Incline Nexus Now Disallowing Creators To Delete Their Mods (Aug 5 Cutoff Date Passed)

[JamesDixon]

Oh jesus christ, I'm not talking about gaming, I'm talking about all of life. About consumerism. About enabling an entity like Nexus to continue profiting off advertisements while you get no royalty. Nexus is a business. And it's playing dirty tactics (legal ones, obviously).

Don't be myopic. On one side, the fucking modders. On the other, the business. And all the other businesses that Nexus pushed aside. Which is why Deadlystream and ModDB will probably be there quite fine for modding whatever happens to Nexus.

This applies to everything, not just gaming. Unless you think AAA publishers are magicians who got successful... Well, they used you.

You don't get to earn royalties when you are using someone else's property without license. You cannot earn money as it's not your property. Lawyers have repeatedly said that when you use someone else's product to make a mod you have no ownership to said mod. The company that does allow mods does so out of the kindness of their hearts.

Oh ffs. The company is not making money with superior goods and services. They are using other business strategy, dirty tactics. You are too busy worrying about the modder - who doesn't matter - that you are willing to aid companies in an economy where goods mean nothing, service is dominated by finance, profit means nothing unless profit is maximized.

You know what would be great? If social media decided that you could not delete things and then pointed to this situation as precedence.

And, no, you are not going to notice these things happening because you're not supposed to know.

Moving the goals posts and presented a strawman to win. Come back to my position and answer it directly.

Not only did you move the goal posts and used a strawman, but you had to pull out an invalid comparison logical fallacy. You don't own your posts on their platform. You signed that away when you signed up for their service. Thus, no copyrights apply.

 

[mogwaimon]

correct me if I'm wrong, but from Arthmoor's statements earlier in the thread, don't the more popular modders get financially rewarded for having high mod download counts on the Nexus? This is more financial compensation than one would receive from anywhere else save Patreon or, gods forbid, getting into paid mods which as we all know is fucked and sort of the antithesis of having a good modding scene.

I would like to see an elaboration on what dirty tactics Mongoose believes the Nexus has been executing as well?

 

[Mangoose]

Oh jesus christ, I'm not talking about gaming, I'm talking about all of life. About consumerism. About enabling an entity like Nexus to continue profiting off advertisements while you get no royalty. Nexus is a business. And it's playing dirty tactics (legal ones, obviously).

Don't be myopic. On one side, the fucking modders. On the other, the business. And all the other businesses that Nexus pushed aside. Which is why Deadlystream and ModDB will probably be there quite fine for modding whatever happens to Nexus.

This applies to everything, not just gaming. Unless you think AAA publishers are magicians who got successful... Well, they used you.

You don't get to earn royalties when you are using someone else's property without license. You cannot earn money as it's not your property. Lawyers have repeatedly said that when you use someone else's product to make a mod you have no ownership to said mod. The company that does allow mods does so out of the kindness of their hearts.

Oh ffs. The company is not making money with superior goods and services. They are using other business strategy, dirty tactics. You are too busy worrying about the modder - who doesn't matter - that you are willing to aid companies in an economy where goods mean nothing, service is dominated by finance, profit means nothing unless profit is maximized.

You know what would be great? If social media decided that you could not delete things and then pointed to this situation as precedence.

And, no, you are not going to notice these things happening because you're not supposed to know.

Moving the goals posts

]Dude, my goalpost was always STOP DOING THINGS LIKE THIS. I am not even talking about a specific situation, I'm talking generalities.

and presented a strawman to win

Win? Are you retarded? I don't go into discussions wanting to win or lose. As for arguments... You can't win or lose an argument because there is nothing to gain or lose except emotions and wasted time. You solve nothing going into a "discussion" without the willingness to be wrong.

Social media wasn't a strawman, it was a joke. It's called making a side-comment.

But I'll just stop here before yet again people think I'm making an argument about <x> or <y> even when I am waxing on and off about <z>. Almost as if you want there to be an argument so you can "win."

