Development Info Obsidian to develop NWN 2

[errorcode]

Why is it a bad thing that Obsidian got both KOTOR 2 and NWN 2? They're a group of remarkably talent folks who pretty much struck the lotto by being handed two very lucrative franchises. I kinda thought folks would be happy to see two high profile RPGs ending up in the hands of a dev house that actually cares about making good RPGs.

 

[Thorndyke]

Wasted potential maybe?

Well, I don't like the idea of Obsidian working on KOTOR 2 and NWN 2 because I didn't like the originals either. "Didn't like" doesn't really capture it, though. I found them to be laughably awful.
Their sequels can't possibly be good enough for me to develop even the slightest bit of interest.

*shrugs*

Fuck Obsidian

 

[Kamaz]

errorcode, you are right, of course...in some way, at least. But you what means this announcement? It means that Obsidian is not going to developed/release any serious cRPG til approximatly 2k5-2k6 having to deal with those two allready. They are not so big to be able to handle too much cRPG's the same time anyway. This means Obsidian is lost for me for at least year. Goodbye, Obsidian.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Why is it a bad thing that Obsidian got both KOTOR 2 and NWN 2? They're a group of remarkably talent folks who pretty much struck the lotto by being handed two very lucrative franchises. I kinda thought folks would be happy to see two high profile RPGs ending up in the hands of a dev house that actually cares about making good RPGs.

Oh that's quite fine, really. It makes sense that a newly founded company would try to establish itself before deciding to venture forth with an IP of their own. This should enable them to earn some reputation as a company who can deliver good games, and it also will enable them to secure themselves financially. I'd wager this is good business sense.

Except that i feel they're unwillingly positioning themselves on the receiving end of a certain negative reputation. People are already labelling them as Bioware Jr., and speaking of how they are more apt at doing Bioware hand-me-downs rather than original titles. I'm sure these comments can be perceived as innocuous in regards to their amount, but its bad publicity that might spread out, regardless.

They're also basically developing games which are not theirs, so they have to exercize some caution when dealing with these intellectual properties. For better or worse, Knights of the Old Republic and Neverwinter Nights are known for having certain characteristics, and Obsidian can't stray too much from them. This means that their possible creativity has to be restrained so the final product isn't too different from its prequels. It has to sell, after all, creativity be damned.

I think this also puts them in a risky position regarding their own IP. When they actually leave the "Sequels R Us" era and present something of their own, will the fanbase care? Now that they're handling two of Bioware's IP, you can be sure the fanbase will grow into something else. More than likely, the fanbase that is forming now favors a more Bioware-styled approach to development, which carry a certain set of characteristics that might have even run contrary to intentions and design decisions of Obsidian's developers. And what does this mean for Obsidian? When they actually attempt to create something new, will they risk departing from the fanbase they've acquired and do something they actually want, or will they keep doing things in a fashion similar to that of Bioware to keep the larger part of the fanbase around?

Then there's also the thing with churning out sequels just for the hell of it, but that's more of a pet peeve against the industry. I can't really fault Obsidian for this. Even if they refused this opportunity, someone else would develop it and eventually flood the market with yet another sequel.

 

[Whipporowill]

A lot of 1 post posters over there, clamouring about the greatness of NWN. Boy, I bet that message board is doomed. It also just crashed under the load... hehe.

 

[Barghest]

Can we invite them here? Post lost souls...

 

[Smiffus]

Though I don't mind a NWN2 being developed, I had pinned my hope on obsidians 2nd game to be BG3. They're too small to develop 3 games (methinks). So perhaps it will indeed go to Troika.

 

[Whipporowill]

Can we invite them here? Post lost souls...

They can't handle the rough codex luvvin. Weaklings.

Or at least most of them.

Who'm I kidding? They don't like us. Hehe.

 

[Volourn]

"run contrary to intentions and design decisions of Obsidian's developers."

If that were ture; i seriosuly doubt Obsidian would have done this. Afterall, Troika has managed to survive without doing sloppy seconds. Closest to it is that they are making a second non sequel sequel Vampire game.

As for the Obsidian boards. Ticks me off. 2 years after release, and people still spend their time crying over it which makes me waste my time laughing at them and 'defending" a game I rated 75%. R00fles!

