Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Ravel myluv]

Still a bit of a harsh judgement for such an innovative game!

Chances are, something you like very much sucks. Why? This is the RPGCodex.

Not to worry, I'm rather used to trolling internet boards!

As long as this forum loves Skyrim, I don't see what can go wrong!

 

[Semper]

In Sawyer's world, you can defeat an Abrams tank with your fists, because a tank can't be 100% invulnerable to fists.

ask dr. jones. he smart assed a tank with bare hands, all with the help of int.

 

[Bilgefar]

Still a bit of a harsh judgement for such an innovative game!

Not only could a phalanx defeat a battleship, but if you knew what you were doing, then winning after the BCs was a game where things went very poorly (yes, on Emperor difficulty). Generally speaking, there wasn't much reason to make buildings (except for barracks), especially because the maintenance costs could tank your economy. Winning the game actually becomes trivial if you just follow the same rote strategy in each game.

Have science at 100% (maintenance costs will be low and you will be getting money from conquering people so you should be able to have this for the whole game)
Beeline to railroad (making sure you get the wheel as soon as possible)
In each city, build 1 phalanx, 1 settler, a barracks, and then just spam chariots the rest of the game
Use each settler to build a road and then finally a city (using only your second settler to build improvements. Cry and then build a second settler early on if you don't start with 2)
Declare war on everyone ASAP with your gigantic chariot army.
Build some diplomats to sabotage city walls, and frigates to ferry your army over oceans.
NEVER get gunpowder, since it gets rid of all your barracks.
Once you get railroad, use new settlers to create your rail network.

That should basically let you win any world map game you don't start in the Americas in the BC era (yes, you will have railroad in like 500 BC). It gets a little more complicated with more ocean between you and your rivals, but you should still win before anyone gets riflemen.

Civ 1 was a very fun and innovative game, but it clearly wasn't flawless. And ignoring its flaws because it was innovative would have left the series to stagnate, instead of get better (which it definitely did with Civ 2).

Edit: Oh and I forgot the most important step: memorize the tech tree so you don't lose all your units to the damn copy protection

 

[Ravel myluv]

I'm not ignoring the flaws, I'm just a bit surprised some would go on to bash this game, especially since these flaws have been corrected in Civ 2.

By the same kind of logic, Fallout 1 and 2 = aim for the eyes = win = boring = shit.

 

[FeelTheRads]

By the same kind of logic, Fallout 1 and 2 = aim for the eyes = win = boring = shit.

It's not like it doesn't come up in every thread ever.

Joined: Tuesday

'Sup, Drog.

 

[Ravel myluv]

By the same kind of logic, Fallout 1 and 2 = aim for the eyes = win = boring = shit.

It's not like it doesn't come up in every thread ever.

Joined: Tuesday

'Sup, Drog.

No I'm a real newcomer, but I did lurk a bit before.

 

[Delterius]

It doesn't take a Drog to be surprised that a thousand page long PoE thread is talking about Civilization 1.

 

[felipepepe]

Considering how little we know about the game, I would be surprised if we could manage even 100 pages without going off-topic...

 

[Ravel myluv]

It doesn't take a Drog to be surprised that a thousand page long PoE thread is talking about Civilization 1.

No I just feel it's weak to attack the game and call it shit when it's just as unbalanced as many great games.

But I'm not that much butthurt about it don't worry... not that much...

 

[Delterius]

Considering how little we know about the game, I would be surprised if we could manage even 100 pages without going off-topic...

On the contrary. If this thread proves anything is that we don't need to know anything about a game (or anything, really) to stay on topic. We may spend 200 pages with over analyzing shit from pseudo GNS theory perspectives, but we are still on topic.

 

[Roguey]

I was thinking Torn, but this sounds more likely since he could just say it was Torn if that was the case.

He was never on TORN and no one had full creative control there since it was rtwp fantasy TURNED ON ITS HEAD.

