Company News Obsidian to reveal a new game at GDC 2014

[DragoFireheart]

And let's also remember that Tim is ex-Troika and Obsidian has more than a few other ex-Troika people.

...you just got trolled by Roguey.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

josh Sawyer is retarded. he fucked uo power armor and gave a mundane leather hat 5% crit chance... I don't even...

 

[cherry blossom]

You are wrong. Sawyer is incapable of poor design. It must have been one of the interns or the janitor who did it while he was looking away.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Bet Sawyer was in awe of all the magical clothing and items in Fallout 3. Hey, it's not "simulationist" therefore it's good.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

Chaotic_Heretic

Fucked up power armor? In vanilla it was an improvement over it's predecessor and in jsawyer mod he removed the agility modifier and added DR to it, what exactly did he fuck up?

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

Instead of being POWER Armor, it became a shitty cage which made movement slower.

 

[GarfunkeL]

Fallout New Vegas is mediocre because it uses Fallout 3 as a basis for an Obsidian game, and Fallout 3 is a pile of garbage. 'Oblivion with Guns' was a joke, but that's what it is. I suppose it does highlight desperation of Fallout fans that even here you have people who want to like it.

I think this explains everything about him:

Joined:
Jan 6, 2014

 

[Roguey]

I played Arcanum in RTwP. It was an unendurable mess in TB. Bloodlines is RT. TOEE is the only TB game among them to me. I'm judging it from a "the game providing good and interesting things to play with" perspective. Troika games better utilize their strong suits.

And ToEE was full of mediocre/bad content. When asked about it, Tim Cain said his only problem with the content was the writing.

In comparison, FNV is bogged down by too much trinket hoarding, dungeoneering and back-and-forth'ing.

The carry weight nerf in JSawyer reduces hoarding tendencies, but that's pretty much how open world gameplay works.

You mean a Fallout by Obsidian. I imagine it would be pretty fucking impossible to credit one guy with the entirety of a game's design. And let's also remember that Tim is ex-Troika and Obsidian has more than a few other ex-Troika people.

New Vegas is only as good as it is because of Josh's leadership and systems design.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

Instead of being POWER Armor, it became a shitty cage which made movement slower.

fMoveHeavyArmorPenalty from 0.15 to 0.1 (10% speed penalty instead of 15%)

10% movement speed, what a travesty, I don't know what you mean by cage, but what would you have done to balance the armor types so power armor isn't the only viable choice?

It still is by far the best choice, with the best set of armor you can tank deathclaws, moving slightly slower is not a big deal when you're a walking fortress.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

I was comparing it to Power Armor in FO1/2 btw. And I hate the abomination which bethsda used for a engine. So even 10% walking speed decrease means 10% more of my life is being wasted.

 

[Shannow]

Fallout New Vegas is mediocre because it uses Fallout 3 as a basis for an Obsidian game, and Fallout 3 is a pile of garbage. 'Oblivion with Guns' was a joke, but that's what it is. I suppose it does highlight desperation of Fallout fans that even here you have people who want to like it.

I think this explains everything about him:

Joined:
Jan 6, 2014

Yeah, 2014 seems much better than the last 2~3 years. Though NV, of course, had a few other weeknesses other than engine.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

I was comparing it to Power Armor in FO1/2 btw. And I hate the abomination which bethsda used for a engine. So even 10% walking speed decrease means 10% more of my life is being wasted.

True that it's not as powerful as in 1/2, and I figured that was your basis. But the differences are there for a reason, specific resistances like fire resist are reserved for specialized armor like cook cook's armor, poison resistance to the survival sets, etc etc.

Yes, Fallout 1/2 had stronger power armor, but they also had completely linear armor progression. New Vegas, especially Sawyer's version, has much more equipment variety, I prefer it that way.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

The reasons are balance, viability and Sawyer magifics, there is no ingame lore to support as to why a mundane duster and beret provide crit chance while power armor with hud and what not don't. Its just Sawyer fantasy magifics implemented arbitarilly for viability.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Now, I don't know when you get the power armor in New Vegas (I suspect much too early), but if you'd get it towards the end of the game why would it be a problem if it then was the "only viable choice"?
When is a game really "balanced"? When you're switching armors during a boss fight to counter different attacks?

