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[Poll] Codex favorite mech from Battletech

What is your favorite mech from Battletech? (pick up to 3)

  • Phoenix Hawk (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Griffin (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Dasher (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Wolfhound (Inner Sphere, with one exception)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Highlander (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Clint (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Penetrator (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Kraken/ Bane (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Turkina (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Ryoken/ Stormcrow (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Viper/ Dragonfly (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Dragon (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Stalker (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Cauldron Born/ Ebon Jaguar (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Cyclops (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Man O' War/ Gargoyle (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Orion (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Night Gyr (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Shadowcat (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Kingfisher (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Nightstar (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Banshee (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Peregrine/ Horned Owl (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Longbow (Inner Sphere)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Goshawk/ Vapor Eagle (Clan)

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    70

Cael

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I'm gonna guess... King Crab?

It's funny, I was about to put King Crab in the original roll poll, but I thought there wouldn't be any other King Crab fans. Always a fan of mechs named after delicious food.

I also remembered Hatamoto-Chi, that picture is from the card and it was in my (one and only) Battletech TCG starter deck. But honestly it looks like a transformer.
Dude, replace the twin AC20s of a King Crab with twin Gauss Rifles and the Large Laser with an ER Large Laser a King Crab is one terrifying command 'mech (characterised by long range weapons and being very tough so that the unit commander is relatively out of the fight and is well protected; the Archer is a stereotypical one). Just the standard 10 double heat sinks in the engine is all you need to keep that 'mech cool (2 gauss rifles + 1 ER Large + 1 LRM15 = 18 heat; 20 on a run). All are Star League era techs, too, which is where the King Crab is from.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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I'm gonna guess... King Crab?
This is the Codex. What could possibly K(ing) C(omrade) 1 - K(Co)D(e)X be?

Hence the popularity of Urbies.
No that's because Urbie is the kawaii desu uguu~ 'mech. Seriously, it's pretty damn cute. It's also the little underdog, so everyone sides with it because FASA had no right to be so mean to poor Urbie.

 

Quigs

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Can't believe there are so many Kurita Codex fans. I thought most players affiliated with Steiner, Davion or Liao. Hence the popularity of Urbies.

You're surprised the Dex favors the house of racial purity?

Lorewise, Dracs all the way, in play though I favor the Lyrans. Hauptman B, Fafnir, etc. Big mech. Big guns.
 

Jason Liang

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No that's because Urbie is the kawaii desu uguu~ 'mech. Seriously, it's pretty damn cute. It's also the little underdog, so everyone sides with it because FASA had no right to be so mean to poor Urbie.
Yeah but Liao is also the underdog House...
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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No that's because Urbie is the kawaii desu uguu~ 'mech. Seriously, it's pretty damn cute. It's also the little underdog, so everyone sides with it because FASA had no right to be so mean to poor Urbie.
Yeah but Liao is also the underdog House...
Yea but they're also a bunch of assholes. Then again that's arguably sort of a Not-Davion/Not-Wolf/Not-Bear-Rasalhague shorthand in the setting.
 

PorkBarrellGuy

Guest
No that's because Urbie is the kawaii desu uguu~ 'mech. Seriously, it's pretty damn cute. It's also the little underdog, so everyone sides with it because FASA had no right to be so mean to poor Urbie.
Yeah but Liao is also the underdog House...
Yea but they're also a bunch of assholes. Then again that's arguably sort of a Not-Davion/Not-Wolf/Not-Bear-Rasalhague shorthand in the setting.
Marik are low on the asshole-o-meter. They've fucked over a few mercs I think, but beyond that Marik is too busy fucking itself in the ass to fuck anyone else most of the time.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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No that's because Urbie is the kawaii desu uguu~ 'mech. Seriously, it's pretty damn cute. It's also the little underdog, so everyone sides with it because FASA had no right to be so mean to poor Urbie.
Yeah but Liao is also the underdog House...
Yea but they're also a bunch of assholes. Then again that's arguably sort of a Not-Davion/Not-Wolf/Not-Bear-Rasalhague shorthand in the setting.
Marik are low on the asshole-o-meter. They've fucked over a few mercs I think, but beyond that Marik is too busy fucking itself in the ass to fuck anyone else most of the time.
Hence arguably. Generally speaking I'd probably say it's more accurately an asshole gradient for non-Davions/non-Wolf.
 

PorkBarrellGuy

Guest
Hence arguably. Generally speaking I'd probably say it's more accurately an asshole gradient for non-Davions/non-Wolf.

