NWN Neverwinter Nights: Enhanced Edition - Beamdog's final enhancement - now with new premium modules

[KeighnMcDeath]

Is this company after all these titles? Are they planning to get TOEE and POR:RoM (I guess Ubisoft still own this pool).

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

I only noticed this enhanced version today when looking at free demos on gog. At first I thought the free NWN freebies was for what I already owned (since I just clicked and didn’t read) and then I realized I couldn’t get the freebies as I said I didn’t own the enhanced edition.

And god that list for everything is big so of course there is an Ultimate Edition for $34 or something atm.

Neverwinter Nights: Enhanced Edition Digital Deluxe Edition
Awaiting more ratings

52.09
-35%

33.85

Or just search on GOG Neverwinter Nights enhanced edition. Jesus fuck!

Has anyone here bought the full package and played multiplayer? How does it compare to the original?

I had a look at all this yesterday as someone mentioned Gog has changed their interface so I went for a nosey around the site. The NWN:EE was one of the first things that I noticed as I'm a big fan of Hordes of the Underdark & there's so many games in the NWN catalogue it would make for a good title to use to see how Gog have altered the interface. The new interface is not as good as Gog's old interface, Gog seems to have declined, but onto Neverwinter Nights:

The regular Diamond Edition is still completely free & I already own this, & this comprises the Original Campaign, Shadows of the Undrentide, Hordes of the Underdark, Kingmaker, Witches Wake & Shadowguard & the OST & etc.

The regular EE version is just the EE version of the Diamond Edition, so if you don't care about whatever the EE brings (possibly compatibility with whatever system you use) then you might as well stick with the free original.

What interests me is the new easy availability of the Premium Modules:

Darkness Over Daggerford
Wyvern Crown of Cormyr
Pirates of the Sword Coast
Heroes of Neverwinter
Infinate Dungeons

The regular EE version doesn't include these & they are not compatible with the original free Diamond Edition. You can buy these 'new' modules individually, but they all require the base EE original game to function.

The Deluxe Edition includes all these new modules + their OSTs, & since each costs about $3 each excluding the OSTs, the price of the regular EE + all the individual modules & OSTs about matches the Deluxe price.

So paying $30 for the EE Deluxe is probably a bit too much still, but then again possibly not, as its still only $6 per new game, but I'm not in any urgent need for games at this moment in time. For me, the valuation of the EE is irrelevant, it's just a matter of looking at the price of the modules. It's a shame the original version never managed to 'package' all the best modules & that was something I always moaned about, so now some have been properly packaged I can't really complain about it, though it is annoying its been done alongside all the EE weirdness & rebuying what you already owned three times before bullshit.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Well, physical copies I have done the same via different bundled packaging. My Bethesda collection, ULTIMA collection, bardstale, and gold box collection and other odd games are duplicated when I was bundle bargain shopping in bins for cheap.

I’ll wait for a sale and decide. Thanksgiving and Xmas is coming up.

 

[thesheeep]

There is an actual argument for the enhanced editions in their support of other platforms.
But that's pretty much all there is to it.

I bought the game just to find out what actually improved and... well.. it was pretty much nothing.
The game is as butt ugly as it was when it released. The blurry, large-scaled icons, the horrendous 3D models, the clinical cleanliness of the entire environment, the catastrophically ugly UI, the weird hover effects when leaving an area, the small size of the areas, the camera controls from hell, ... everything about this game is ugly as hell. And it has always been - it's not like I loathe oldschool graphics, I recently replayed Turok (yes the N64 one) and the graphics in there are old, but have a coherent style that still has its appeal. In contrast to NWN.
You'd expect them to improve all of that.
They improved nothing.
I refunded after an hour, of which 30 minutes was creating my character.

Now there's talk about higher polygon models, but at this rate it'll probably take several years to get anywhere.

 

[Vulpes]

I'm having a hard time finding proof that this whole thing wasn't just a massive waste of everybody's time and money. Are there even any good decent modules out there that are exclusive to EE?

 

[Lilura]

For me, the valuation of the EE is irrelevant, it's just a matter of looking at the price of the modules. It's a shame the original version never managed to 'package' all the best modules & that was something I always moaned about, so now some have been properly packaged I can't really complain about it, though it is annoying its been done alongside all the EE weirdness & rebuying what you already owned three times before bullshit.

So what you're saying is that you're a retard.

You don't care how many bugs, incompatibilities and imbalances EE introduces; you don't care how it changes the game for good and for bad or how it affects the commmunity; all you care about - if you were to fork out yet again - is that shit premium modules (and they are shit compared to the best of the free, user-made modules downloadable on the Vault) are all bundled together so you can finally have all that useless garbage in one big retarded collector's pack that you'll never play.

