Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Rake]

The update to highlighting sounds inclined.

Does it? Pixel-hunting in Baldur's Gate I was pretty retarded. If there are way to use your own brain to deduce spots where hidden stuff might be, then fuck yeah, no high lighting sounds awesome. But if it's the BG1 way of "mouse-over all terrain, be happy when you spot a trickle of blue" then boo!

Although... you could implement a Search skill then that high lighted shit if you invested points in it.

The way he described it sounds exactly like BG2/IWDs.
I don't see it as or , it was expected.

BG2 has highlighting for all items.

Not secret doors until you found them.

 

[Rake]

I like their object highlighter solution. Hidden spots like the ones in BG1 should be hidden unless "found". More rewarding than going *object highlight* hur hur I see da hidden treasure

Sawyer has said many times that he is against pixel hunting. So the BG1 spots will be highlighted still. I imagine that the things that won't be highlighted are secret doors,secret chests or wall levels etc.
Staf that are supposed to be hidden and you must find them, but not with pixel hunting.

 

[Grunker]

The update to highlighting sounds inclined.

Does it? Pixel-hunting in Baldur's Gate I was pretty retarded. If there are way to use your own brain to deduce spots where hidden stuff might be, then fuck yeah, no high lighting sounds awesome. But if it's the BG1 way of "mouse-over all terrain, be happy when you spot a trickle of blue" then boo!

Although... you could implement a Search skill then that high lighted shit if you invested points in it.

The way he described it sounds exactly like BG2/IWDs.
I don't see it as or , it was expected.

BG2 has highlighting for all items.

Not secret doors until you found them.

But those were "found" by characters (with high intelligence?) moving close to them. Not by pixel-hunting.

I like their object highlighter solution. Hidden spots like the ones in BG1 should be hidden unless "found". More rewarding than going *object highlight* hur hur I see da hidden treasure

Sawyer has said many times that he is against pixel hunting. So the BG1 spots will be highlighted still. I imagine that the things that won't be highlighted are secret doors,secret chests or wall levels etc.

Staf that are supposed to be hidden and you must find them, but not with pixel hunting.

Oh, well he didn't say that. So, what determines your ability to detect shit like that?

 

[Infinitron]

I read Josh Sawyer's response as being: 'The highlight shortcut remains, but it won't show the hidden chests/doors/traps we'll be putting in'​

Which sounds great. I'm happy with that.​

Correct. Once you've detected a hidden object, the highlighting shortcut will reveal it like other objects.

On a related note, finding hidden objects can happen due to sheer proximity (very close), but will trigger at much greater range if you enter scouting mode, which is our combined stealth/search state.

BTW, another reason why we would like to retain a highlighting key in PE is because with an isometric perspective and occluded geometry, it's very easy for bodies/items to fall "behind" something relative to the camera.

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/63679-highlighting-objects-in-the-world/page-2#entry1357021

Discuss!

FFS Grunker

 

[Grunker]

a retard is me

(I dislike search modes though, can't remember a game where it wasn't a tedious stop-and-pop affair or just something you had on constantly that slowed you down... at least Wiz8 gave you the option of a ranger so you wouldn't have to deal with that shit)

 

[tuluse]

Does it? Pixel-hunting in Baldur's Gate I was pretty retarded. If there are way to use your own brain to deduce spots where hidden stuff might be, then fuck yeah, no high lighting sounds awesome. But if it's the BG1 way of "mouse-over all terrain, be happy when you spot a trickle of blue" then boo!

Although... you could implement a Search skill then that high lighted shit if you invested points in it.

Obvious stuff is highlighted, so you don't have to pixel hunt, while hidden stuff is not. It's the best of both worlds.

 

[Grunker]

See above tuluse

 

[Sensuki]

I like their object highlighter solution. Hidden spots like the ones in BG1 should be hidden unless "found". More rewarding than going *object highlight* hur hur I see da hidden treasure

Sawyer has said many times that he is against pixel hunting. So the BG1 spots will be highlighted still. I imagine that the things that won't be highlighted are secret doors,secret chests or wall levels etc.
Staf that are supposed to be hidden and you must find them, but not with pixel hunting.

The fact that it's not highlighted straight away like Throne of Bhaal is the point I was making. Well tbh it is almost exactly like ToB except that instead of just secret doors having to be easily found it's loot containers as well. And yes I know Josh doesn't like pixel hunting, it was my interview last year where he first said that in regards to P:E

I don't mind pixel hunting but it's not as big of a deal imo

 

[Rake]

I like their object highlighter solution. Hidden spots like the ones in BG1 should be hidden unless "found". More rewarding than going *object highlight* hur hur I see da hidden treasure

Sawyer has said many times that he is against pixel hunting. So the BG1 spots will be highlighted still. I imagine that the things that won't be highlighted are secret doors,secret chests or wall levels etc.
Staf that are supposed to be hidden and you must find them, but not with pixel hunting.

The fact that it's not highlighted straight away like Throne of Bhaal is the point I was making. Well tbh it is almost exactly like ToB except that instead of just secret doors having to be easily found it's loot containers as well. And yes I know Josh doesn't like pixel hunting, it was my interview last year where he first said that in regards to P:E

I don't mind pixel hunting but it's not as big of a deal imo

I don't think that loot containers won't be highlighted. Maybe a few special cases,yes. But containers as a default? I think it will work like ToB

 

[Sensuki]

You've misinterpreted what I said twice. HIDDEN containers will not be highlighted automatically, you have to 'detect' them first.

