Game News PC Gaming Show at E3 2021: Vampire: The Masquerade - Swansong, Wartales, Mechajammer

[Ravielsk]

Lesbian hairdo aside how the fuck do you manage to write a premise that deflates itself my default? We know she is a vampire and we know that she is a malkavian so what fucking truth can we even discover there?

Seriously how do you even come up shit like this and most of all how the fuck do you even put it into your announcement trailer? What twists and revelations can you even have in a framework like this are not either "nuh duh!" or "well, thats BS!" ? The fact that they revealed she is a malkavian alone destroys any potential the story could have had.

This is as if in Thief the Trickster did not disguise himself as Constantine but instead straight up hired Garret in his demon form. "Gee, I wonder what will happen once I give the goat demon the demonic eye he asked for, surely nothing bad."

 

[Burning Bridges]

I have no problem with games for lesbians but then I also want to be able to play a homophobe asshole.

 

[Jrpgfan]

Putting Wartales between Swansong and Mechajammer (formerly Copper Dreams) is putting a nugget of gold into a sandwich of shit.

How so ? There's very litle info on wartales yet.

There's a Demo on Steam. I'm downloading it as I type this.

If it's really BB with legs I'm sold.

 

[Mortmal]

Putting Wartales between Swansong and Mechajammer (formerly Copper Dreams) is putting a nugget of gold into a sandwich of shit.

How so ? There's very litle info on wartales yet.

There's a Demo on Steam. I'm downloading it as I type this.

If it's really BB with legs I'm sold.

It's promising,probably worth a purchase combat is ok at least, but if you look at the characters skill tree it's very limited.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

 

[Zeriel]

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Eh this argument doesn't really work. The infantilized SJW viewpoint is in direct conflict with the original idea of VTM, and you see this reflected in the newer versions where it just falls apart. They don't want a dark, challenging descent into nightmare--the new VTM is fantasizing and creating the "ideal" version of themselves.

I do agree with the general idea that VTM (and plenty of other settings besides) doesn't work with very-modern setting, though. But that goes across genres. Anything that tries to integrate smart phones and the always-online internet into supernatural horror is amusingly cringe and broken. I remember when the early internet era ended and the show Supernatural tried to keep doing its old formula with modern contrivances, and the whole veneer of suspension of disbelief just crashed into a ravine and exploded its fuel tanks.

 

[Ravielsk]

So the newest VtM gives us an oppressed gender challenged vampire dyke with a kid. Wow. If there were any doubt that this IP has been ruined beyond recognition, let it be removed.

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Because they are not presenting "a darker reflection of our society", they are presenting a infantilized version of our society where internally contradictory concepts are mashed together for the sake making the "right" statement.
Take for example Rudi here:

Spoiler

His entire character is one giant walking contradiction. Him caring about humans or human struggles alone is stupid enough but the fact that it does not make him a outcast is even dumber. His entire stance on things is a blatant violation of the masquerade, not just for Camarilla but for every single vampire and paranormal being in existence as his meddling directly risks exposing the entire dark world to humans(a.k.a risking their genocide). His existence alone cheapens every thing else as if he can get away with being quite literary a suicidal retard who's to say that others cannot get away with the same?

Its a state in which its impossible to take anything seriously or build any kind of real tension because now nothing can really be considered as impactfull or defining, as anything can be just hand weaved away whenever plot convenience calls for it.

 

[gaussgunner]

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Eh this argument doesn't really work. The infantilized SJW viewpoint is in direct conflict with the original idea of VTM, and you see this reflected in the newer versions where it just falls apart. They don't want a dark, challenging descent into nightmare--the new VTM is fantasizing and creating the "ideal" version of themselves.

Also in the early VTM and Bloodlines years the freaks weren't marching down Main Street waving rainbow colored dildoes while 5 year old boys in sequined miniskirts twerk on parade float emblazoned with the pedo flag with the full support of government and big business. They were literally outcasts skulking about in the night like vampires.

If they made Bloodlines today you'd start as Israeli Prime Minister Caine and you just pull everyone's strings and they do whatever you want, the end.

 

[Dr Schultz]

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Eh this argument doesn't really work. The infantilized SJW viewpoint is in direct conflict with the original idea of VTM, and you see this reflected in the newer versions where it just falls apart. They don't want a dark, challenging descent into nightmare--the new VTM is fantasizing and creating the "ideal" version of themselves.