 

[JamesDixon]

Oh jesus christ, I'm not talking about gaming, I'm talking about all of life. About consumerism. About enabling an entity like Nexus to continue profiting off advertisements while you get no royalty. Nexus is a business. And it's playing dirty tactics (legal ones, obviously).

Don't be myopic. On one side, the fucking modders. On the other, the business. And all the other businesses that Nexus pushed aside. Which is why Deadlystream and ModDB will probably be there quite fine for modding whatever happens to Nexus.

This applies to everything, not just gaming. Unless you think AAA publishers are magicians who got successful... Well, they used you.

You don't get to earn royalties when you are using someone else's property without license. You cannot earn money as it's not your property. Lawyers have repeatedly said that when you use someone else's product to make a mod you have no ownership to said mod. The company that does allow mods does so out of the kindness of their hearts.

Oh ffs. The company is not making money with superior goods and services. They are using other business strategy, dirty tactics. You are too busy worrying about the modder - who doesn't matter - that you are willing to aid companies in an economy where goods mean nothing, service is dominated by finance, profit means nothing unless profit is maximized.

You know what would be great? If social media decided that you could not delete things and then pointed to this situation as precedence.

And, no, you are not going to notice these things happening because you're not supposed to know.

Moving the goals posts

]Dude, my goalpost was always STOP DOING THINGS LIKE THIS. I am not even talking about a specific situation, I'm talking generalities.

and presented a strawman to win

Win? Are you retarded? I don't go into discussions wanting to win or lose. As for arguments... You can't win or lose an argument because there is nothing to gain or lose except emotions and wasted time. You solve nothing going into a "discussion" without the willingness to be wrong.

Social media wasn't a strawman, it was a joke. It's called making a side-comment.

But I'll just stop here before yet again people think I'm making an argument about <x> or <y> even when I am waxing on and off about <z>. Almost as if you want there to be an argument so you can "win."

Yet here you are arguing with me and moving your talking posts when countered with facts.

I really like you dude, so just stop.

 

[Mangoose]

I would like to see an elaboration on what dirty tactics Mongoose believes the Nexus has been executing as well?

Who are their competition in their market?

 

[Mangoose]

Oh jesus christ, I'm not talking about gaming, I'm talking about all of life. About consumerism. About enabling an entity like Nexus to continue profiting off advertisements while you get no royalty. Nexus is a business. And it's playing dirty tactics (legal ones, obviously).

Don't be myopic. On one side, the fucking modders. On the other, the business. And all the other businesses that Nexus pushed aside. Which is why Deadlystream and ModDB will probably be there quite fine for modding whatever happens to Nexus.

This applies to everything, not just gaming. Unless you think AAA publishers are magicians who got successful... Well, they used you.

You don't get to earn royalties when you are using someone else's property without license. You cannot earn money as it's not your property. Lawyers have repeatedly said that when you use someone else's product to make a mod you have no ownership to said mod. The company that does allow mods does so out of the kindness of their hearts.

Oh ffs. The company is not making money with superior goods and services. They are using other business strategy, dirty tactics. You are too busy worrying about the modder - who doesn't matter - that you are willing to aid companies in an economy where goods mean nothing, service is dominated by finance, profit means nothing unless profit is maximized.

You know what would be great? If social media decided that you could not delete things and then pointed to this situation as precedence.

And, no, you are not going to notice these things happening because you're not supposed to know.

Moving the goals posts

]Dude, my goalpost was always STOP DOING THINGS LIKE THIS. I am not even talking about a specific situation, I'm talking generalities.

and presented a strawman to win

Win? Are you retarded? I don't go into discussions wanting to win or lose. As for arguments... You can't win or lose an argument because there is nothing to gain or lose except emotions and wasted time. You solve nothing going into a "discussion" without the willingness to be wrong.

Social media wasn't a strawman, it was a joke. It's called making a side-comment.

But I'll just stop here before yet again people think I'm making an argument about <x> or <y> even when I am waxing on and off about <z>. Almost as if you want there to be an argument so you can "win."