Couldn't have been Fallout 3, Black Hound (D&D license), Gauntlet: Seven Sorrows (all his stuff was thrown out), Seven Dwarves (Disney) or Aliens so NC gets it by process of elimination.

Seeing people keep trying to excuse this "str have 0 effect on damage, int affects it instead" shit is both depressing and annoying. It really is a cheap way to make int a non-dump stat for fighters and it's shitty because of this first of all.

Hey I saw all those posts you made on SA and you're one of the most obnoxious fucking posters. Fuck you.

 

[DraQ]

Also, most good games tend to be very light on respawns and random encounters, so a total sum of xp you could harvest is limited and known in advance to begin with.

But then you encourage degenerate gameplay.

A bear is a strong animal, every single physical move he makes is charged with raw power, they are not smart moves, they are based on strength, they are also p. fast and accurate.
Even attacks that are not at full strength are generally faster and more powerful the stronger the one that executes them is, it increases your damage across the table, not just your "full power attack". If you want to apropiately represent the amount of base damage a bear would do, hed have to be fucking stephen hawking by sawyers illogical logic.

Bear is equipped with natural weapons and needs appropriate strength to use them.

And I bet a druid polymorphing into bear would be capable of more damaging attacks than your usual bear.

Human, non-natural weapons are generally built for fairly average human.

What does it matter if the object is animate or inanimate, we are talking about a general damage bonus that comes from swinging a stick, not how you happen to swing that very special stick or where the pointy ends up going into.

Because if you try to swing a weapon at someone with as much force as you possibly can, chances are they will kill you dead before you finish your swing.

You need to swing hard, but without much delay or loss of balance.

 

[cherry blossom]

Sawyer is so fucking annoying. So much self-important pretentious talk. Nothing to show for it. Somebody ought to run a tank over him while he is bicycling.

What about all of those canceled games he made. Sawyer's genius is uncanny I tell you. UNFUCKINGCANNY!

Considering what a pile of dung Alien "RPG" was turning out to be, the real genius belong to those who cancelled those games.

 

[Krash]

So you played it?

 

[Rake]

Seeing people keep trying to excuse this "str have 0 effect on damage, int affects it instead" shit is both depressing and annoying. It really is a cheap way to make int a non-dump stat for fighters and it's shitty because of this first of all.

Hey I saw all those posts you made on SA and you're one of the most obnoxious fucking posters. Fuck you.

Jealous much?

 

[Roguey]

Jealous much?

Why would I be?

 

[gromit]

if you liked [...] he's the biggest reason why. (disliked [...] aim their barbs at me)

You are one class act, you know that?

 

[Lhynn]

Bear is equipped with natural weapons and needs appropriate strength to use them.

And I bet a druid polymorphing into bear would be capable of more damaging attacks than your usual bear.

Human, non-natural weapons are generally built for fairly average human.

Perhaps, but i fail to see where intelligence comes into play when hitting a golem or a ghost.

Because if you try to swing a weapon at someone with as much force as you possibly can, chances are they will kill you dead before you finish your swing.
You need to swing hard, but without much delay or loss of balance.

You dont need to swing at full force, but half your force should be a lot more than half of the force (or even full force) that a child can put behind the thrust, even when wielding a dagger. Also it should be faster, harder dodge and generally more accurate. even if the child just had a brain transplant and is now the smartest living thing on the planet. Plus there will be hit points, which makes your whole argument about 1-hit kills irrelevant.

Also, being intelligent does not mean you know stuff, it means you learn stuff faster and have a better overall capacity for abstract thought. For example knowledge of anatomy, dont matter how smart you are, you dont know shit about it until you learn it

I honestly cant comprehend how you can go arguing this when reality simply does not work that way.

 

[~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.¸-AIN'T]

No I just feel it's weak to attack the game and call it shit when it's just as unbalanced as many great games.

Except nobody called it shit, all that was said is that it has a shitty mechanic, which it does. As you note, many other great games also have shit mechanics. We talk about them too.

Also, sup Drog.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

Stephen Hawking will be one of the most feared melee fighters of our generation.

