KickStarter Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pre-Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Roqua]

Aarklash Legacy is not a game to compare with, it is more of an action game. Like playing dota with a party.

From what I have seen Kingmaker is going to be closer to Pathfinder than NWN2 was to D&D 3.5. Combat will range from easy to pretty hard just like BG1 and BG2 had.

BG1 and 2 did not have anything close to hard combat. 95% of the fights were click and watch snooze fest, with 5% requiring engagement. So you are saying Aarklash legacy is an unfair comparison because it tried to make RTwP combat engaging and interesting? Aarklash is not an action game at all - having good RTwP mechanics doesn't make a RTwP rpg an action game. Its an example of a RTwP game for people who likes to be engaged in combat, think, and try - not cater to people who prefer to watch combat. How is thinking, effort, and trying actiony? Also, I've never played Dota.

Thank you for the reply - from what I am understanding you are saying is that people can expect a challenge level and effort required similar to the BG games and NWN games? So no challenge at all. With a key goal of making it as effortless for people who don't build their character or party efficiently so everyone can enjoy the story without yucky thinking and trying and gameplay getting in the way of the story. Yet, the same devs talk shit about and purposefully try to hurt the sales of a real rpg with vastly different values and approaches to gameplay?

 

[Morkar Left]

Aarklash Legacy is not a game to compare with, it is more of an action game. Like playing dota with a party.

From what I have seen Kingmaker is going to be closer to Pathfinder than NWN2 was to D&D 3.5. Combat will range from easy to pretty hard just like BG1 and BG2 had.

BG1 and 2 did not have anything close to hard combat. 95% of the fights were click and watch snooze fest, with 5% requiring engagement. So you are saying Aarklash legacy is an unfair comparison because it tried to make RTwP combat engaging and interesting? Aarklash is not an action game at all - having good RTwP mechanics doesn't make a RTwP rpg an action game. Its an example of a RTwP game for people who likes to be engaged in combat, think, and try - not cater to people who prefer to watch combat. How is thinking, effort, and trying actiony? Also, I've never played Dota.

Thank you for the reply - from what I am understanding you are saying is that people can expect a challenge level and effort required similar to the BG games and NWN games? So no challenge at all. With a key goal of making it as effortless for people who don't build their character or party efficiently so everyone can enjoy the story without yucky thinking and trying and gameplay getting in the way of the story. Yet, the same devs talk shit about and purposefully try to hurt the sales of a real rpg with vastly different values and approaches to gameplay?

What is a challenging rpg for you?

 

[Roqua]

I don't think you realise that I lived in a post-communist country. :D Of course we didn't hear about that.

This cartoon was way pre post-communism. I was born mid-70s-ish, and was a kid when this cartoon was new. If you watched it after the fall of the eastern blocs, it was at least a decade cancelled.

 

[Roqua]

What is a challenging rpg for you?

Minimally acceptable? One where it requires effort and I have to try and think for at least 50% of the battles, preferably 95% or all of them? Any game that makes combat fun to watch and does not require me to think, try, or put in any effort at all for 95% of the battles, like the BGs and NWNs, are not fun for me. People claimed you do have to try in BG2 with some tactical patch. I played and made videos showing this was not true for most of the fights. It did make some of the fights require pausing and trying, which made BG2 infinitely more enjoyable to me. But baseline BG2 combat is pure retard-fodder.

I think everyone should be against devs making a challengeless rpg trying to hurt the sales of another super indie dev making a different kind of crpg. That kind of shit should be unacceptable to all of us here.

 

[Morkar Left]

What is a challenging rpg for you?

Minimally acceptable? One where it requires effort and I have to try and think for at least 50% of the battles, preferably 95% or all of them? Any game that makes combat fun to watch and does not require me to think, try, or put in any effort at all for 95% of the battles, like the BGs and NWNs, are not fun for me. People claimed you do have to try in BG2 with some tactical patch. I played and made videos showing this was not true for most of the fights. It did make some of the fights require pausing and trying, which made BG2 infinitely more enjoyable to me. But baseline BG2 combat is pure retard-fodder.