To be fair, also, House Davion has had asshole moments. Clan Mary Sue (Wolf, I mean) is mostly non-asshole but then Phelan fucks off and Vlad Ward takes over the Wolves, and Ward's sort of a dick. It's funny how the dickish factions tend to be more interesting than the goody-two-shoes Mary Sue-ish ones. (House Kurita and Jade Falcon come to mind).

Of course, everyone knows the biggest assholes are ComStar. Wobbies too, but Wobbies are fucking boring except for their neat toys.
 

Quigs

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Of course, everyone knows the biggest assholes are ComStar. Wobbies too, but Wobbies are fucking boring except for their neat toys.

ComStar was amazing before the veil was broken. The whole praying to technology (before 40k beat that to death) and bastion of technology was amazing 80s fiction.
 

PorkBarrellGuy

Guest
Of course, everyone knows the biggest assholes are ComStar. Wobbies too, but Wobbies are fucking boring except for their neat toys.

ComStar was amazing before the veil was broken. The whole praying to technology (before 40k beat that to death) and bastion of technology was amazing 80s fiction.

Absolutely. One of the most interesting factions. Also huge assholes. (And somehow they manage to make the Wobbies boring as fuck despite being a ComStar splinter)
 

Zed Duke of Banville

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omg i love gundam threads
Name: Ninjerk, Avatar:
17002.jpg
:M

Gomenasai, my name is Ken-Sama.

I’m a 27 year old American Otaku (Anime fan for you gaijins). I draw Anime and Manga on my tablet, and spend my days perfecting my art and playing superior Japanese games. (Disgaea, Final Fantasy, Persona series)

I train with my Katana every day, this superior weapon can cut clean through steel because it is folded over a thousand times, and is vastly superior to any other weapon on earth. I earned my sword license two years ago, and I have been getting better every day.

I speak Japanese fluently, both Kanji and the Osaka dialect, and I write fluently as well. I know everything about Japanese history and their bushido code, which I follow 100%

When I get my Japanese visa, I am moving to Tokyo to attend a prestigious High School to learn more about their magnificent culture. I hope I can become an animator for Studio Ghibli or a game designer!

I own several kimonos, which I wear around town. I want to get used to wearing them before I move to Japan, so I can fit in easier. I bow to my elders and seniors and speak Japanese as often as I can, but rarely does anyone manage to respond.

Wish me luck in Japan!

iG1bcJj.jpg
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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Hence arguably. Generally speaking I'd probably say it's more accurately an asshole gradient for non-Davions/non-Wolf.

To be fair, also, House Davion has had asshole moments. Clan Mary Sue (Wolf, I mean) is mostly non-asshole but then Phelan fucks off and Vlad Ward takes over the Wolves, and Ward's sort of a dick. It's funny how the dickish factions tend to be more interesting than the goody-two-shoes Mary Sue-ish ones. (House Kurita and Jade Falcon come to mind).

Of course, everyone knows the biggest assholes are ComStar. Wobbies too, but Wobbies are fucking boring except for their neat toys.
ComStar does moonlight as good guys a little bit too when Big Boss is around. Even if arguably if you wanted to do a Big Huge Epic game/story/whatever about the most famous BattleTech metaplot thing, the Clan Invasion and so on, you sort of HAVE to use ComStar as the secret twist bad guy.

But yea, generally speaking as an overall set-up it's kinda boring in BattleTech's universe when Federated Suns in 3025 is just the most powerful of the successor states and the goodiest goody one, in that sense I've liked Rasalhague better since they're small (though I suppose the advantage here is that Inner Sphere is a really REALLY big place, so you can pretty much bend the stereotype however you want; and it's fiction so you can just do it anyway if you think it'll make things more interesting). Same thing with Wolf, how they're always so bestest of bestest and the goodiest Clan of goodiest Clans. I'm not really a friend of the whole #NotAllClanners shtick they have going on too, I like my Clans as warped hyper-militarist caste dystopias that you gotta blast off the face of Port Arthur.

omg i love gundam threads
*sound of battletech fanboys REEEEEEEing in the distance*
Yea it's a Macross thread!
 

Jason Liang

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Stackpole does make his main protagonists (Victor, Phelan, Kai, Hohiro, Natasha Kerensky and Ulric) a little too Mary Sue, but at least the story makes Victor and Kai pay for it pretty dearly, which is kind of satisfying (Phelan on the other hand is just the worst male Mary Sue ever). But yeah, Stackpole's version of the Battletech universe has clear faces and heels. His more morally ambiguous characters are much more interesting which is why my two favorite Stackpole BT novels, Natural Selection and Bred for War, feature his morally ambiguous characters more - Nelson Geist, Katarina, Sun-Tzu, Isis Marik.