Yet here you are arguing with me and moving your talking posts when countered with facts.

I really like you dude, so just stop.

No. I'm not arguing. I'm pissed. This is me when I'm pissed.

 

[JamesDixon]

Oh jesus christ, I'm not talking about gaming, I'm talking about all of life. About consumerism. About enabling an entity like Nexus to continue profiting off advertisements while you get no royalty. Nexus is a business. And it's playing dirty tactics (legal ones, obviously).

Don't be myopic. On one side, the fucking modders. On the other, the business. And all the other businesses that Nexus pushed aside. Which is why Deadlystream and ModDB will probably be there quite fine for modding whatever happens to Nexus.

This applies to everything, not just gaming. Unless you think AAA publishers are magicians who got successful... Well, they used you.

You don't get to earn royalties when you are using someone else's property without license. You cannot earn money as it's not your property. Lawyers have repeatedly said that when you use someone else's product to make a mod you have no ownership to said mod. The company that does allow mods does so out of the kindness of their hearts.

Oh ffs. The company is not making money with superior goods and services. They are using other business strategy, dirty tactics. You are too busy worrying about the modder - who doesn't matter - that you are willing to aid companies in an economy where goods mean nothing, service is dominated by finance, profit means nothing unless profit is maximized.

You know what would be great? If social media decided that you could not delete things and then pointed to this situation as precedence.

And, no, you are not going to notice these things happening because you're not supposed to know.

Moving the goals posts

]Dude, my goalpost was always STOP DOING THINGS LIKE THIS. I am not even talking about a specific situation, I'm talking generalities.

and presented a strawman to win

Win? Are you retarded? I don't go into discussions wanting to win or lose. As for arguments... You can't win or lose an argument because there is nothing to gain or lose except emotions and wasted time. You solve nothing going into a "discussion" without the willingness to be wrong.

Social media wasn't a strawman, it was a joke. It's called making a side-comment.

But I'll just stop here before yet again people think I'm making an argument about <x> or <y> even when I am waxing on and off about <z>. Almost as if you want there to be an argument so you can "win."

Yet here you are arguing with me and moving your talking posts when countered with facts.

I really like you dude, so just stop.

No. I'm not arguing. I'm pissed. This is me when I'm pissed.

Then stop being pissed and letting people control your emotions. Jesus.

 

[Parabalus]

Oh jesus christ, I'm not talking about gaming, I'm talking about all of life. About consumerism. About enabling an entity like Nexus to continue profiting off advertisements while you get no royalty. Nexus is a business. And it's playing dirty tactics (legal ones, obviously).

Don't be myopic. On one side, the fucking modders. On the other, the business. And all the other businesses that Nexus pushed aside. Which is why Deadlystream and ModDB will probably be there quite fine for modding whatever happens to Nexus.

This applies to everything, not just gaming. Unless you think AAA publishers are magicians who got successful... Well, they used you.

You don't get to earn royalties when you are using someone else's property without license. You cannot earn money as it's not your property. Lawyers have repeatedly said that when you use someone else's product to make a mod you have no ownership to said mod. The company that does allow mods does so out of the kindness of their hearts.

Yet Nexus can freely earn their ad money. Hail corporate.

The amount of Big Corp bootlickers here is really off the charts.

They even increased prices less than a month ago, and killed lifetime subscriptions - how more obvious can the cash grab get?

Yes because making money is evil. Do you work for free?

That's fine and all, just don't fall for their propaganda and treat it as a good thing.

1. Yes, stupid because they're a business and businesses make money. Did any of the modders pay to host their mods onto Nexus' property? No. Do the modders own their mods? No. Did any of the modders own any of the servers? No. So as a business Nexus has to cover the costs of being in business. That means memberships, ads, and links. Are you so adamant that companies turn into non-profits and their employees slaves? Because that's what you are saying.

2. Do you work for free?

Exactly, Nexus is a business, everything it does is to bring profit to its owners.

Why praise their profit driven move as somehow good for mod consooomers in the long run?