 

[Curious_Tongue]

Power armour comes late in the game, and from an optional side quest, like Fallout 1.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

FeelTheRads Because Fallout New Vegas does not do linear progression where the next item is just objectively better than the one before it. I don't know why you think end game sets should be less diverse than those in the early game, I don't see any logical reason that they should.

 

[FeelTheRads]

It's not that they SHOULD, it's that for an item like the power armour which is supposed to be the ultimate shit I don't see the problem. In Fallout 1 (and 2) you had to work hard for it and it payed off. No, there was no reason to use any other armor after you got it, but "it all made sense" as Sawyer would say. It's not a fucking loot hoarding game where you you switch equipment every 10 minutes.
And the Fallout 3 approach is magical clothing which is just plain retarded and useless. I'm pretty sure nobody will carry a leather jacked and a doctor's coat with them to get melee and first aid bonuses when needed.

 

[cherry blossom]

New Vegas is only as good as it is because of Josh's leadership and Bethesda's systems design.

Fixed. Were it not for reusing Bethesda's framework, any type of Fallout game by Obsidian would be as mediocre as NWN2, if not worse. Not "even" Josh could prevent that. He had the luxury/handicap of not having to create entire game systems from scratch which allowed him to focus on better things.

 

[Roguey]

Fixed. Were it not for reusing Bethesda's framework, any type of Fallout game by Obsidian would be as mediocre as NWN2, if not worse.

NWN2 reused WotC's and Bioware's framework. Knights of the Old Republic 2 used the same. Both were worse than New Vegas.

Not "even" Josh could prevent that. He had the luxury/handicap of not having to create entire game systems from scratch which allowed him to focus on better things.

No one creates a game system from scratch.

 

[cherry blossom]

Fixed. Were it not for reusing Bethesda's framework, any type of Fallout game by Obsidian would be as mediocre as NWN2, if not worse.

NWN2 reused WotC's and Bioware's framework. Knights of the Old Republic 2 used the same. Both were worse than New Vegas.

Because both had boring mechanics at the core in addition to being generally bland games but at the same time, Obsidian's sequels to both were marginally better games.

And despite the general awfulness of Bethesda games, they do manage to come up with functional and potentially fun mechanics at the core. So, it's only natural that an Obsidian game using Bethesda framework would turn out better, with or without Sawyer's mark, which made it excellent.

No one creates a game system from scratch.

From divine revelation then?

 

[Grunker]

Fixed. Were it not for reusing Bethesda's framework, any type of Fallout game by Obsidian would be as mediocre as NWN2, if not worse.

NWN2 reused WotC's and Bioware's framework. Knights of the Old Republic 2 used the same. Both were worse than New Vegas.

Not by virtues of their systems they weren't

 

[Roguey]

Because both had boring mechanics at the core in addition to being generally bland games but at the same time, both were marginally better games than their predecessors.

And despite the general awfulness of Bethesda games, they do manage to come up with functional and potentially fun mechanics at the core. So, it's only natural that an Obsidian game using Bethesda framework would turn out better, with or without Sawyer's mark, which made it excellent.

Fallout 3 really isn't a prize pig by comparison.

Look at Dead Money, Old World Blues, and Lonesome Road as examples of Obsidian without Sawyer's direction. Definitely the worse for it, far more focus on story and cleverness.

From divine revelation then?

Everything's influenced by what's come before.

 

[cherry blossom]

Influence and inspiration are worlds apart from reusing a preexisting ruleset.

 

[cherry blossom]

Fallout 3 really isn't a prize pig by comparison.

It actually is. Closed systems that reward non-combat gameplay and extensive modding support from the get go PLUS en entire library of preexisting game assets, nevermind how awful FO3 itself is. Doesn't get any better than that while using somebody else's tech base. The last time anyone had a similar kind of luxury was when Baldur's Gate came out and spawned the IE series games.

Look at Dead Money, Old World Blues, and Lonesome Road as examples of Obsidian without Sawyer's direction. Definitely the worse for it

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Zetor]

Dead Money and OWB are both better than Honest Hearts, even with the ridiculous 'mudflation' (which was especially bad in OWB). Lonesome Road... eh.