I've been thinking a lot about how Battletech would adapt to film and television over the past week. The Clans are basically a golem-race of abominations that Nicholas Kerensky unleashed that took over the Clans and are taking over the universe. Trueborn Clan warriors are genetically-grown, they don't reproduce- they're basically human-looking Jem'haedar. I've been trying to figure out why he would unleash this plague on the universe. Their only redeeming quality, which also turns out to be their weakness, is that they treat war as a game to earn glory, and they minimize the destruction it causes. To finally stop them, Victor figured out that is their weakness- the Clans may be masters of battle, but they do not know true war. War isn't a game. War is hell. In the end Victor finally defeats the clans. But isn't Nicholas Kerensky's vision that of a better humanity? So Victor does not so much save humanity as doom humanity to be trapped by the violence of the past.
 
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PorkBarrellGuy

Guest
Ulric is fairly Mary Sue save for one thing, IMO: the Clan Wolverine thing. Dickest of dick moves, framing the Wolverines for that shit and setting them up for Annihilation because McEvedy had the temerity to question. I've heard people say "well he had to" and I call bullshit because if something requires THAT much dickery to preserve, it wasn't worth preserving.

EDIT: wait, fuck, that was Nicholas, disregard, Ulric was Clan Invasion-era. Fuck the Kerenskys, regardless
 
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Vaarna_Aarne

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I would say it'd be better to fully go with Trueborn being eugenic supermen built for their purpose, and indeed present them as very much human in appearance and many ways but inhuman in how they've become as people. Go with Kerensky's original ideal essentially twisting into a Heinlein-inspired dystopia where they overall believe (you also need to take Clan Wolf down a huge peg, and pretty much shove any goodness they have into Wolf's Dragoons who "flip" sides during their infiltration/scouting mission) in a radical vision of Kerensky's "politicians ruin everything" and instead start believing "everyone except soldiers are subhumans" which develops into "everyone except Trueborn MechWarriors and Elementals are no different from animals." Rather than going with defeat of the Clans being also the end of a vision of better humanity to the Clan Invasion being what the vision of "better humanity" ended up causing. It's rather cliche, but that's basically how you can work it best.

And I totally agree that the thing that allows Big Boss and Victor (or whoever) to beat the Clans should be that being master of battle is not the same as being master of war, especially if your idea of battle is a game. Like, I'd obviously think it'd be a good idea to de-tard Zellbrigen to an extent so the Clans don't appear just completely tactically and strategically incompetent, but one simple idea would really be to focus on the whole honor combat ruleset's kind of glaring omission as leading to something that in the rules of how these fantastical BattleMechs work in the universe there's a severe design flaw. Namely, that most OmniMechs don't have even a single hand or what appear to be full myomer musculature that could mimic human movement. So in single combat with whoever, Big Boss or whoever spots this and instead of fighting at range where the OmniMech is at distinct advantage, he wrestles the OmniMech (extra points for Clanners being shocked of such "animal fighting" out of the blue).

In terms of making The Big Story out of BattleTech, the big question is really just whether or not Myndo and ComStar are the secret main antagonist. You sort of have to just omit that or come up with a more finality to the aftermath instead of having to deal with Jihad or some shit later. Basically you just need to forge a cohesive, focused narrative where you cover why Succession Wars happened and what they are, Clan Invasion, shit happens, and then somehow ram together Tukayyud and Bulldog (one solution would be to just establish that there is no Clan space anymore, they packed up all their shit with them when they left to invade like Khans of old).


(Also in case you're wondering Big Boss in BattleTech is Focht, considering his effective position as the grand old man of IS MechWarriors and rockin' eyepatch)
 

PorkBarrellGuy

Guest
(Also in case you're wondering Big Boss in BattleTech is Focht, considering his effective position as the grand old man of IS MechWarriors and rockin' eyepatch)

IIRC Focht is not his real name though, I think he's really a Steiner (a competent Steiner commander? Crazy talk)
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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(Also in case you're wondering Big Boss in BattleTech is Focht, considering his effective position as the grand old man of IS MechWarriors and rockin' eyepatch)

IIRC Focht is not his real name though, I think he's really a Steiner (a competent Steiner commander? Crazy talk)
Yea he's a Steiner, don't recall the first name, he got captured by Kurita (IIRC his identity was unknown to them) but was acquired from them by ComStar to be a commander for the ComGuard (officially his Steiner self died in that skirmish with Kurita).
 

Jason Liang

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Yeah, I already figured Big Boss was Focht. Actually I was thinking about how to get in more of his backstory since he's really a key character.