I do agree with the general idea that VTM (and plenty of other settings besides) doesn't work with very-modern setting, though. But that goes across genres. Anything that tries to integrate smart phones and the always-online internet into supernatural horror is amusingly cringe and broken. I remember when the early internet era ended and the show Supernatural tried to keep doing its old formula with modern contrivances, and the whole veneer of suspension of disbelief just crashed into a ravine and exploded its fuel tanks.

I more or less agree that what used to work in a "early nineties" setting doesn't work as well in our contemporary reality, for a lot of reasons.
I disagree, though, regarding the supposed shift in tone of The World of Darkness. It never happened. Not in the rulebooks at least. WW just kept pace with what happened in the real world.

 

[Dr Schultz]

So the newest VtM gives us an oppressed gender challenged vampire dyke with a kid. Wow. If there were any doubt that this IP has been ruined beyond recognition, let it be removed.

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Because they are not presenting "a darker reflection of our society", they are presenting a infantilized version of our society where internally contradictory concepts are mashed together for the sake making the "right" statement.
Take for example Rudi here:

Spoiler

His entire character is one giant walking contradiction. Him caring about humans or human struggles alone is stupid enough but the fact that it does not make him a outcast is even dumber. His entire stance on things is a blatant violation of the masquerade, not just for Camarilla but for every single vampire and paranormal being in existence as his meddling directly risks exposing the entire dark world to humans(a.k.a risking their genocide). His existence alone cheapens every thing else as if he can get away with being quite literary a suicidal retard who's to say that others cannot get away with the same?

Its a state in which its impossible to take anything seriously or build any kind of real tension because now nothing can really be considered as impactfull or defining, as anything can be just hand weaved away whenever plot convenience calls for it.

And since when Anarcs were something different than a walking contradiction? They were the vampires that make less sense in the fist Vampire The Masquerade and they still are in the last edition. And thanks God they are. They are a needed counterpart to other more pragmatic sects.

As for the concern about humanity this is part of the setting since forever. There are vampires who consider humans mere cattles and there are vampire who can't give up humanity. And players are usually tasked to take a stand on this point.

 

[Zeriel]

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Eh this argument doesn't really work. The infantilized SJW viewpoint is in direct conflict with the original idea of VTM, and you see this reflected in the newer versions where it just falls apart. They don't want a dark, challenging descent into nightmare--the new VTM is fantasizing and creating the "ideal" version of themselves.

I do agree with the general idea that VTM (and plenty of other settings besides) doesn't work with very-modern setting, though. But that goes across genres. Anything that tries to integrate smart phones and the always-online internet into supernatural horror is amusingly cringe and broken. I remember when the early internet era ended and the show Supernatural tried to keep doing its old formula with modern contrivances, and the whole veneer of suspension of disbelief just crashed into a ravine and exploded its fuel tanks.

I more or less agree that what used to work in a "early nineties" setting doesn't work as well in our contemporary reality, for a lot of reasons.
I disagree, though, regarding the supposed shift in tone of The World of Darkness. It never happened. Not in the rulebooks at least. WW just keep pace with what happened in the real world.

Changing culture results in a total dissonance between versions though because as a work of fiction it's a projection of the mindset--with the mindset being totally changed, the "goal" of the fiction is also totally different.

Another example of this is how modern D&D now has that thing where wheelchair ramps in-setting are a thing in dungeons. To say the people who wrote 2E and the people writing whatever the fuck that shit is have a totally different understanding of the point of fiction and fantasy is to grossly understate things.

In the 90s, the idea was to escape into a totally realized fictional world. Now the idea is to make the fictional world conform to the standards and ideology of the real world.

 

[Dr Schultz]

Honestly, as a long-time Vampire storyteller, I find puzzling that people complain about woke and SJW stuff in the World of Darkness, a setting that was presented from the get go as "a darker reflection of our society".

The first edition of Vampire came out 30 years ago. "Our society" in the meanwhile has changed, hence "its darker reflection" has changed accordingly...

Eh this argument doesn't really work. The infantilized SJW viewpoint is in direct conflict with the original idea of VTM, and you see this reflected in the newer versions where it just falls apart. They don't want a dark, challenging descent into nightmare--the new VTM is fantasizing and creating the "ideal" version of themselves.