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

For me, the valuation of the EE is irrelevant, it's just a matter of looking at the price of the modules. It's a shame the original version never managed to 'package' all the best modules & that was something I always moaned about, so now some have been properly packaged I can't really complain about it, though it is annoying its been done alongside all the EE weirdness & rebuying what you already owned three times before bullshit.

So what you're saying is that you're a retard.

You don't care how many bugs, incompatibilities and imbalances EE introduces; you don't care how it changes the game for good and for bad or how it affects the commmunity; all you care about - if you were to fork out yet again - is that shit premium modules (and they are shit compared to the best of the free, user-made modules downloadable on the Vault) are all bundled together so you can finally have all that useless garbage in one big retarded collector's pack that you'll never play.

Love the hypocrisy about how you're allowed to buy the EE so that YOU can review them & pass YOUR judgement for your blog, but somehow I'm not allowed to do the same thing just without being ego-driven by a blog.

Tell you what, how about if I promise to blog about it after I buy it (if I ever do), fair?

 

[Lacrymas]

The old Diamond Edition on GOG included all the premium modules, including Pirates of the Sword Coast. You can also get them all on NWVault. Darkness over Daggerford too, but that was always free.

 

[fantadomat]

Instead, I would be covering Pathfinder and whatever other current gen crap's come out lately.

Well kingmaker will on IE's games level after it gets patched and DLCed. It is a great game that could become a classic in a decade . Don't ignore it because of snobism!

 

[Lilura]

Love the hypocrisy about how you're allowed to buy the EE so that YOU can review them & pass YOUR judgement for your blog, but somehow I'm not allowed to do the same thing just without being ego-driven by a blog.

I don't care if you purchase NWN:EE or not. I just think your reason for considering a purchase is retarded because you only care about having a big retarded collector's pack.

Anyway, you are normally a good poster so I'm not going to hold this against you (though I really should).

Don't ignore it because of snobism!

What you call snobbery I call good taste. But really, this is off-topic don't you think?

 

[Bocian]

There is an actual argument for the enhanced editions in their support of other platforms.
But that's pretty much all there is to it.

I bought the game just to find out what actually improved and... well.. it was pretty much nothing.
The game is as butt ugly as it was when it released. The blurry, large-scaled icons, the horrendous 3D models, the clinical cleanliness of the entire environment, the catastrophically ugly UI, the weird hover effects when leaving an area, the small size of the areas, the camera controls from hell, ... everything about this game is ugly as hell. And it has always been - it's not like I loathe oldschool graphics, I recently replayed Turok (yes the N64 one) and the graphics in there are old, but have a coherent style that still has its appeal. In contrast to NWN.
You'd expect them to improve all of that.
They improved nothing.
I refunded after an hour, of which 30 minutes was creating my character.

Now there's talk about higher polygon models, but at this rate it'll probably take several years to get anywhere.

People in the business claim that the toolset has also been somewhat improved, so we have to give them credit for that. But, is this change so impactful, considering how much stuff has been made with the "old" toolset? Even if - you're still paying for the tools to make your own game, not for the game. Community has made this game look better than any Ossians or Beamdogs will ever manage.

Does this truly look bad? I'd rather have this than plastic NWN2 graphics with bad color palette and contrasts that burn out the eyes, or shit that Beamdog has showcased already. Default models are horrid, nobody disagrees, but the game can look even better than this what's above. And this is entirely community resources.

 

[thesheeep]

Spoiler

Does this truly look bad?

Yes. And it gets even worse in motion. Just look at the shadows. Oh, right, in most cases there are none... I mean, not even cheap spot shadows, and all those "my first 3D program" effects. Just makes me shudder.
These screens (and community stuff in general) do look better than the vanilla game, but that's really not saying much. And even if it looked acceptable, there'd still be that interface...

I'd rather have this than plastic NWN2 graphics with bad color palette and contrasts that burn out the eyes, or shit that Beamdog has showcased already.

Meh, though NWN2 looks bad as well (especially early on), at least things have some more detail and way better shading to them.

 

[Lilura]

Community has made this game look better than any Ossians or Beamdogs will ever manage.

Actually, Ossian are pretty good on the aesthetics side. I wouldn't discount them.

Darkness Over Daggerford has some nice DLA-based tileset design (with undulating terrain), and some lovely placeables (like the signs fitted to the walls of buildings).

The only truly impressive image you posted was the tavern one (probably a PW labor of love). The rest look pretty stock.

And NWN2 looks better. A gifted terrain sculptor is going to outdo a gifted tilesetter everytime. That it takes them much longer to create an area is beside the point: we're talking about aesthetics, and good things come to those who wait.

