Eternity Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire Pre-Release Thread [BETA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[HoboForEternity]

Go easy on the new kid.

what happened in baptism in fire and shit?

 

[Xeon]

Wonder if they do like DA's keep or ME's story like for the choices.

Even tho I really wish will be a complete with all choices, I kinda also wondering if it will be good to leave some of the minor choices only available via direct import from PoE1.

 

[santino27]

<3 xoxo

Thanks,
Randal

WTF is going on????????????

The greatest troll job of 2017. Or so I'm hoping.

 

[axedice]

Now of course if we were to ever make a POE2

Would you copy the good bits of Tyranny like the wiki-links in dialogue or the spellcrafting system? First one is more likely but I doubt the second could work with the established system.

 

[Lacrymas]

It could mean an additional six to eight new companions on top of those eight returning just so a full party can be managed.

They'll just go the easy route and say "you have adventurers to recruit", that's so obvious it hurts. Or not every one of them will return (probably Durance and GM won't, for obvious reasons) and most of the cast is going to be new, so that won't be a problem at all.

 

[Sizzle]

Pillars of Eternity's quest & narrative design couldn't tell the difference between interesting and the back side of a barn.

They did design some neat quests, but most of them (not counting places like Ondra's Gift, which stands out from the rest of the dullness that is Defiance Bay) are in the endgame (Twin Elm's quests are a lot better than those in DB) and especially in the expansion pack.

* Concocts a fascinating formula in the form of Hollowborn ... then completely squanders it by never exploring it in-depth. The most we get is a fetch quest from Aufra, a few decorative Hollowborn NPCs in prison, and Grieving Mother having memories about delivering Hollowborn children a while later. The emotional, psychological, and potentially grimdark situational potential of the concept is lost almost entirely.

You forgot about Raedaric, and the bitter squash seed quest in DB (the one where you meet Pallegina). But yeah, the Hollowborn are front and center in the story only in Act I (and even then, mostly in Gilded Vale).

* Tries to insert RACSSCISM ISSUEZ in the form of discrimination against Orlan, Godlike, etc. But then the player character can do everything as any race anyways. All you get are a few flavor text here and there, no racial quests and very few racial choices & consequences.

To be fair, even one of the most popular games here at the Codex - Arcanum - also had that problem. But at least Arcanum's flavor text was fun and interesting to read, which made all the difference.

* Sets up a situation where the player character can see his/her past lives, but makes almost every one of these past lives boring as fuck. Obsidian had full freedom to assign whatever crazy and twisted back story lives they wanted to the player character as well as his/her companions, but probably because it suddenly reminded them of how they were copying Planescape: Torment, they ended up only using it as a plot device.

The Watcher's previous life backstory is the weakest part of the entire story, and one of the worst narrative hooks I've ever seen in a game like this.

Given how much they wasted the potential of the game world & ideas they came up with in 1, I can't possibly have high hopes for them in 2, regardless of how cool the game sounds on paper. Pillars of Eternity sounded awesome on paper, but it didn't follow through.

PoE is filled with wasted opportunities like this. It's like all the writers and designers made a fantasy world that had the potential to be a somewhat realistic and harsh place. And then someone in charge came in and said: "But, you know, don't make it too dark. Remember - this is a Baldur's Gate inspired game. Put in some kobolds. But don't call them kobolds. Yesiree, everyone loves kobolds."

 

[Quillon]

Wish there'd be only 5 deep-er companions who are more connected to the story-interjecting frequently-written with better care instead of 8+ shallow-er ones.

They'll just go the easy route and say "you have adventurers to recruit", that's so obvious it hurts.

What is the hard route? Making 16 companions with much less the number of writers so you can complain how bad the companions are afterwards? Tho I have a feeling no matter how good they will be you won't like them anyway. And yeah let's judge Obs like they have virtually unlimited resources to make a game.

 

[Lacrymas]

What is the hard route? Making 16 companions with much less the number of writers so you can complain how bad the companions are afterwards? Tho I have a feeling no matter how good they will be you won't like them anyway. And yeah let's judge Obs like they have virtually unlimited resources to make a game.

Unlike some people, I always give credit where credit is due (I even praised Beamdog for the C&C in Dorn's quest in BG2), so if they are well written I will like them. You also fail to realize that they already have a working (barely) combat system and an engine they are familiar with, the only thing they need to do is paint pictures and write (hyperbole, but you get the idea). So, yes, going the hard route would be preferable.

 

[Quillon]

You also fail to realize that they already have a working (barely) combat system and an engine they are familiar with, the only thing they need to do is paint pictures and write (hyperbole, but you get the idea).

That's why we're expecting something better but familiar engine and working combat system hardly inspires creativity or faster writing.

 

[Reinhardt]

How many romances there will be?

 

[Jarpie]

Given how much they wasted the potential of the game world & ideas they came up with in 1, I can't possibly have high hopes for them in 2, regardless of how cool the game sounds on paper. Pillars of Eternity sounded awesome on paper, but it didn't follow through.

PoE is filled with wasted opportunities like this. It's like all the writers and designers made a fantasy world that had the potential to be a somewhat realistic and harsh place. And then someone in charge came in and said: "But, you know, don't make it too dark. Remember - this is a Baldur's Gate inspired game. Put in some kobolds. But don't call them kobolds. Yesiree, everyone loves kobolds."

