Morrowind vs Neverwinter nights

[Gargaune]

whataboutism.

Ahem! You will speak proper English to me or not at all, I do not converse with adherents of the Zoom.

And no, I'm not deflecting from anything. I have - repeatedly to the point of getting tired now - emphasised NWN's role as a platform for creating modules and playing with others in various formats, so invoking "what about X or Y" isn't digressing when the subject is precisely the platform enabling people to dream up their own Xs or Ys. I've given you a couple of examples off the top of my head of how Open Lock's adherence to its "full action" descriptor could be tactically relevant in a RTwP rendition of D&D.

The ruleset for 2e is the pearls. 3e, Bioware, Wotc, and NWN are the swine.

I'm not here for a pissing match over editions, it's immaterial. NWN was built on 3E, so I'm arguing relative to that ruleseet.

No. They are relevant to the action economy. If a 1 hour spell for a level one character runs out in 20 rounds, then you'll have to recast it in 20 rounds. Whereas in tabletop within the standard round times, you shouldn't have to worry about that until 600 rounds later. If there is a situation where you have to choose either to do an attack, move, recast a buff, etc. fairly regularly, then it is part of the action economy. Within the NWN timescale, the 20 rounds instead of 600 rounds makes it a much more significant portion of the action economy since it will run out within a few encounters instead of just after you clear a dungeon. It does significantly affect the action economy.

I dunno what tables you play on top of, but in my paltry experience, the DM moves the clock forward on a narrative basis, e.g. "By the time you emerge from the dungeon, the sun has set." Man, traveling across a mountain must be a real pain for your group.

Jokes aside, your only argument here is that in NWN, Mage Armor might expire in the middle of combat, whereas a DM won't typically do that (though they might at the start of a random encounter). The point is that these long term spells have an abstracted duration anyway, and they fall into per-rest resource management instead of the economy of a self-contained encounter. But if I can unlock the chest and then move in the same 6-second round, that's a significant change to momentary action economy, it could facilitate a different tactical approach. And before you go back to your 2-second real-time round idea, take a moment to consider how it's going to look and control for your PC to take an attack and move up to 30ft in that timeframe.

Except many modules, especially the big ones, this isn't the case. Many tend to use the same timescales.

It was a side note. Just an FYI that the platform can do that, if you want it to. Actually, it could be a cool gimmick for a timed module.

It was garbage in ToEE and it's garbage in NWN too.

That's a pretty edgy take, my man. Next thing you know, you'll tell me NWN2's Quickcast was decline too.

 

[luj1]

NwN with its 3 campaigns (OC, SoU, HotU) was great... i actually prefered SoU among the three. Very cleanly executed smallish campaign

There was a really funny interaction in SoU where a bandit took a woman's baby hostage, I went to get the child, ended up killing both the bandit and baby, then told the woman her baby didn't survive. She went into shock, then I told her I lied her and that her child is actually alive. She briefly rejoiced, then I said no I was just joking your baby is really dead.

The desert interlude was also really cool and difficult

Also the quest where you went back to the past to make Netherese guardian golems vulnerable in the present was brilliant

The OC has a railroaded "dragon ball" structure. It repeats in every arc. Collect the Waterdhavian creatures, collect the Words of Power, etc. This is the main criticism. But other than that, the OC is solid

You have plenty of peripeteia, interesting characters, optional content, good writing, changes of scenery, etc.

The quest when you needed to commit ritual suicide and travel into the spiritual plane to cure the forest spirit, or entering a snow globe to settle a perpetual astral war between fairies and dwarves in a pocket realm. Castle Jhareg with the two bros who age differently, etc. This is all leaps and bounds ahead of PoE, Tyranny or Kingmaker

TLDR the 2002 NwN is a legendary game

 

[Funposter]

except for morrowind fanboys, like Funposter he only pops up when there is a thread about morrowind.

not once have i ever denied that i am THE BIG MORROWIND FAN

 

[ERYFKRAD]

I don't get JarlFrank 's problem with lockpicking in NWN, truth be told. Never waited 6 seconds to open stuff.

 

[Vic]

I just send my companion to open the lock and then check my inventory or something for a few seconds. better than a lockpicking minigame.

 

[Vic]

The OC has a railroaded "dragon ball" structure. It repeats in every arc.

they "rhyme"

 

[Sabotin]

Pfff, rogues. Just Knock/Find Traps and instantly clean up everything in a huge area, even through walls and off-screen...

 

[ERYFKRAD]

I just send my companion to open the lock and then check my inventory or something for a few seconds. better than a lockpicking minigame.

I just bash them.

 

[Beans00]

The desert

JarlFrank and I want to know why you dislike gothic.