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

I said they might have run contrary, not that they actually do run contrary to it, Vol.

 

[Araanor]

It's not a bad deal for Obsidian, but I can't see myself looking forward to it anytime soon.

Obsidian boards must be turning to hell by now. It was bad enough with just the BG/IWD fanboys.

 

[Volourn]

"I said they might have run contrary, not that they actually do run contrary to it, Vol."

Semantics.

 

[DemonKing]

I hate to say I told you so...

...but

I TOLD YOU SO!

Actually I thought Obsidian had to be producing *either* NWN2 or BG3...I was rather hoping for BG3, since I thought that style of game was more up Obsidian's alley.

So who will develop BG3? MYSTARY!

Except that i feel they're unwillingly positioning themselves on the receiving end of a certain negative reputation. People are already labelling them as Bioware Jr., and speaking of how they are more apt at doing Bioware hand-me-downs rather than original titles. I'm sure these comments can be perceived as innocuous in regards to their amount, but its bad publicity that might spread out, regardless.

Well, seeing as some people have been calling Feargus Bio's butt-monkey since BIS produced IWD (BG Lite!) it's not actually a new accusation.

Hell - you could even look at PST and point out that that used a BIO engine if you wanted to be picky.

Personally I think it's just good business sense although I do hope that Obsidian's third project will be a little more exciting and innovative.

EDIT: Obsidian's forums have already gone down under the load of Bio fan-boys rushing over! Still better, NWN fans than FO fans, methinks!

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Copout

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

The only bad thing I can see for Obsidian is that one day, they may not get a sequel contract or two and end up having no franchises they call their own. It's kind of the same road BIS went down, having never made an original CRPG.

At some point, Obsidian really needs to focus on creating their own properties.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Well, seeing as some people have been calling Feargus Bio's butt-monkey since BIS produced IWD (BG Lite!) it's not actually a new accusation.

Meh, Feargus probably doesn't mind. He might even like the attention.

Hell - you could even look at PST and point out that that used a BIO engine if you wanted to be picky.

Personally I think it's just good business sense although I do hope that Obsidian's third project will be a little more exciting and innovative.

Well, like i said, its bad rep, even if minimal at this point. Although i'm not an apologist of the "any publicity is good publicity" motto.

Regardless i also expect Obsidian's third project to be their own thing rather than someone else's. I hold no particular interest in Knights of the Old Republic 2, and i certainly don't see myself getting interested in Neverworking Nightmares 2. Obsidian would have to provide many changes to it in order for me to get interested about it.

 

[errorcode]

you make some great points Role-Player. Working under someone elses IP does create certain limitations and working on a specific style of game may lock a developer into catering to a fan-base that is not exactly what they may want.

But doesn't also give them financial leeway later to risk going against those fans? I mean, developing two high profile sequels has got to put Obsidian in a financially viable position to not only do their own IP in 2k5-2k6, but would give them the lender credibility to get the funding to do there own IP right.

I wasn't interested in KOTOR 2 until i found out that Obsidian was making it, now it's something i might pick up. I hated NWNs OC, but now that obsidian is working on the sequel i will give it a chance i wouldn't have before. Obsidian's staff has shown the ability to make solid RPG experiences using second hand technologies (wasn't the Infinity engine a bioware engine that BIS used to make some great RPGs on?).

Honestly, it would have been kinda cool for Obsidian to announce that they were working on BG3, but i honestly wouldn't wish Atari on any developer. From personal experience i can say that they are one of the worst publishers to work with (although Ubisoft has got to come in a close, close second)

 

[DemonKing]

I hold no particular interest in Knights of the Old Republic 2, and i certainly don't see myself getting interested in Neverworking Nightmares 2. Obsidian would have to provide many changes to it in order for me to get interested about it.

I wouldn't be surprised if both prove to be *significantly* better than the originals, although at least in the case of the NWN OC, this shouldn't be too hard to achieve.

 

[DemonKing]

Honestly, it would have been kinda cool for Obsidian to announce that they were working on BG3, but i honestly wouldn't wish Atari on any developer. From personal experience i can say that they are one of the worst publishers to work with (although Ubisoft has got to come in a close, close second)

Tough luck then because NWN2 is also an Atari property so either way Obsidian are shafted.