 

[JamesDixon]

Exactly, Nexus is a business, everything it does is to bring profit to its owners.

Why praise their profit driven move as somehow good for mod consooomers in the long run?

Do you work for free? Why can't you answer a simple question?

 

[Spectacle]

Men, note that August 5th was the cutoff date for automatic, no questions asked mod deletion. The Nexus stated that they will still consider deletion requests on a case-by-case basis. So if you posted some potentially libelous mod 10 years ago I'm 99% sure you could convince the Nexus to delete it, especially since mods like that are almost certainly shit that nobody cares about.

 

[mogwaimon]

I would like to see an elaboration on what dirty tactics Mongoose believes the Nexus has been executing as well?

Who are their competition in their market?

what are you getting at here? that they've cut out all other avenues for mod-makers to post their mods by nefarious means because that certainly isn't the case; the average mod creator would end up making more money by opening a Patreon account rather than relying on the Nexus to provide revenue...which, if you think about it, opening a Patreon for users to 'support the modder creating mods' really isn't that much different of a tenuous legal loophole for monetizing mods from people buying Nexus memberships to 'support the Nexus by helping to pay for server costs'

 

[Orud]

I'm just finding out that lists are a quasi-premium feature that's not available to free users. Yup, getting some good shekel payouts for doing the greater good and you get shills like the self-secure chads in this thread defending you. Its a sweet life running a file hosting site. Hopefully Bethesda notices this and adds more ''features'' that push the dick farther up users' asses.

While I haven't looked into the details; while not great for some, it's still an overall gain? We have a permanent version repository now, the nexus auto bundling options were just the cherry on top of the cake. You're free to point out the downsides to this, since I'm still only seeing upsides.

You make a mod 6 years ago when you're still in public school. You have aged since then. You are more mature and you understand the world more, and now you can see that what you did in the past is a current threat.

Because you and your friend thought it was funny when you did years ago. 6 years later, your friend becomes your worst enemy and bam. Lawsuit. And note that their intention is to hurt you, with the mod just the means.

1) You can change username and e-mail, distancing yourself from your stuff when you were young. I did it because I never deleted my crap. If you're 30 and you still use the e-mail you used when you were 12, that's on you.
2) You cannot be held liable to anything you did while a child.
3) The fact that you need to reach this far and bring up "what if I made something illegal that'll get me sued", is more proof for me that this move was a solid one. Exceptions do not make the rule. If it's truly this heinous, I don't think that the nexus is comfortable hosting it in the first place. If that fails, it's probably nothing that can be resolved by sending them a few e-mails (with or without legal assistance, which is still cheaper than a lawsuit).
4) If you did something dumb during a drunk weekend, you have a month to delete your crap. I can't imagine what kind of crap you'd make that's this problematic, but we're following your rabbit hole here.

 

[JarlFrank]

Nexus' intentions may not be good, but the result - modders can't be mod-deleting drama queens who take away content that existed for months or years and was possibly even used as a base by other modders - is a good thing.

 

[Denim Destroyer]

This "debate" wouldn't be occurring if the possibility of a mod maker deleting their content was an irregular, unpublicized occurrence. But when multiple instances of years old content suddenly disappears because of some nonsensical drama or perceived slight then it only makes sense from the Nexus' staff perspective to jump in and do something about. Sure in the end it is to protect their bottom line and not out of altruism but this is a case were their financial interest coincides with that of the greater public.

 

[Gastrick]

But what if a modder wants to get rid of a mod because he no longer wants his name/username associated with said mod? For example, to prevent a libel situation one just realized could happen.

A modder should act like a man and live up to the mods he has created without deleting them like a pussy.

 

[Young_Hollow]

Plenty of people here claim that the copyright to all mods are with the developer and so modders have no rights at all. Pointing that out as wrong a second time, I'll also repeat that its a legal grey area. Copyright law in terms of the legislations have not caught up to such complex issues and the fact that none of these questions of law are settled in court mean that there isn't any precedent either. Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mod_(video_games)#Legal_status_of_mods

Copyright law, as it relates to video games and mod packs, is an evolving and largely unsettled legal issue. The legal uncertainty revolves around which party is legally the 'copyright owner' of the mods within the pack—the company that produced the game, the end-user that created the compilation, or the creators of the individual mods.

