rather exhaustively.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

Well, why are we carrying a mask? Seriously, we already know that somebody shows up in a mask every single year. Are they all conspirators?

Eh, but they joined the tournament as a team. They already "conspired" to do that much.

Anyway, the WiB are attacking the sects disciples - I rather doubt they are doing this to tarnish our good name when they quite clearly barely know who we are as evidenced by the incidental way they treated our pursuit. No, I think they heard our name being thrown around in rumors before the tournament even started and then decided to use us as a scapegoat. Their real objective is to fight the disciples of each sect - to weaken them and/or learn of their fighting styles. Sort of like we are doing. Either to help the Persians win the tournament or to scout them for a future battle or even a war. What better way to learn your enemies fighting styles than to fight the apprentices to whom they have bequeathed all their knowledge?

Just a theory kicking around in the back of my head. Not basing my vote on it.