If you mean by "realistic" and "harsh" as somekind of Game of Thrones crap, no fucking thanks. I fucking loathe the tryhard "oh we're so edgay and grimdork and completely serious! hurr durr!". I might be in the minority but I actually like the setting as such, places names actually sounds like they could be 'real', instead of "I came up with this when I was 14 year old!" as in Derp Age with Thedas (THE Dragon Age Setting) and Ferelden (what the fuck name is that?!) and Orlais. Changing the names of some monsters is a bit silly though, like xaurips = kobolds and fampyrs = vampyrs/vampires.

 

[Sizzle]

If you mean by "realistic" and "harsh" as somekind of Game of Thrones crap, no fucking thanks.

Fuck no. I hate how "serious fantasy" nowadays translates into "like GoT".

I fucking loathe the tryhard "oh we're so edgay and grimdork and completely serious! hurr durr!".

Edginess for the sake of edginess almost always turns out shit. But that isn't what I was talking about with Azarkon.

If you have a setting which tries to be more mature than the typical Forgotten Realms module, with something like the Hollowborn crisis - an event which will definitely change the way the entire region works: the importance of healthy children, inheritance laws, safe sex, etc. - all of those will be different, and that will reflect in how society functions. PoE sets up those things, but doesn't really explore their ramifications. It's a weird sort of half-solution - which doesn't please either the folks expecting a silly little DnD inspired romp, nor the fans who wanted to see what Obsidian could do if they didn't have the creative constraints of a publisher or license looming over them.

I might be in the minority but I actually like the setting as such, places names actually sounds like they could be 'real'

Sawyer did a good job with those, I agree.

Though I would have preferred he put more thought into things like narrative cohesion than he did in constructing the Engwithian alphabet.

instead of "I came up with this when I was 14 year old!" as in Derp Age with Thedas (THE Dragon Age Setting) and Ferelden (what the fuck name is that?!) and Orlais. Changing the names of some monsters is a bit silly though, like xaurips = kobolds and fampyrs = vampyrs/vampires.

DA does have some interesting lore, but it barely comes across in the games themselves.

 

[hajro]

Serious fantasy should translate to something like black company or berserk

 

[Projas]

Look at this guy. He's a serious guy in a serious fantasy. He has a serious sword.

 

[Sizzle]

Berserk used to be serious, dark fantasy for about a couple of arcs (the ones covered in the anime adaptation), but it's long since devolved into comic relief fairies and pointy hat loli witches.

 

[hajro]

loli witches are serious business

 

[Xeon]

Yeah, only good part in Berserk is during the Golden Age arc. I still read in bulks every now and then just to try and catch up but its not as good as it was.

 

[Mazisky]

Imho The Witcher has the perfect setting: perfect balance of high fantasy\grim\horror with some funny moments to contrast.

 

[hajro]

Not enough horror

 

[Perkel]

I hope Mother won't be in PoE2. It would be stupid to have her there.
Though she could be NPC with small role depending on her ending.

 

[Xeon]

Josh answered a question regarding companions in the Fallout New Vegas stream:

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

I am wary of any project where Josh is the design lead. He is good at cleaning other people's shit but not good at building them. When PoE had no xp for combat his justification was "You need to fight not because of xp but because you like the combat." Looks like this retarded view is going to carry over into PoE 2 too.

I say Josh, if you like our job, you should do it for the sake of enjoying it and not for the paychecks your company scams from Kickstarter.

Yeah i like xp for murdering. That is the fundamental pillar of an RPG.

Also PoE failed to be interesting from storyfag and quest design point of view. Like it was said earlier in this thread...so much missed opportunities. What exactly will be better in PoE 2?

 

[Perkel]

No xp for combat is great thing. Cry moar.

Whole point of it is to avoid players killing everything. If there is no reward for kill then avoiding combat is just as good option as killing enemy.

Imo what is wrong though is that every fight from get go is winnable. I struggle to remember in story where i was to low level to tacke fight on. Though i might remember it wrong.

Still in need to play expansions and Tranny. I played 1,5 times on release.

BTW since 1.0 there is 3.0 now. Did system change much ? Still war of attrition ?

 

[Reinhardt]

I struggle to remember in story where i was to low level to tacke fight on.

You killed 3 bears on first try?

 

[Sentinel]

I am wary of any project where Josh is the design lead. He is good at cleaning other people's shit but not good at building them. When PoE had no xp for combat his justification was "You need to fight not because of xp but because you like the combat." Looks like this retarded view is going to carry over into PoE 2 too.

I say Josh, if you like our job, you should do it for the sake of enjoying it and not for the paychecks your company scams from Kickstarter.

Yeah i like xp for murdering. That is the fundamental pillar of an RPG.

Also PoE failed to be interesting from storyfag and quest design point of view. Like it was said earlier in this thread...so much missed opportunities. What exactly will be better in PoE 2?

You do get EXP filling the bestiary (which requires combat).
Where he fucked up was when he said "I don't want to give people the incentive to grind out combat to get EXP. If people wanna talk their way out of a situation, they can do it without missing EXP." but then he showers players with trash mobs everywhere and it's rare the quest where combat isn't mandatory (don't even know if there's a single one).