I think everyone should be against devs making a challengeless rpg trying to hurt the sales of another super indie dev making a different kind of crpg. That kind of shit should be unacceptable to all of us here.

Do you have examples of rpgs that are tactically challenging?

 

[Roqua]

Do you have examples of rpgs that are tactically challenging?

RTwP? Aarklash Legacy. I think PoE 1/2 and Tyranny made an attempt to make RTwP engaging where it definitely went faster if you used abilities so players would actually be engaged - which is a huge improvement over click and watch combat of the BGs and NWNs, which only required thought and effort in a handful of encounters and was designed that way on purpose. Members of this community admit to enjoying the combat these games provided based on how good the animations are and like that it is storymode combat designed to be visually appealing specifically so the didn't have to think and try and could enjoy watching it. I like playing games, not watching them.

 

[ArchAngel]

Aarklash Legacy is not a game to compare with, it is more of an action game. Like playing dota with a party.

From what I have seen Kingmaker is going to be closer to Pathfinder than NWN2 was to D&D 3.5. Combat will range from easy to pretty hard just like BG1 and BG2 had.

BG1 and 2 did not have anything close to hard combat. 95% of the fights were click and watch snooze fest, with 5% requiring engagement. So you are saying Aarklash legacy is an unfair comparison because it tried to make RTwP combat engaging and interesting? Aarklash is not an action game at all - having good RTwP mechanics doesn't make a RTwP rpg an action game. Its an example of a RTwP game for people who likes to be engaged in combat, think, and try - not cater to people who prefer to watch combat. How is thinking, effort, and trying actiony? Also, I've never played Dota.

Thank you for the reply - from what I am understanding you are saying is that people can expect a challenge level and effort required similar to the BG games and NWN games? So no challenge at all. With a key goal of making it as effortless for people who don't build their character or party efficiently so everyone can enjoy the story without yucky thinking and trying and gameplay getting in the way of the story. Yet, the same devs talk shit about and purposefully try to hurt the sales of a real rpg with vastly different values and approaches to gameplay?

Getting killed by first wolf, bear or ogre you meet (often one shot), getting sleeped and then magic missiles by first caster you meet is certainly harder combat than shit like that Legacy whose combat consists of getting your party out of circles where enemy big attacks will show up or in other worlds same crap we see in MMOs and Dota like games and other shit action games.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

What is a challenging rpg for you?

Minimally acceptable? One where it requires effort and I have to try and think for at least 50% of the battles, preferably 95% or all of them? Any game that makes combat fun to watch and does not require me to think, try, or put in any effort at all for 95% of the battles, like the BGs and NWNs, are not fun for me. People claimed you do have to try in BG2 with some tactical patch. I played and made videos showing this was not true for most of the fights. It did make some of the fights require pausing and trying, which made BG2 infinitely more enjoyable to me. But baseline BG2 combat is pure retard-fodder.

I think everyone should be against devs making a challengeless rpg trying to hurt the sales of another super indie dev making a different kind of crpg. That kind of shit should be unacceptable to all of us here.

We should ask someone who's played the beta. sstacks any thoughts on difficulty?

 

[Roqua]

MMOs and Dota like games and other shit action games.

I've played TB mmos like Shadowrun Boston lockdown, but I've never heard of a RTwP mmo. Again, I've never played Dota. I only play rpgs, games with heavy rpg elements, or squad tbs games like XCom.

Why does the fact you love shitty, no thinking needed combat made to be watched bother you? You are in the majority. Storymode games are the super popular games. My type of game is never that popular. Having good taste hurts me. Having storymode taste helps you. I don't understand why you get so angry about having clearly shit taste in preferred combat.

 

[deama]

The combat in Dota 2 is pretty fun, donno what you guys have against it.
It'd be neat if they could "evolve" current RTWP combat to be more like dota 2 with pause, and have more slots for abilities.

Though then again, I don't think I mind current RTWP as much as Roqua because I just use speedhacks so I don't have to wait nearly as long as the usual person for the combat actions to be performed.

 

[Roqua]

The combat in Dota 2 is pretty fun, donno what you guys have against it.

Is Dota an rpg game with lots of rpg stuff? Why would I play it or try it? From what I understand it is like Warcraft multiplayer.

