In Progress [LP CYOA] Tower

[Kz3r0]

I honestly can't really understand Kz3r0s count though, as it seems to be wrong in several places?

You can pick two books, hence I count the two first choices for books as first picks.

 

[ItsChon]

I honestly can't really understand Kz3r0s count though, as it seems to be wrong in several places?

You can pick two books, hence I count the two first choices for books as first picks.

Ah I see. Yeah your counts are correct, but I'm not sure what you mean by the whole conditional thing? Is the conditional number meant to be added to the base number to get the final vote? Does it literally just represent how many people have the vote in their conditional, regardless of placement, is it meant to be the vote after conditionals are taken into account? Idk, Baltika's original polling method which I use as my template seems to be the most clear.

 

[Kz3r0]

Is the conditional number meant to be added to the base number to get the final vote?

Yes.

Does it literally just represent how many people have the vote in their conditional, regardless of placement

In this case yes.

 

[Baltika9]

Ranged is tied at first with Astra focus, so why would I flop to a losing option?

To make it the winning option, duh. Melee is losing to Astra by one vote and youcan make the difference.

Don't be lame, doo eet.

Since you and Esquilax both had flops to B, and Absinthe had a flop to C. Ranged is winning by a margin of one vote. If y'all would like to change these votes to give A a better chance of winning fair enough.

You should count us as flops in a run-off against 2C anyway.

Idk, Baltika's original polling method which I use as my template seems to be the most clear.

Oh no, I didn't do conditionals yet because fuck that. Azhag gotta slaughter him some Archaon.

 

[Kz3r0]

By the way both BOOKS options (II, III) flora and astra primer are winning by a landslide, as the vote for the ASSOCIATION (A) for CONVERSATION.
Only SKILLS are to be decided.

 

[ItsChon]

By the way both BOOKS options (II, III) flora and astra primer are winning by a landslide, as the vote for the ASSOCIATION (A) for CONVERSATION.
Only SKILLS are to be decided.

You mean IV and III, but yes you are correct.

You should count us as flops in a run-off against 2C anyway.

Yes, what is currently shown on my updated poll is assuming there is a run-off against 2C, 2B would win.

 

[Kz3r0]

All skills votes:

A

A>B.

A>B

A > C

A >E

B.

B.

B > C

B > C > A

B>E>C

C

C.

C.

C

C>B

C>E>D>A>B

D. Alchemy
>
B. Ranged combat
>
E. Traps
>
C. Astra usage
>
A. Melee and unarmed combat

E

A
5 votes
1 third conditionals(6)
1 fourth conditionals(7)
1 fifth conditionals(8)total.

B
5 votes
4 second conditionals(9)
1 fifth conditionals(10)total.

C
6 votes
3 second conditionals(9)
1 third conditionals(10)
1 fourth conditionals(11)total.

D
1 votes
1 third conditionals(2)total.

E
1 votes
3 second conditionals(4)
1 third conditionals(5)total.

 

[Tigranes]

Do we want to invest into melee long term? I'm OK with that! I'm saying we need SOME measure of coherence even for a hybrid build with melee or magic. Right now we're chasing after the newest shiny thing every single update. If we pick up the Astra book here and ask Tlalli about magic, I'm OK with that. We don't gotta fire bows 18 hours a day. But I'm not sure we want to pick up a slingshot, then learn a bit of melee, then read a book about astras.

It sounds like you're treating this training opportunity as a singular stat boost that automatically commits us to becoming a 'jack of all trades, master of none' with emphasis on the latter part. I don't agree with this viewpoint.

I am not. We are not locking in our character with this update. We are 10 years old, and we will have other opportunities to pursue whatever we don't pick up here. And that goes both ways. Not choosing Astras here doesn't mean we end up ignoring them the rest of our lives, for example. The point, once again, is to say these are the 2-3 things we really like, so let's mostly focus on that. Are we a book & hunter guy? OK. Are we a book & hunter & melee & woodcarving guy? Less OK.

I think it is best to secure as broad of a base as we can for further self-education once we get back to our base of operations in the village. We already know the basics of archery, and we can practice that ourselves if we must. We do not have such a base for Astra training, or for unarmed and melee combat.