Show me that NWN2 meteor crater that I posted for NWN. Or anything like it. Show me NWN flora. Show me NWN mountains.

Also, this screencap doesn't do the VFX justice: it's molten rock with fiery shimmering distorting the models. This same module has boiling mud and noxious gases with similar fx. Can't do this in NWN.

Placeable density:

You can't get tactical angles like this in NWN:

Also, facial expressions can be done with NWN2. Maerduin did a good job of this in Harp & Chrysanthemum.

NWN2 is a beautiful game with a powerful cam.

 

[Infinitron]

The old Diamond Edition on GOG included all the premium modules, including Pirates of the Sword Coast.

I don't think this is true. It came only with the premium modules in the Kingmaker boxed expansion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neverwinter_Nights:_Kingmaker

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

Love the hypocrisy about how you're allowed to buy the EE so that YOU can review them & pass YOUR judgement for your blog, but somehow I'm not allowed to do the same thing just without being ego-driven by a blog.

I don't care if you purchase NWN:EE or not. I just think your reason for considering a purchase is retarded because you only care about having a big retarded collector's pack.

Anyway, you are normally a good poster so I'm not going to hold this against you (though I really should).

I'll explain my personal position with NWN1 so you have a better understanding of where I'm coming from regards the debacle.

I'm not a modder & have never had any interest in modding generally. This in itself might or might not be a decline mentality, I guess that would depend on each individual. What I personally imagine as the incline aspect of having someone like me in a community is that, by not ever being attracted by modding, I will only judge a game by its non-modded standard - ie: people like me pressure game companies to deliver a finished product. The more money is spent on a game the bigger the pressure. "mods will fix it" will not be a part of people like our's language & the consumer accountability will rest with the developers of the product.

Obviously, the decline aspect of people such as myself is that sometimes we'll forever shit on games where mods do genuinely fix things for the better & we're just being stubborn for not taking the opportunity to play a decent game. We view that as "letting developers off the hook in perpetuity" and therefore perpetually allow inferiority to replicate. As a result, people like us don't usually tend to really get into one specific game beyond the process of simply playing them or occasionally replaying them.

As a result, people like us are never going to be specifically a part of a 'deep community' of any specific game, be it one a site like this laughs at like Skyrim or, equally, a game a site like this is obsessed with like the eternal struggle to make Arcanum a finished product. As such, many of the 'wars' of politics & behind the scenes drama of gaming rarely catches our interest unless its specifically outrageous (such as loot boxes, microtransactions & other money related scams disrupting gameplay design etc). It's a very 'grey' position (see my avatar). We can still be fanboys of specific games though, dedicated fanboys of those games that we deem worthy.

Neverwinter Nights:

NWN is an odd ball for people such as us. It is a combination of modding and completely new game creation. We want to play all the great new campaigns, but preferably without all the usual modding palaver. We just want to be able to hear about a new game someone's made, click the download link and then play it. No formatting, no file moving, no multiple downloads in specific directories, no drastic altering of settings & etc etc etc. Yes, that's really lame isn't it. I get that, if something is worth playing one should put the effort in to getting it. However, people like us aren't dedicated enough to that degree to care about a game so much that we will be determined to go to those lengths. It's just a case of "you have a new game do you? Ok, give us the link & I'll try it", because anything more than that & there's another guy with a game he wants us to try where all there is is a link & download. He's sorted his shit out, so he wins today's allotted amount of time to play a game. For someone like you, with a specific dedication, you live in a completely different world, a world with an equally good purpose, but with different needs and requirement thresholds.

Even as far back as the initial release of NWN I've always asked why doesn't Bioware release the modules as games. Since they're actual games instead of just affectation changes then I'm happy to pay for them & I should think other people would to, just as long as when they're 'released' they are actually finished products worth what the asking price is. People like us will pay to not have to trawl the modding community like blind people at a flea market. Someone's made a great little adventure? Great, shove it on a disc & stick a price on it.

I guess the issue here then becomes one of community philosophical intent combined with the complexities of legality of ownership & the confusion of rights and liabilities. The kind of stuff people such as myself do not wish to get involved in. We're just sitting here waiting for that one link to that game someone said was good. The EE has complicated this even further, no doubt & I've no doubt the community is, once again, discussing these very topics. & this is why I get you balking at me for just looking at the EE and me thinking, "hey, there's some 'new' finished products there that only require a click to download and play & are now supposedly relatively problem-free/bug free/safe-links as guaranteed by the imposition of a price-tag (at least that's how a consumer situation should function)".