It also doesn't sound like you tried Aarklash legacy - the only RTwP game with decent combat. And it also seems that you your "fix" for shitty rtwp game combat is to make it faster, instead of more tactical and enjoyable. Crap combat ending faster is better than it taking longer and being more boring to watch, but would be an actual fix would be to make it not suck to begin with. Make it for people that like games and rpgs, not for people that want their games to be slightly interactive movies.

 

[deama]

The combat in Dota 2 is pretty fun, donno what you guys have against it.

Is Dota an rpg game with lots of rpg stuff? Why would I play it or try it? From what I understand it is like Warcraft multiplayer.

Dota 2 is a remake of Dota from warcraft, and I'd say try Dota 2 since they're basically the same but better quality of life changes. In terms of RPG? Eh, not really, it's just a competetive game that you play with/against other people. You can buy different items and select different perk points per level to adjust the playstyle of the hero you picked. Why play/try it? For the perspective I guess? Maybe it'll give you some newer ideas. At any rate, give it a go for a week, I don't think you'll get much out of it if you play it for a day or two.

It also doesn't sound like you tried Aarklash legacy - the only RTwP game with decent combat. And it also seems that you your "fix" for shitty rtwp game combat is to make it faster, instead of more tactical and enjoyable. Crap combat ending faster is better than it taking longer and being more boring to watch, but would be an actual fix would be to make it not suck to begin with. Make it for people that like games and rpgs, not for people that want their games to be slightly interactive movies.

I played it briefly. The combat seemed fine, but I didn't like the story or characters (or even the setting) so I quit after a couple of hours. Well, my "fix" isn't a fix, it's an adjustment so I can enjoy games like NWN or BG more. Obviously if I knew how to reverse engineer those games well (or had the souce code and some time) I would've redone the combat, but you can't have everything with a cherry on top can you?

 

[Roqua]

Dota 2 is a remake of Dota from warcraft, and I'd say try Dota 2 since they're basically the same but better quality of life changes. In terms of RPG? Eh, not really, it's just a competetive game that you play with/against other people. Why play/try it? For the perspective? Maybe it'll give you some newer ideas, or something. At any rate, give it a go for a week, I don't think you'll get much out of it if you play it for a day or two.

Thanks for the explanation. I have no desire to play dota, fortnight, clicker heroes, pokeman, or anything else outside my usual purview. If they make an rpg with dota combat I'll try it then. But I guarantee its combat is nothing like Aarklash Legacy, which you should try since there is absolutely no reason someone who enjoys rtwp games not playing the only rtwp rpg with actual good combat.

 

[deama]

Dota 2 is a remake of Dota from warcraft, and I'd say try Dota 2 since they're basically the same but better quality of life changes. In terms of RPG? Eh, not really, it's just a competetive game that you play with/against other people. Why play/try it? For the perspective? Maybe it'll give you some newer ideas, or something. At any rate, give it a go for a week, I don't think you'll get much out of it if you play it for a day or two.

Thanks for the explanation. I have no desire to play dota, fortnight, clicker heroes, pokeman, or anything else outside my usual purview. If they make an rpg with dota combat I'll try it then. But I guarantee its combat is nothing like Aarklash Legacy, which you should try since there is absolutely no reason someone who enjoys rtwp games not playing the only rtwp rpg with actual good combat.

Well, I did try it. Now that I think about it, I think I remember why I quit, cause I liked league of legend's or Dota's combat more lol (I was playing those at the time). Also the RPG stuff that was there I didn't like either, the progression system, nor the other parts.

 

[Thonius]

Dota 2 is a remake of Dota from warcraft, and I'd say try Dota 2 since they're basically the same but better quality of life changes. In terms of RPG? Eh, not really, it's just a competetive game that you play with/against other people. Why play/try it? For the perspective? Maybe it'll give you some newer ideas, or something. At any rate, give it a go for a week, I don't think you'll get much out of it if you play it for a day or two.

Thanks for the explanation. I have no desire to play dota, fortnight, clicker heroes, pokeman, or anything else outside my usual purview. If they make an rpg with dota combat I'll try it then. But I guarantee its combat is nothing like Aarklash Legacy, which you should try since there is absolutely no reason someone who enjoys rtwp games not playing the only rtwp rpg with actual good combat.