 

[Rake]

I am an idiot apparently.
Yes, i agree it will propably be that way.

 

[Sensuki]

Yeah

Things that are intentionally hidden (doors, containers, traps, etc.) will be marked as undetected by default. Noticing them will require getting within a certain proximity (based on character attributes) for a second or two. If you rush by everything, you can easily miss the hidden objects or blunder into a trap. We absolutely don't want to emulate the "click button and wait" mechanic of the IE games but we do want to encourage players to be thorough in how they move through/explore spaces. Once an object has been detected, the highlighting key will highlight it just like any other object.

 

[Space Satan]

As long as there a visual indication of possible trap presence(bodies, different floor tile texture, scratches), I can live with that. Trapped chests - BG2 taught us to check EVERY damnrotten box for traps. But when you crawl like turtle through wntire dungeon only to find that there's only two traps in a huge area - that's a fucked up design.

 

[Sensuki]

BG1 & IWD1 trap placement was better.

 

[Infinitron]

http://www.formspring.me/GZiets

 

[Sensuki]

Would be interesting to know what else George will be having input on for PE but I think even he doesn't know yet.

 

[Arkeus]

In case people missed it:

Initially spotting a hidden object highlights it automatically for several seconds. The highlight key is only required to highlight it after that initial duration.

 

[Infinitron]

Sawyer on modal ability channels and other stuff: http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64216-whats-wrong-with-activated-abilities/page-2#entry1357678

 

[Duraframe300]

Let's check out the for....


http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64223-why-i-hate-combat-in-rpgs/

They refuse any further conversation than this. They automatically know where you are so there's no avoiding the encounter with stealth. Invisible walls form a sphere around you so there's no escape until all the bandits are dead. You fight to the death, collect the loot and XP from the bandits, then the game otherwise continues as if that encounter had never happened.

My opinion is that this has absolutely no place in a roleplaying game whatsoever.

Compare this scenario to the one I posited at the beginning. There's no proper context because the bandits just pop in out of nowhere and you never hear from them again. They're attacking you for no reason except that they're bandits and, thus, the Bad Guys. You have no choices in what answer you can give except Fight to the Death, or stand there and die and reload a previous save (and get attacked again next time you go through that area). There are no meaningful consequences because you either win and continue with the game, or you don't. It fails as a Question to pose to the player by every conceivable metric.

Yet this scenario is absurdly common; Probably 99% of your time in your average CRPG is spent wasting your time with this nonsense. Why?

Edit: (Also I know that you could take away *less filler combat* from the whole thing. But, that's not the point he/she is making.)

Edit2: Changed smilie. Fits better.

 

[Infinitron]

Sounds like he's played too much Dragon Age.

 

[buzz]

TL DR: How dare those bandits are attacking me for money. This is nonesense!

Are you on drugs or something? How is that what he said?

He complained about filler combat having no significance to them. You can't spot the bandits before they see you and ambush you, you can't run away (uhm, I don't know what games has he played but anyway), you can't negotiate with them or intimidate them, you can't give them your money and valuables so they can leave you alive and so on.

But yeah, Infinitron is right. I'm not sure what RPGs did he played where that happens all the time.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

Let's check out the for....


http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64223-why-i-hate-combat-in-rpgs/

They refuse any further conversation than this. They automatically know where you are so there's no avoiding the encounter with stealth. Invisible walls form a sphere around you so there's no escape until all the bandits are dead. You fight to the death, collect the loot and XP from the bandits, then the game otherwise continues as if that encounter had never happened.

My opinion is that this has absolutely no place in a roleplaying game whatsoever.

Compare this scenario to the one I posited at the beginning. There's no proper context because the bandits just pop in out of nowhere and you never hear from them again. They're attacking you for no reason except that they're bandits and, thus, the Bad Guys. You have no choices in what answer you can give except Fight to the Death, or stand there and die and reload a previous save (and get attacked again next time you go through that area). There are no meaningful consequences because you either win and continue with the game, or you don't. It fails as a Question to pose to the player by every conceivable metric.

Yet this scenario is absurdly common; Probably 99% of your time in your average CRPG is spent wasting your time with this nonsense. Why?

Edit: (Also I know that you could take away *less filler combat* from the whole thing. But, that's not the point he/she is making.)

(Probable) Enlightenment of a biodrone? he is getting tired of DA shit I suppose.

 

[Duraframe300]

Sounds like he's played too much Dragon Age.

Yes

TL DR: How dare those bandits are attacking me for money. This is nonesense!

Are you on drugs or something? How is that what he said?

He complained about filler combat having no significance to them. You can't spot the bandits before they see you and ambush you, you can't run away (uhm, I don't know what games has he played but anyway), you can't negotiate with them or intimidate them, you can't give them your money and valuables so they can leave you alive and so on.

But yeah, Infinitron is right. I'm not sure what RPGs did he played where that happens all the time.

Eh, looking over it. Yes, I overracted.

Still, for me the description sounded much broader. Sometimes you fall into combat or an ambush and don't have 6 options available to avoid it and imo that's not a bad thing if its coupled with an interesting combat situation.

(I didn't want to say DAII combat situations are a good thing. By far not)

 

[Roguey]

Sounds like he's played too much Dragon Age.

Her description doesn't describe Dragon Age Origins.

I remember her saying she hates all RPG combat (yes, even the IE games), nothing ya can do about that.

 

[Duraframe300]

I remember her saying she hates all RPG combat (yes, even the IE games), nothing ya can do about that.

Yeah, that's basically the impression I got.