That is in fact a fair point. I already voted for the Astra book, and I am OK if we combine it with Tlalli's Magic Lessons.

As I said, I don't mind some diversifying. What I think would be bad is if we pick slingshot, then we pick melee training, then we pick an Astra book, and so on.

 

[Kipeci]

This poll took a long fucking time so be grateful. Kipeci I didn't understand your book vote, as it seems you only placed one for one book? Would you mind clarifying. I left you out of the vote till the clarification.

===Poll===

Books:

I. Stars, Cosmos, Gods - 5

II. Towerspace: A Topological Study - 5 (4)

III. Flora and Fauna of the Tower - 10 (11)

IV. A Primer to Astras - 11 (12)

V. Mathematics Part I - 2

VI. How to Make Friends - 1 (0)

Skills:

A. Melee and unarmed combat - 5 (2)

B. Ranged combat - 5 (8)

C. Astra usage - 6 (7)

D. Alchemy - 1 (0)

E. Traps - 1

Conversation:

A. The association that she belongs to, the Hunters - 8

B. The monsters that she hunts - 2

C. The Cannibal Duke, John Bull - 3

D. Her personal history - 4

E. Nothing - 0

Votes

Spoiler

Books:
Kz3ro - I & III
Orbit - IV & V
Asxetos - IV & III
CappenVarra - III > II > IV > I > V > VI
Egosphere - I & V
Nevill - III & IV
Baktika9 - I & IV
hello friend - IV > VI > III
Azira - IV > III > II > I > V > VI
Absinthe - I > IV > V
Kalarion - II & III
Esquilax - I & III
baud - II & IV
ItsChon - II & III
Lambchop19 - III & IV
Grimgravy - III & IV
Tigranes - II & IV

Skills:
Kz3ro - C
Orbit - C > E
Asxetos - C > B
CappenVarra - D > B > E > C > A
Egosphere - C
Nevill - B
Baktika9 - A > B
hello friend - A > E
Azira - C > E > D > A > B
Kipeci - C
Absinthe - A > C
Kalarion - B > C
Esquilax - A > B
baud - B > C > A
ItsChon - B
Lambchop19 - A
Grimgravy - E
Tigranes - B > E > C

Conversation:

Kz3ro - C
Orbit - A
Asxetos - A
CappenVarra - B > A > C > D > E
Egosphere - A
Nevill - C
Baktika9 - D
hello friend - D
Azira - A > D > C > E
Kipeci - B
Absinthe - > E
Kalarion - A > B
Esquilax - D
baud - D
ItsChon - A
Lambchop19 - C
Grimgravy - A > D
Tigranes - A

EDIT: God damn it Baltika. Well my poll still shows individual breakdowns on each subsection, so vote accordingly. It's looking like the first and third choice are a lock, but there is still room for the standings to change in the skills section if some fortuitous flops occur.

I’ll also chip in a vote for A II then, might come in handy for our Astra mapping to have more of a clue about those stranger aspects.

 

[Kz3r0]

Actually C Astra Usage is winning:

A
5 votes
1 third conditionals(6)
1 fourth conditionals(7)
1 fifth conditionals(8)total.

B
5 votes
4 second conditionals(9)
1 fifth conditionals(10)total.

C
6 votes
3 second conditionals(9)
1 third conditionals(10)
1 fourth conditionals(11)total.

 

[Baltika9]

The point, once again, is to say these are the 2-3 things we really like, so let's mostly focus on that. Are we a book & hunter guy? OK. Are we a book & hunter & melee & woodcarving guy? Less OK.

I was thinking more along the lines of: fighter+scholar+ranger. Motherfucking Aragorn up in this bitch, we do the shooty and the stabby.

What I think would be bad is if we pick slingshot, then we pick melee training, then we pick an Astra book, and so on.

I can respect that even though I am at odds with your eternal conservatism. But what else is new?

I’ll also chip in a vote for A II then, might come in handy for our Astra mapping to have more of a clue about those stranger aspects.

I'll follow suit. Flopping to 1 A: II+III for that good ranger action.