 

[NwNgger]

So I don't like either of these games, but this thread isn't about my opinion.


-Both these games are very divisive, people either tend to love them or completely hate them
-Both were made by rpg devs who previously made popular games among rpg fans(bg/daggerfall) who would go on to make more financially successful games that would gradually be less and less popular on the codex.
-Both came out within 2 months of each other in 2002
-Both have pretty big modding scenes and came with tool kits to do your own shit
-Both have fans who are fairly rabid, who seem to take anyone disliking either of these two games as a personal insult.
-Both were hated on the codex for a long time, both have seen somewhat of a rehabilitation.



Which do you like more? Or which do you hate more? Or do you hate both equally, or do you hate one slightly less then the other? Or do you like both?

This is such a retarded comparrison. Like comparing a regular printer to a 3D printer and finding the 3D printer wanting because it can't print paper. Neverwinter Nights from the start was designed as a toolset with a campaign to show off the toolset. Morrowind was a game with some optional modtools. This is seen in the actual mod scenes for both. Morrowind mods ADD ON to the existing game for the most part. With the rare TC such as Starwind as an exception. You mostly get quests, weapons and NPCs that bolt on to the existing game. Neverwinter Nights mods are mostly whole new campaigns. The base campaigns were mediocre to okay. In a game like Baldur's Gate that would be unacceptable but the draw is the wonderful modules and persistant worlds made by the fans. Modules like Aieland, Swordflight, and more are better than Bioware's output for the past decade.

 

[luj1]

The desert

JarlFrank and I want to know why you dislike gothic.

i dont dislike gothic, its just a bland version of morrowind to me

 

[Vic]

its just a bland version of morrowind to me

gothic was first tho

 

[Levenmouth]

its just a bland version of morrowind to me

gothic was first tho

It’s also less bland and unlike NWN and Morrowind tells a story without forcing the player to navigate through endless and mostly boring walls of exposition.

 

[Vic]

idk I like all 3 games

 

[Levenmouth]

Bro, gotta keep up the manufactured rivalry here, come on.

 

[Vic]

Bro, gotta keep up the manufactured rivalry here, come on.

I played around 100 hours of Morrowind last year, my major complain is that it has way too much random loot in all those barrels and shit.
I'm currently playing NWN OC and I can't get myself to play past Act 2, typical BioWare find the 4 wigets BS.
I'd love to play Gothic again but when I tried last year I just couldn't get past the janky controls and ugly graphics.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

The desert

JarlFrank and I want to know why you dislike gothic.

i dont dislike gothic, its just a bland version of morrowind to me

Lmao this nigger can't play a game unless it comes with mushroom trees.

 

[Levenmouth]

Bro, gotta keep up the manufactured rivalry here, come on.

I'd love to play Gothic again but when I tried last year I just couldn't get past the janky controls and ugly graphics.

You can always play Elex 2. Guys have been making the same for the past 20 years, though I found the most recent one to be pretty boring somehow.

 

[Beans00]

The desert

JarlFrank and I want to know why you dislike gothic.

i dont dislike gothic, its just a bland version of morrowind to me

JarlFrank and I don't really understand what you mean

 

[Ryzer]

They're nothing like each other

Both are Action RPG and have exploration

So they have everything in common.

 

[Funposter]

They're nothing like each other

Both are Action RPG and have exploration

So they have everything in common.

Quake and Call of Duty both have guns and multiplayer

 

[luj1]

JarlFrank and I don't really understand what you mean

both are biome-based open world free-form games with no scaling or respawning

do keep reporting on how the speleological exploration of JarlFrank's rectal channels is going tho

Spoiler

(maybe there's a free game there who knows?)

 

[luj1]

Lmao this nigger can't play a game unless it comes with mushroom trees.

yeah miss me with brown nothingburger worlds

 

[MLMarkland]

NWN 1/2 produced more professional game developers than any other game series in history. They are best thought of as a modding platform with tools to emulate pnp RPGs online.

Morrowing is a superior game by most metrics, as a game, but it lacks more of the innovative features of NWN series.

 

[Beans00]

JarlFrank and I don't really understand what you mean

both are biome-based open world free-form games with no scaling or respawning

do keep reporting on how the speleological exploration of JarlFrank's rectal channels is going tho

Spoiler

(maybe there's a free game there who knows?)

Jarlfrank and I are friends and we discuss games on a semi regular basis.
I am friends with several codexers on discord and steam, who I have spirited debates with regarding games.

Also Morrowind does infact feature enemies respawning.
https://help.bethesda.net/#en/answer/17610

Also gothic has respawning enemies too(although they only respawn when chapters end)


Have you actually played Morrowind and gothic? The more you type the more I think you just watched lets plays because your pc couldn't run these games...