Some lawyer's site : https://odinlaw.com/who-owns-my-game-mod/ Its a 2 minute read, just read it FFS.

At their core, game mods are derivative works. A modification needs to run on the original work in order for the mod itself to work. As a game modder, you own some limited copyrights in what you created but what you created is likely copyright infringement.

Also the question of how original / independent a work is comes up here. When a mod is 99% original (ie total conversions and the like), the principles / jurisprudence of copyright law won't let it be property of the game studio, but how it will see it is unknown, as again, the law hasn't caught up. The fact that many mods are distributed via a CC license, and that its always the modder / modders deciding that shows that in reality, most people know the EULAs are BS.

And at the end of it all, Nexus isn't even in the equation because whether mods belong to the modders or the game-creators / companies, it doesn't belong to them. They're not a licensee of either the modder or the company and until they are, all this shit is a hustle. Plenty of aggregation servies exist, and all of them are free. Ie reddit, steam curators, fucking youtube modlist videos but somehow Nexus is speshul.

 

[Young_Hollow]

I just found the perfect analogy for this. Bethesda is the owner of an aesthetically beautiful park. The park had an entrance fee. It allowed a someone to build a photo / painting exhibition of the plants, flowers and birds that are in the park. This someone is the modder and his exhibition did not have an entrance fee. The modder in some instances even planted new plants and enhanced Bethesda's park for free with his own skill. But the question of the relationship between Bethesda and the modder is not legally settled. One day, a tourguide started charging an entrance fee to the modder's free exhibition because he guided people there. That tourguide is Nexusmods.

And that's where I think we stand with this.

 

[mogwaimon]

And at the end of it all, Nexus isn't even in the equation because whether mods belong to the modders or the game-creators / companies, it doesn't belong to them. They're not a licensee of either the modder or the company and until they are, all this shit is a hustle. Plenty of aggregation servies exist, and all of them are free. Ie reddit, steam curators, fucking youtube modlist videos but somehow Nexus is speshul.

Reddit, Steam curators, and 'youtube modlist videos' are not cloud storage providers. Nexus provides mods free of charge regardless of whether you choose to pay for their services, and modders have the choice whether to use them or use other storage providers. Modders could even do what the Nexus does and get paid per click if they choose certain file hosters, though those file hosters and link obfuscators are usually far more predatory with their practices for the end user when it comes to serving up the content. Modders also have the option of Patreon, and some of them even make a practice of hiding their mods behind a paywall altogether, as is common in the Sims modding community. There are worse modding communities out there than the Nexus when it comes to monetizing modded content, believe me.

I just found the perfect analogy for this. Bethesda is the owner of an aesthetically beautiful park. The park had an entrance fee. It allowed a someone to build a photo / painting exhibition of the plants, flowers and birds that are in the park. This someone is the modder and his exhibition did not have an entrance fee. The modder in some instances even planted new plants and enhanced Bethesda's park for free with his own skill. But the question of the relationship between Bethesda and the modder is not legally settled. One day, a tourguide started charging an entrance fee to the modder's free exhibition because he guided people there. That tourguide is Nexusmods.

And that's where I think we stand with this.

this is far from a 'perfect analogy' and would merit a retadred rating if I were feeling unkind. it's more like the modder needed space to plant his flowers or whatever other bullshit you wanted and asked Nexusmods to provide the land/pots/what the fuck ever and Nexusmods said 'sure, I'll lend you pots/land/etc for financial compensation, but we'll collect it from parkgoers through optional premium services and give you a portion of the proceeds, besides. Oh, and once you plant those flowers you can never uproot them' and the modder agreed to those terms, end of discussion.

 

[Tacgnol]

The simple crux of the matter is, if you don't like Nexus stance, don't use the fucking Nexus.

There are tons of alternatives.