 

[ItsChon]

It's impossible to easily tell anything from the way you're grouping stuff Kz3r0. Assuming this list of votes I have is updated,

Skills:
Kz3ro - C
Orbit - C > E
Asxetos - C > B
CappenVarra - D > B > E > C > A
Egosphere - C
Nevill - B
Baktika9 - A > B
hello friend - A > E
Azira - C > E > D > A > B
Kipeci - C
Absinthe - A > C
Kalarion - B > C
Esquilax - A > B
baud - B > C > A
ItsChon - B
Lambchop19 - A
Grimgravy - E
Tigranes - B > E > C

Counting all this, I come out with

A. Melee and unarmed combat - 5 (2)

B. Ranged combat - 5 (8)

C. Astra usage - 6 (7)

D. Alchemy - 1 (0)

E. Traps - 1

With five votes being cast for B, and 3 conditionals coming from Baltika, Esquilax, and CappenVarra. C has six votes, but only one conditional coming from Absinthe. I literally don't see any other conditionals flopping over to C in case of a loss.

 

[Tigranes]

You know, at this point we should just be voting using brofists on treave's update posts

 

[ItsChon]

Eh, would work if it's just one option but there's no way to vote on multiple options since we can only leave one rating.

 

[Kz3r0]

With five votes being cast for B, and 3 conditionals coming from Baltika, Esquilax, and CappenVarra. C has six votes, but only one conditional coming from Absinthe. I literally don't see any other conditionals flopping over to C in case of a loss.

Debatable, C is the clear winner hence flops should be counted in its favor first if at all.

 

[Kz3r0]

You know, at this point we should just be voting using brofists on treave's update posts

We should abolish conditionals, they complicate things for nothing, people can always flop if the option they don’t like is winning.

 

[ItsChon]

Debatable, C is the clear winner hence flops should be counted in its favor first.

What flops are in favor of it? Are you trying to say that, for example, Kalarion's vote should flip from B to C because C is winning? Or are you trying to say that Cappens vote should be counted as a vote for C instead of B, since even though B is further up in his priority list, it'd be losing before all the flops are counted? Either of these would be wrong though, because the flops are there so someone's vote can be counted if their first, second, or even third choices are negated. It should be done in the priority order that someone sets it up in. There are literally no other conditionals that could be counted towards C though.

We should abolish conditionals, they complicate things for nothing, people can always flop if the option they don’t like is winning.

Eh it's fine, not like we've had any problems with it up till this point, and tbh I'm fairly certain that both Baltika and my counts are correct.

 

[Kz3r0]

Either of these would be wrong though, because the flops are there so someone's vote can be counted if their first, second, or even third choices are negated.

C won, hence B is negated, hence B votes with second option C should be voted as C.

Eh it's fine, not like we've had any problems with it up till this point, and tbh I'm fairly certain that both Baltika and my counts are correct.

Whatever, I flop to B so everyone is happy.

 

[Baltika9]

You know, at this point we should just be voting using brofists on treave's update posts

We should abolish conditionals, they complicate things for nothing, people can always flop if the option they don’t like is winning.

I'm all for it, but they are there to help people who don't camp the Codex 24/7, as hello friend puts it. I suppose the best way to resolve this issue is to, you guessed it, put it to a vote.

I vote for cancelling conditionals, unless that option is winning, in which case I flop to supporting conditionals.

Whatever, I flop to B so everyone is happy.

Not me.

Vote for 2A, bros. Pwetty pwease.

 

[ItsChon]

C won, hence B is negated, hence B votes with second option C should be voted as C.

None of the updates have been counted like that, and it doesn't make any sense. Why would we flop Kalarion's vote from B to C, if B is going to win with the other conditionals counted. Regardless you flopped to B, so it doesn't matter. Here is updated count.