 

[Spazmo]

I really don't care who's making NWN2--I'm still not going to buy it. I'm just annoyed that Feargus seems determined to be BioWare's lapdog. A Feargus-run company hasn't produced a fully internally developed game since Fallout fucking 2.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

But doesn't also give them financial leeway later to risk going against those fans? I mean, developing two high profile sequels has got to put Obsidian in a financially viable position to not only do their own IP in 2k5-2k6, but would give them the lender credibility to get the funding to do there own IP right.

Hence why i said their decision made sense in the first part of my post.

I wasn't interested in KOTOR 2 until i found out that Obsidian was making it, now it's something i might pick up. I hated NWNs OC, but now that obsidian is working on the sequel i will give it a chance i wouldn't have before.

I'm more interested in Knights 2 than i was with its predecessor, I'll grant that much (even if its not exactly a great interest). But Neverpumping Nutsack 2 doesn't really attract me in the least. As i've mentioned before, it would have to significantly change from the original concept for me to feel interested in it.

Obsidian's staff has shown the ability to make solid RPG experiences using second hand technologies (wasn't the Infinity engine a bioware engine that BIS used to make some great RPGs on?).

True, but the thing here is, in the case of NWN2, i'm assuming that it might need to stick to the same formula of NWN1, which i loathed. I'm not exactly worried with their expertise with choosing an engine and milking it for what its worth, or even in eventually creating their own in-house technology. Background technology isn't my concern when it comes to either KoTOR2 or NWN2, i'm simply looking at either from a game experience point of view, and how they can interest me.

 

[errorcode]

Honestly, it would have been kinda cool for Obsidian to announce that they were working on BG3, but i honestly wouldn't wish Atari on any developer. From personal experience i can say that they are one of the worst publishers to work with (although Ubisoft has got to come in a close, close second)

Tough luck then because NWN2 is also an Atari property so either way Obsidian are shafted.

yeah, but having to work with Atari with Bioware acting as a proxy makes it worlds better than having to deal directly with them. But i guess that's dependent on how they set up there contract.

 

[errorcode]

But doesn't also give them financial leeway later to risk going against those fans? I mean, developing two high profile sequels has got to put Obsidian in a financially viable position to not only do their own IP in 2k5-2k6, but would give them the lender credibility to get the funding to do there own IP right.

Hence why i said their decision made sense in the first part of my post.
.

Sorry, that part of my post was more directed to Kamaz. I didn't mean to give the impression that i ignored that part of your post.

 

[Monte Carlo]

Ha ha ha.

Having been on the Obsidian boards pretty much from the start this is priceless. Those boards were kinda weird, with the majority of us waiting for the announcement of the second project (with a lingering hope that it would be BG3...I genuinely think Feargus' team are the best people to make it) and the result was a bit like Jack Nicholson's ward in One Flew Over The Cuckoo Nest.

Now we know it's NWN2....meh. The original game was shit. Utter shit. So why, for the love of god, could I care less about the sequel? My respect for the likes of Avellone et. al is incidental to the fact that they are working on a franchise I actively despise.

I'm gonna lurk there for a bit and maybe engage in some constructive analysis of NWN with the assorted fanbois before they also port over Bio moderating standards (hear the rhythmic crunch of jackboots on gravel?) and I get banned.

So I suppose I'll be spending more time over here. * sigh *

Another quick thought, Codexers!

Will your slavish lurve of Troika extend to embracing BG3 and all that it entails in the event that Atari award our fave aloof bugmeisters with the franchise? What would St. Timmy do with it? Subvert it? Introduce even more memory leakage and questionalbe rules implementation and stellar NPC characterization? Enquiring minds need to know!

Cheers
MC

 

[Whipporowill]

Hm. I'd rather have Troika do BG3 than NWN2 - that's for sure, but I don't particulary want them doing either one. I'm pretty sure they can do a good story-driven D&D game (at least as good as the BIS/BIO ones) but I'd rather see them stay out of the sequel game as much as possible. On the other hand - they might need the money, and publsihers seems scared of new IP's a t m, so...

... I certainly wouldn't PRAISE the news no.