The Aleksander Kerensky version of things is that war and violence are just a part of human nature. That's really the only reason to justify Nicholas creating the Clan genetics program, to try to breed a sort of ubermensch that treats war with more civility. The reason why the Inner Sphere wins in the end *is* that they went through the Succession Wars, so they know more about War than the Clans. Now it's kind of strange that Comstar ends up defeating the Clans on Tukayyid but perhaps the ComGuards studied mankind's history of warfare.

The spine of the Battletech story is the invention of the Kearny-Fuchida drive that let humanity develop Jumpships and colonize the galaxy. They find habitable worlds, but no other intelligent lifeforms, and create a Star Empire with Terra at its center. But no matter how far humanity leaves the cradle, civilization is fragile. Men lose the knowledge of how to make Jumpships, without which their star empires collapse. Aleksander Kerensky saw that humanity was doomed to destroy itself in endless and pointless warfare, so he took the fleet in exile, one day to return and restore civilization from the ashes. But the central concept of Battletech is that, unlike say the Star Trek universe, here mankind will always return to war. It's just a basic part of human nature, and it can only be tamed, not eliminated. Humanity will never escape war (personified by Victor, whose life is one war followed by the next, and he really does lose everything until war is the only thing he has left) and through war we will suffer the loss of everything else that we value.

I haven't read the Jihad sourcebook that came out a few years ago, but I've been reading about it on Sarna.net. Not sure how the Wobbies fit into the whole narrative. For me there's enough material from Succession Wars -> Operation Revival -> FedCom Civil War/ restoration of the Star League for a complete story.
 

PorkBarrellGuy

Guest
I personally think the idea of Lostech is kind of dumb, but whatever.

EDIT: Like, ok, I get the idea of losing the ability to manufacture something because the planet the factory line was on got fucking blasted to shit, I get the idea of quality going down as materials become more scarce and so on, but the KNOWLEDGE just disappearing makes no sense to me when communications have evolved that far. The only real life parallel I can honestly think of for something like this would be the burning of the Alexandria library, and slapping that kind of dilemma into a universe with FTL travel and communications and incredible computing and data storage seems really strange. Not to mention the fact that there are still things like Star League caches all over the goddamn place.
 
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Jason Liang

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My favorite summary of the Battletech backstory, from the Battletech CCG rulebook. Interestingly it's written by Focht.

The BattleTech Universe
Notes recorded by Anastasius Focht,
ComStar Precentor Martial, 3058