If you think purchasing the EE significantly damages the community & that this is credible and important enough an issue that all people should be aware of from a consumer safety standpoint, then by all means educate me on this. If it's just a matter of a community civil-war & general bickering, then also feel free to make me aware of that, but in the mean time, what I see is 'finished products' that may deserve rewarding financially for getting their shit together combined with them being games I'm interested in.

What do you genuinely hope for the future? If I hold out for a few years do you think the community will one day be at one with the EEs? Or are you adamant that this is the beginning of the end of the community you know & love?

 

[Lacrymas]

The old Diamond Edition on GOG included all the premium modules, including Pirates of the Sword Coast.

I don't think this is true. It came only with the premium modules in the Kingmaker boxed expansion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neverwinter_Nights:_Kingmaker

Yeah, you are right, I just downloaded the installer from GOG and it's only the ones in Kingmaker. I thought I had gotten all the others from GOG too, I distinctly remember an installer for them, but now I'm not sure where I got them. Either way, they are available on the NWVault. No need to buy the EE for them.

 

[YldriE]

Spoiler

Not to be a joykiller but it looks like the big issue is that they go out of their way to zoom in an isometric game. Even Sword Coast Legends, a game that otherwise looks superb from afar, doesn't do that. I know the game being in 3D was a big deal in PR at the time, but it was still a successor to Baldur's Gate 2. This is not a trick question: do NVN players consider it important that the game look good from up close and do they zoom in frequently?

Edit: But to answer the question it does look nice... just overstraining an antiquated engine.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Am I blind or did I just now fail to realize they removed the NWN DE? I don’t see it listed in search. At least they didn’t remove it from my library.

I only really bought the series for the mods tbh. Actually, I bought it for the POR mod since I was trying to expand a tabletop game with ideas from all the sources (novels, the Ad&D and 3.0 modules, both POR games, POD, SOTSB, COAB)

The old gog version isn’t missing anything is it?

 

[thesheeep]

Not to be a joykiller but it looks like the big issue is that they go out of their way to zoom in an isometric game. Even Sword Coast Legends, a game that otherwise looks superb from afar, doesn't do that. I know the game being in 3D was a big deal in PR at the time, but it was still a successor to Baldur's Gate 2. This is not a trick question: do NVN players consider it important that the game look good from up close and do they zoom in frequently?

NWN is a single character (+ 2 companions but not even direct control) game and as such it can focus on a much smaller area.
You don't need to get any real overview if all you directly control is one character.
So NWN was always meant to played with a close zoom.

 

[Lacrymas]

Am I blind or did I just now fail to realize they removed the NWN DE? I don’t see it listed in search. At least they didn’t remove it from my library.

The old gog version isn’t missing anything is it?

This is what Beamdog do, they force (?) the removal of the original versions from GOG (no idea about Steam) and you can only buy their crap. The originals are bundled with the EEs. So, yeah, you aren't blind, they've removed every original instance of the IE games, with the exception of IWD2.

 

[Lilura]

This is what Beamdog do, they force (?) the removal of the original versions from GOG (no idea about Steam) and you can only buy their crap. The originals are bundled with the EEs. So, yeah, you aren't blind, they've removed every original instance of the IE games, with the exception of IWD2.

Glad they couldn't find the source code for IWD2.

And yeah, the original Diamond edition can only be obtained by purchasing the "Enhanced" edition. This is how they ensure that their edition is the top-selling and effectively the only edition. And yeah, this is what they did with the Infinity Engine games.

As with the IE games, if they left Diamond up as a separate purchase then it would probably outsell "Enhanced" (cheaper, compatible with more servers, doesn't have the Beamdog name attached to it.)

NWN Diamond and NWN2 are not on Steam. NWN2 used to be but got taken down (I think those who puchased it still have it to play). I don't think Diamond or Platinum ever were (I could be wrong, I was never big on Steam).

 

[Lilura]

Here is some modding done with NWN:EE enhancements, btw.

 

[fantadomat]

This thread should be nuked out of existence. It is 90 pages of the same shit on endless repetition! This must be the 10th time somebody makes the same statement that beamdog are pile of greedy retards...and then people keep repeating it 10 more times but in different post structure.

 

[Turjan]

This thread should be nuked out of existence. It is 90 pages of the same shit on endless repetition! This must be the 10th time somebody makes the same statement that beamdog are pile of greedy retards...and then people keep repeating it 10 more times but in different post structure.

This is different from any other Beamdog thread how?

Of course, we could always talk about PoE. That would be completely unique.

 

[Lacrymas]

If Beamdog stop blaspheming and pissing in our soup, then maybe we'll have other things to talk about in a thread dedicated to them. Like, oh, I don't know, make their own game.