I do agree with the general idea that VTM (and plenty of other settings besides) doesn't work with very-modern setting, though. But that goes across genres. Anything that tries to integrate smart phones and the always-online internet into supernatural horror is amusingly cringe and broken. I remember when the early internet era ended and the show Supernatural tried to keep doing its old formula with modern contrivances, and the whole veneer of suspension of disbelief just crashed into a ravine and exploded its fuel tanks.

I more or less agree that what used to work in a "early nineties" setting doesn't work as well in our contemporary reality, for a lot of reasons.
I disagree, though, regarding the supposed shift in tone of The World of Darkness. It never happened. Not in the rulebooks at least. WW just keep pace with what happened in the real world.

Changing culture results in a total dissonance between versions though because as a work of fiction it's a projection of the mindset--with the mindset being totally changed, the "goal" of the fiction is also totally different.

Another example of this is how modern D&D now has that thing where wheelchair ramps in-setting are a thing in dungeons. To say the people who wrote 2E and the people writing whatever the fuck that shit is have a totally different understanding of the point of fiction and fantasy is to grossly understate things.

In the 90s, the idea was to escape into a totally realized fictional world. Now the idea is to make the fictional world conform to the standards and ideology of the real world.

Honestly, I don't think this is reflected in the sourcebooks. The themes and the tone of v5 are exactly the same of the original VtM. The game is still about the internal struggle between humanity and the Beast and the external struggle between various vampire factions, all spiced up with an aura of vampire mysticism. The references to various contemporary ideologies are just a (needed) update to the setting.

One can reasonably argue that the early nineties setting of the original sourcebook is way cooler than its last iteration and I'd wholeheartedly agree, but the point of Vampire has always been living the life of a vampire TODAY (ok, technically they tried different times since Vampire: Dark Ages, but the main dish remained the contemporary setting throughout all Vampire publication history).
So I don't see any betrayal of the original spirit of VTM when I see references to the woke "culture" or to the LGBT+ world.

 

[oneself]

This is like what, the third redesign of Copper Dreams?

 

[gaussgunner]

This is like what, the third redesign of Copper Dreams?

Yeah, if you only count drastic gameplay changes. Tenth maybe if you count art styles.

 

[Fenix]

Another example of this is how modern D&D now has that thing where wheelchair ramps in-setting are a thing in dungeons.

AHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHHAHAHHAHAHAHHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHSHAHHAHAAHHHAHSAHJAHAHHAHAHAHAJJHAHJAJHAHAJJHJHAJAHHAHAAHJHAJHJHAJ

 

[Fenix]

It's worse then I though it is lmao.
https://dlair.net/austin/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Combat-Wheelchair-V2-OpenDyslexic-PDF.pdf

 

[0wca]

Tags: Big Bad Wolf; Mechajammer; Modern Wolf; Nacon; Shiro Games; Vampire: the Masquerade - Swansong; Wartales; Whalenought Studios

Despite the inane skits and relentless MechWarrior 5 product promotion, yesterday's PC Gaming Show wasn't completely worthless. For starters, there was a new trailer for Big Bad Wolf's upcoming narrative RPG Vampire: The Masquarade - Swansong. The trailer introduces the Malkavian Leysha, one of the game's three protagonists, who is apparently on a mission to find her lost daughter. There's no release date for Swansong yet, but we'll be seeing more of it at the Nacon Connect event on July 6th.

Wow, VtM is going to suck so much ass. When Brian Mitsoda got canned and they scrapped the whole narrative and started over, I knew this thing was in development hell. Now it's gone from development hell straight into Satan's asshole.

 

[gaussgunner]

It's worse then I though it is lmao.
https://dlair.net/austin/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Combat-Wheelchair-V2-OpenDyslexic-PDF.pdf

WTF. Just put the gimp's brain in a jar in a battle mech and call it a fucking day.

 

[0wca]

Just noticed this is a different VtM game. Either way, fuck hope.

 

[Fenix]

It's worse then I though it is lmao.
https://dlair.net/austin/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Combat-Wheelchair-V2-OpenDyslexic-PDF.pdf

WTF. Just put the gimp's brain in a jar in a battle mech and call it a fucking day.

Eh, no! We will build a wheelchair ramps! It's actually Mitra who did that! She is kind!

 

[RNGsus]

Which one is more appealing?

I'm pretty gay for that dude down the street.