I think the real issue is that the drama queens have realised that those alternatives won't give them 1/1000th of the exposure they used to get on the Nexus.

Also I note that Young_Hollow just keeps focusing on muh legalese and modder "rights", and doesn't address the actual issue of deleting mods being awful for user experience.

 

[Parabalus]

'sure, I'll lend you pots/land/etc for financial compensation, but we'll collect it from parkgoers through optional premium services and give you a portion of the proceeds, besides.

They collect compensation through every click on the site, premium services are just a part of it.

The simple crux of the matter is, if you don't like Nexus stance, don't use the fucking Nexus.

I think the real issue is that the drama queens have realised that those alternatives won't give them 1/1000th of the exposure they used to get on the Nexus.

 

[Tacgnol]

Parabalus that's a retarded analogy and you know it. I'm not even going to waste effort on rating it.

There are viable alternatives to Nexus including ModDB and others. The Nexus has made no effort to destroy that competition nor do they seem to be making any moves in that direction.

 

[Young_Hollow]

And at the end of it all, Nexus isn't even in the equation because whether mods belong to the modders or the game-creators / companies, it doesn't belong to them. They're not a licensee of either the modder or the company and until they are, all this shit is a hustle. Plenty of aggregation servies exist, and all of them are free. Ie reddit, steam curators, fucking youtube modlist videos but somehow Nexus is speshul.

Reddit, Steam curators, and 'youtube modlist videos' are not cloud storage providers. Nexus provides mods free of charge regardless of whether you choose to pay for their services, and modders have the choice whether to use them or use other storage providers. Modders could even do what the Nexus does and get paid per click if they choose certain file hosters, though those file hosters and link obfuscators are usually far more predatory with their practices for the end user when it comes to serving up the content. Modders also have the option of Patreon, and some of them even make a practice of hiding their mods behind a paywall altogether, as is common in the Sims modding community. There are worse modding communities out there than the Nexus when it comes to monetizing modded content, believe me.

I just found the perfect analogy for this. Bethesda is the owner of an aesthetically beautiful park. The park had an entrance fee. It allowed a someone to build a photo / painting exhibition of the plants, flowers and birds that are in the park. This someone is the modder and his exhibition did not have an entrance fee. The modder in some instances even planted new plants and enhanced Bethesda's park for free with his own skill. But the question of the relationship between Bethesda and the modder is not legally settled. One day, a tourguide started charging an entrance fee to the modder's free exhibition because he guided people there. That tourguide is Nexusmods.

And that's where I think we stand with this.

this is far from a 'perfect analogy' and would merit a retadred rating if I were feeling unkind. it's more like the modder needed space to plant his flowers or whatever other bullshit you wanted and asked Nexusmods to provide the land/pots/what the fuck ever and Nexusmods said 'sure, I'll lend you pots/land/etc for financial compensation, but we'll collect it from parkgoers through optional premium services and give you a portion of the proceeds, besides. Oh, and once you plant those flowers you can never uproot them' and the modder agreed to those terms, end of discussion.

So unlicensed doctors are fine because no one is forcing you to go to one? If you don't like them, don't complain and allow them to run their swindling because other options exist for you?

And no, its not Nexus' plot and that's the problem. Its Bethesda's plot, ie Bthesda's games are the platform for the mods. And Nexus wants to cash in on guiding people to something that's not theirs'. Same as if a steam curator wanted money for his services despite not owning steam nor the games he curates.

 

[Fedora Master]

Nexus is a piece of shit site with awful design, but ModDB is even worse.

 

[Tacgnol]

Nexus is a piece of shit site with awful design, but ModDB is even worse.

The one thing I do quite like for ModDB is it groups player made addons for community mods under the addons tab of the mod page.

Nexus probably wouldn't have a feature like that as the drama queen modders would have a fit about other people stealing their thunder.

 

[Parabalus]

There are viable alternatives to Nexus including ModDB and others.

Just as viable as Gab and Dissenter?

ModDB is >#8000, Nexus around #1000, the gulf is huge.