 

[uaciaut]

Seeing people keep trying to excuse this "str have 0 effect on damage, int affects it instead" shit is both depressing and annoying. It really is a cheap way to make int a non-dump stat for fighters and it's shitty because of this first of all.

Hey I saw all those posts you made on SA and you're one of the most obnoxious fucking posters. Fuck you.

I must be doing something right in that case. Then again you probably would find anyone disagreeing with Sawyer as obnoxious. A season's fuck you too btw!

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

You got Roguey butthurt in Sawyer's home turf
Carry On.
uaciaut Screencaps of your "obnoxious" posts and Josh replies plox?

 

[Johannes]

It doesn't take a Drog to be surprised that a thousand page long PoE thread is talking about Civilization 1.

No I just feel it's weak to attack the game and call it shit when it's just as unbalanced as many great games.

But I'm not that much butthurt about it don't worry... not that much...

Again, this is the RPGCodex

Gtfo with your apologist crap

 

[Sensuki]

Sensuki can into attributes

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64712-attribute-theory/#entry1401619

Here's my suggestion.

I think the all attributes attribute to Fortitude, Reflex and Willpower spreads the other effects of combat stats around attributes a bit too thinly. I think Damage, Accuracy and Health/Stamina are equally as important (if not more important) than defenses.

Here I propose a system where Damage, Accuracy, Health/Stamina and Fortitude, Reflex and Willpower are considered semi-equal for this proposed system. The defenses have been placed with higher efficacy secondary combat stats.

Attribute #1 (Might?) - Damage, Healing
Attribute #2 (Perception?) - Accuracy, criticals
Attribute #3 (Constitution?) - Health/Stamina, inventory size
Attribute #4 (Vigor?) - Fortitude, hostile effect reduction
Attribute #6 (Dexterity) - Reflex, Action Speed
Attribute #7 (Resolve) - Willpower, Durations, AoE Size

Might increases damage and healing - healing could mean Stamina Regeneration and adding the same amount of "damage" to Healing Spells, so any class with a flat heal also benefits. Stamina regeneration only occurs from ability/spell use in combat for all classes other than Fighters. Fighters in PE don't really need damage, but if the increase in Stamina Regen is good, then this would be valuable for them.

Perception increases accuracy and does something to augment criticals, this might be increasing the critical damage or making criticals easier to get - but it should not have as huge of an impact as it would in PE's current system as it is the secondary effect of the attribute.

Constitution increases Health and Stamina, which are gained at the same rate. I think it's better to keep Health and Stamina married because it is a more intuitive system. I think the Health & Stamina ratio is a more interesting mechanic, and perhaps the game could include a "Toughness" talent that reduces the Health Damage taken by 5% or something - giving a small taste of Barbarian toughness, but they could also take it to be even tougher.

Vigor is the best name I could come up with for this one, but is essentially the character's resistance to ailments and such. It increases their Fortitude defense, and reduces the duration of hostile effects. This could be a percentile reduction. I think this would make for an awesome attribute with Fortitude and effect reduction, as Fortitude on it's own is boring. If this became an attribute you could bump the durations of all effects a bit to compensate.

Dexterity increases Reflex defense and Action Speed - this includes all actions such as attack speed, cast time, item/consumable use and reloading and has a percentile reduction on the "downtime" between actions. This would have to be kept finely granular as to not be overpowered, but I think it is a better representation of the Dexterity attribute this way.

Resolve is essentially exactly the same as Josh Sawyer proposed, except the effects on Durations and AoE size are not as wide as previous, because it is the secondary combat stat to improving the Willpower defense.

I think that's a pretty good system tbh and even more intuitive than the current one, but if you'd prefer that all attributes add to defenses then that's fair enough. I just think that Damage, Accuracy and Health are equally or more important.

What do you think ?

 

[Abelian]

I would say that constitution would be better suited for healing, but that way the max health and regeneration are tied to the same stat, so I do see your point.