Are you working for Aarklash Legacy dev team or what? Googled it and it's like singleplayer dota....
PS: Keep dota away from proper RPG's

 

[Roqua]

Was Dota RtwP? Did Dota absolutely require constant pausing to make tactical decisions? If dota isn't rtwp then what you guys are saying is basically the IE games combat was just like Doom. And Doom is like QfG. And QfG was just like Elminage Gothic. And nothing means anything because we are children and we haven important things to say! GENDER IS A LIE!!!

 

[deama]

Was Dota RtwP? Did Dota absolutely require constant pausing to make tactical decisions? If dota isn't rtwp then what you guys are saying is basically the IE games combat was just like Doom.

Yes, dota 2 does have pausing...

Since ur so adamant about it, I guess I'll give it another go since there's nothing much out yet. I'll see if I can go for more.
Though looking at gameplay videos I'm definitely gonna be speedhacking this baby, killing mobs takes too long.

 

[Roqua]

Was Dota RtwP? Did Dota absolutely require constant pausing to make tactical decisions? If dota isn't rtwp then what you guys are saying is basically the IE games combat was just like Doom.

Yes, dota 2 does have pausing...

So, this game requires tactical pausing in MP? Its a core function of the combat. Like I said, I never played it, but I find that hard to believe. If you say its so I will believe you, but I just never thought that would be something a super popular game encouraged.

 

[deama]

Was Dota RtwP? Did Dota absolutely require constant pausing to make tactical decisions? If dota isn't rtwp then what you guys are saying is basically the IE games combat was just like Doom.

Yes, dota 2 does have pausing...

So, this game requires tactical pausing in MP? Its a core function of the combat. Like I said, I never played it, but I find that hard to believe. If you say its so I will believe you, but I just never thought that would be something a super popular game encouraged.

Lol, a player can "pause" the game to go take a piss and sort out something, and each player can only do it thrice in a match. I guess it can still be clasified as tactical? Cause you can pause the game and "pretend" you're taking a piss whilst you think of a strategy; does that count?

 

[Roqua]

Lol, a player can "pause" the game to go take a piss and sort out something, and each player can only do it thrice in a match. I guess it can still be clasified as tactical? Cause you can pause the game and "pretend" you're taking a piss whilst you think of a strategy; does that count?

Why not? If gender doesn't matter why should games have restricted labels or sensible comparisons? Everything is everything, and as long as it isn't offensive to someone that's all that really matters.

 

[deama]

Lol, a player can "pause" the game to go take a piss and sort out something, and each player can only do it thrice in a match. I guess it can still be clasified as tactical? Cause you can pause the game and "pretend" you're taking a piss whilst you think of a strategy; does that count?

Why not? If gender doesn't matter why should games have restricted labels or sensible comparisons? Everything is everything, and as long as it isn't offensive to someone that's all that really matters.

So you gonna play it now? You can abuse the pause feature and give yourself some extra time to come up with some sick 80s/90s strategies/tactics.

 

[Roqua]

So you gonna play it now? You can abuse the pause feature and give yourself some extra time to come up with some sick 80s/90s strategies/tactics.

What is a sick 80s/90s strategies/tactics I could use? The old loopdee loo? The over-under? The Schmedler Brinkley Shoehorn?

 

[Thonius]

Pausing in dota is legit... one way to use pause (at least used to) is to press it midcombat to trow opponents off balance. So I ques dota is RTwP

 

[deama]

So you gonna play it now? You can abuse the pause feature and give yourself some extra time to come up with some sick 80s/90s strategies/tactics.

What is a sick 80s/90s strategies/tactics I could use? The old loopdee loo? The over-under? The Schmedler Brinkley Shoehorn?

The rick roll.

 

[Roqua]

Pasuing in dota is legit... one way to use pause (at least used to) is to press it midcombat to trwo oponent off balance. So I ques dota is RTwP

RTwP, like TB, is all a construct of the patriarchy to suppress women and minorities. FREE JAMES BROWN!!!!