How do you measure centuries of war?
Do you count bodies, or empty ammunition shells? Can you quantify the screams of the dying in decibels? How many reservoirs would you need to hold the blood of men, women, and children alike?
For myself, the best measurement is the squandering of our own precious resources. So much has been devoted to the spilling of blood, so little to improving the lives of the survivors. My children’s generation will lead lives less prosperous than those of their ancestors fifteen generations past.
The beginning of the end began with the colonization of deep space. The young states of the Inner Sphere—a collection of worlds centered around Terra, the birthplace of man—scrapped with and clawed at each other to secure rocks for colonization. Then, the armies of war numbered in the millions, and humanity clamored for a way to kill itself more efficiently.
Salvation came with the rise of the BattleMechs at the dawn of the 25th century. These ten-meter humanoid tanks crashed through the ranks of infantry, unloading lethal weapons faster than any artillery. An entire battalion of soldiers could be replaced by one pilot in a walking war machine.
As these colossi strode the battlefield like Titans from the dawn of time, the Inner Sphere wearied of war. They formed the Star League—an alliance of five Great Houses who surrendered rights of rulership to a single First Lord who had a standing army. For two centuries, peace and progress reigned over the Inner Sphere.
But just as Cronus, leader of the Titans, was betrayed, so was the Star League. The years of prosperity ended with an assassin’s strike. In 2766, Richard Cameron, the young First Lord of the Star League, was murdered by a pretender to the throne, Stefan Amaris. This traitorous devil seized control of the Star League in a vicious palace coup. Hannah Boman, a poet of the era, wrote about the tragedy that “The stars reflect but dimly/In the blood of a broken peace.”
But Amaris had not considered the will of the commander of the Star League Defense Forces, General Aleksandr Kerensky. Refusing to follow a murderer, Kerensky locked his forces into battle with Amaris. At the cost of billions of lives, the usurper was put down, but the Star League had been mortally wounded. Kerensky foresaw the League’s descent into civil war and rather than be a tool of that conflict he chose to withdraw entirely.
In the largest exodus into the Periphery to date, Kerensky’s war machine left the Star League to its own ruin. The Star League lords, crazed with ambition and greed, seized the opportunity to cut each others’ throats, and in so doing, destroyed themselves.
In war after war, the Houses of the Inner Sphere sacrificed their youth upon the altar of greed. Far from making the Inner Sphere stronger, strife between Houses cost the Inner Sphere irreplaceable technology and generations of leaders. For almost 300 years, the guns were rarely quiet.
And then, in 3050, on a cold barren rock in the Periphery, everything changed. The descendants of Kerensky and his soldiers came roaring back to retake the Inner Sphere. They no longer called themselves battalions and divisions . Now they were called the Clans. They cloaked themselves with the names of fierce animals: Ghost Bear, Smoke Jaguar, Jade Falcon, Wolf. And they had everything the Inner Sphere had lost—technology, training, and unity of purpose.
Or so it seemed. In truth, the Clans were divided almost as bitterly as their Inner Sphere cousins. Some, like Clan Smoke Jaguar, were brutal aggressors. Others, like Clan Wolf, looked for a craftier solution than war. Nonetheless, all the Clans fought with fierce determination and success.
They might have won the war outright in their first foray if not for a brave sacrifice that nearly cost me my life. A young pilot, Tyra Miraborg, crashed her crippled Shilone aerofighter into the bridge of the Clan flagship, killing the leader of the Clans. Her valiant sacrifice was the bravest I have ever witnessed, and tears fall from my eyes even now as I think of her. I stood on the deck of that flagship, watched her action with agony, watched with awe the cream of the Clan leadership being sucked into the void.
After Miraborg, the Clans halted their invasion to select a new leader—a process which gave us a full year of breathing space.
During this unexpected cease-fire, the Inner Sphere hardened itself for war. And when the Clans returned, they found a more powerful and more unified opponent. The battles raged from planet to planet, until the Clans announced their ultimate target: Terra.
The cradle of humanity. My home.
Until this time, we of ComStar claimed neutrality in this war, even though few of us truly felt neutral. But now the Clans were threatening our planet of Terra. We could claim neutrality no longer. We met the Clans with ComStar’s fiercest forces, on the planet of Tukayyid. We lost many brave warriors in that engagement, but their deaths were not in vain. The battle went to us—the Inner Sphere.
So now we earned a brittle peace. For fifteen years, the Clans and the Inner Sphere have sworn to honor the truce of Tukayyid—fifteen years, so they say, but no one believes it will last that long. Certainly, I do not. The hunger for battle and destruction grows like a cancer inside humanity, in the hearts of Clan and House alike. Even I can feel it...the desire to crush the enemy who killed so many of our own. Brothers, sisters, mothers, sons. Our future dead on the battlefields of history.
Even now, House Kurita girds to retake the worlds it lost to the Smoke Jaguars, and House Steiner prepares to meet the Jade Falcons with no quarter given. Again, we are at war.
They say history is written by the victorious. Though some claim otherwise, I do not count myself among the victors. But I will write this history, in hopes that it outlives both the victorious and the defeated, and remains simply the truth.
 

Jason Liang

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I personally think the idea of Lostech is kind of dumb, but whatever.

EDIT: Like, ok, I get the idea of losing the ability to manufacture something because the planet the factory line was on got fucking blasted to shit, I get the idea of quality going down as materials become more scarce and so on, but the KNOWLEDGE just disappearing makes no sense to me when communications have evolved that far. The only real life parallel I can honestly think of for something like this would be the burning of the Alexandria library, and slapping that kind of dilemma into a universe with FTL travel and communications and incredible computing and data storage seems really strange. Not to mention the fact that there are still things like Star League caches all over the goddamn place.

The problem is that the number of engineers who actually *know* how to make things is very small compared to the number of people who use them. One extreme example are computer processor chips - there are less than 10 people in the world who can design one. But even technology that seems commonplace like airplanes and televisions, the number of people who can actually design an airplane or television factory in the world is only in the thousands. So just because Jumpship technology was common in the Star League, most people don't know how to create a Kearny-Fuchida drive factory.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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The key part there is really just that Succession Wars started with targeted attacks on the critical industrial and human infrastructure for those purposes.

Albeit there is kind of a question to be raised about the destruction of educational materials, and the overall scale of the Inner Sphere (and thus ability of anyone to destroy ALL of those materials and ALL of that infrastructure), as question marks for the actual possibility of Lostech within the setting. Then again, this is a general problem more inherent to technologically advanced spaceborne settings that do not have a single pivotal location that everything else has no choice but to revolve around (ie Dune). Despite ostensibly being a huge place, the Inner Sphere is actually deceptively small narratively, since much of the thinking used in creating it applies continental and small scales to something vastly larger where the analogy fails.
 

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