===Poll===

Books:

I. Stars, Cosmos, Gods - 4

II. Towerspace: A Topological Study - 7 (6)

III. Flora and Fauna of the Tower - 12 (13)

IV. A Primer to Astras - 12(13)

V. Mathematics Part I - 2

VI. How to Make Friends - 1 (0)

Skills:

A. Melee and unarmed combat - 6 (7)

B. Ranged combat - 5 (7)

C. Astra usage - 5 (4)

D. Alchemy - 1 (0)

E. Traps - 2 (1)

Conversation:

A. The association that she belongs to, the Hunters - 7

B. The monsters that she hunts - 2

C. The Cannibal Duke, John Bull - 4

D. Her personal history - 5

E. Nothing - 0

Votes

Spoiler

Books:
Kz3ro - I & III
Orbit - IV & V
Asxetos - IV & III
CappenVarra - III > II > IV > I > V > VI
Egosphere - I & V
Nevill - III & IV
Baktika9 - II & III
hello friend - IV > VI > III
Azira - IV > III > II > I > V > VI
Absinthe - I > IV > V
Kalarion - II & III
Esquilax - I & III
baud - II & IV
ItsChon - II & III
Lambchop19 - III & IV
Grimgravy - III & IV
Tigranes - II & IV
Kipeci - II & IV
Oscar - III & IV

Skills:
Kz3ro - A
Orbit - C > E
Asxetos - C > B
CappenVarra - D > B > E > C > A
Egosphere - C
Nevill - B
Baktika9 - A > B
hello friend - A > E > C
Azira - C
Kipeci - C
Absinthe - A > C
Kalarion - B > C
Esquilax - A > B
baud - B > C > A
ItsChon - B
Lambchop19 - A
Grimgravy - E
Tigranes - B > E > C
Oscar - E > A

Conversation:

Kz3ro - C
Orbit - A
Asxetos - A
CappenVarra - B > A > C > D > E
Egosphere - A
Nevill - C
Baktika9 - D
hello friend - D
Azira - D > A > C > E
Kipeci - B
Absinthe - > E
Kalarion - A > B
Esquilax - D
baud - D
ItsChon - A
Lambchop19 - C
Grimgravy - A > D
Tigranes - A
Oscar - C

Looks like the clear winners are,

III & IV
B
A

treave Do with that information what you may and give your lock warning whenever.

 

[hello friend]

I'm gonna change my conditionals for skill training option: A>E>C

 

[Kz3r0]

Not me.

Vote for 2A, bros. Pwetty pwease.

Ockay, flopping to
A
Melee.

 

[ItsChon]

God damn it. With Kz3r0's flop the score is now tied at

A. Melee and unarmed combat - 6 (7)

B. Ranged combat - 5 (7)

I updated your choice hello friend but your new conditional doesn't matter since the race is between A and B now with Kz3r0's flop.

 

[Nevill]

God damn it. With Kz3r0's flop the score is now tied at

I would agree with Kz3r0's opinion on conditionals. A single conditional with a secondary preference is fine, three or four is just a mark of lazy people unable to make up their mind.

It might be better to just count the votes, and resolve the flops much later once the voting stops since the way they resolve depends on the current vote count.

For example... why do you flop votes away from C when it and B both have 5 votes? There is an equal chance Kalarion, baud and Tigranes flop to C, making it win.

Spoiler

Kalarion - B > C
baud - B > C > A
Tigranes - B > E > C

It's between A, B and C in equal measure, and you don't flop contenders that have a chance of winning.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

Lambchop19 I specifically addressed all of that in the post you quoted.

We've basically only had two combat encounters. One was a pretty exceptional circumstance (Child v. Shadowbeast), while in the other, ranged weaponry could have been useful but we had lost our inventory. There isn't much evidence that melee is exceptionally useful above ranged or magic. It's just a question of what we want to be good at.

Do we want to invest into melee long term? I'm OK with that! I'm saying we need SOME measure of coherence even for a hybrid build with melee or magic. Right now we're chasing after the newest shiny thing every single update. If we pick up the Astra book here and ask Tlalli about magic, I'm OK with that. We don't gotta fire bows 18 hours a day. But I'm not sure we want to pick up a slingshot, then learn a bit of melee, then read a book about astras.

Look, you asked why I said that melee was a frequently used skill. My point was that it's the only combat skill we've used, therefore, yes, it is. I think a frequently used skill ought to have some training behind it.

Also, no, we don't need too much coherence when it comes to skills at the moment. Why? Because again: we're 10.

Our class will take shape over time, organically, as it has in every LP.

This is our one chance to learn Aztec-style melee from someone who is likely a master at it. I'd rather not waste it when we can practice our slingshot skills in the village.