Prestige Classes for ToEE

[Sitra Achara]

Could Assassin's alignment requirement be changed to "Any Non-Good" from "Any Evil" ? Not all Assassins in D&D are evil as far as I recall.

Any chance of adding Favoured Soul (divine equivalent of sorcerer essentially) as either a regular class or a prestige one in the future?

I'll be adding a 'lax rules' house rules option which will ignore alignment requirements for classes among other things.

I'll add Favoured Soul once I've hooked the character creation interface. Probably in the coming months since I also want to add subraces, psi and a generic 'features' selection for kits.

Once you hook it, will you also add stuff like mage specialisations or deity-specific kits (E.g. like how there are Knights of Mystic Fire as Mystra-oriented Paladins or deity-specific cleric kits in Faerun)?

Mage specializations are already in, no?
As for kits, that's more or less the intent, though I can't comment on the specifics since I'm not too familiar with them right now. Have a few other bridges to cross first

 

[Etharil]

Could Assassin's alignment requirement be changed to "Any Non-Good" from "Any Evil" ? Not all Assassins in D&D are evil as far as I recall.

Any chance of adding Favoured Soul (divine equivalent of sorcerer essentially) as either a regular class or a prestige one in the future?

I'll be adding a 'lax rules' house rules option which will ignore alignment requirements for classes among other things.

I'll add Favoured Soul once I've hooked the character creation interface. Probably in the coming months since I also want to add subraces, psi and a generic 'features' selection for kits.

Once you hook it, will you also add stuff like mage specialisations or deity-specific kits (E.g. like how there are Knights of Mystic Fire as Mystra-oriented Paladins or deity-specific cleric kits in Faerun)?

Mage specializations are already in, no?
As for kits, that's more or less the intent, though I can't comment on the specifics since I'm not too familiar with them right now. Have a few other bridges to cross first

They aren't unless you count the school specialisation feat, which is just a school-specific spell penetration. I'm referring to specialisation kits like Invoker, Abjurationist, Illusionist etc.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Could Assassin's alignment requirement be changed to "Any Non-Good" from "Any Evil" ? Not all Assassins in D&D are evil as far as I recall.

Any chance of adding Favoured Soul (divine equivalent of sorcerer essentially) as either a regular class or a prestige one in the future?

I'll be adding a 'lax rules' house rules option which will ignore alignment requirements for classes among other things.

I'll add Favoured Soul once I've hooked the character creation interface. Probably in the coming months since I also want to add subraces, psi and a generic 'features' selection for kits.

Once you hook it, will you also add stuff like mage specialisations or deity-specific kits (E.g. like how there are Knights of Mystic Fire as Mystra-oriented Paladins or deity-specific cleric kits in Faerun)?

Mage specializations are already in, no?
As for kits, that's more or less the intent, though I can't comment on the specifics since I'm not too familiar with them right now. Have a few other bridges to cross first

They aren't unless you count the school specialisation feat, which is just a school-specific spell penetration. I'm referring to specialisation kits like Invoker, Abjurationist, Illusionist etc.

AFAIK school specialization in ToEE/3rd ed gives you an extra spell slot of the spell school, nothing to do with spell penetration. If you're referring to something else, I'm not familiar with it.

 

[Etharil]

Could Assassin's alignment requirement be changed to "Any Non-Good" from "Any Evil" ? Not all Assassins in D&D are evil as far as I recall.

Any chance of adding Favoured Soul (divine equivalent of sorcerer essentially) as either a regular class or a prestige one in the future?

I'll be adding a 'lax rules' house rules option which will ignore alignment requirements for classes among other things.

I'll add Favoured Soul once I've hooked the character creation interface. Probably in the coming months since I also want to add subraces, psi and a generic 'features' selection for kits.

Once you hook it, will you also add stuff like mage specialisations or deity-specific kits (E.g. like how there are Knights of Mystic Fire as Mystra-oriented Paladins or deity-specific cleric kits in Faerun)?

Mage specializations are already in, no?
As for kits, that's more or less the intent, though I can't comment on the specifics since I'm not too familiar with them right now. Have a few other bridges to cross first

They aren't unless you count the school specialisation feat, which is just a school-specific spell penetration. I'm referring to specialisation kits like Invoker, Abjurationist, Illusionist etc.

AFAIK school specialization in ToEE/3rd ed gives you an extra spell slot of the spell school, nothing to do with spell penetration. If you're referring to something else, I'm not familiar with it.

I haven't seen it implemented at all other than the feats which work the way I mentioned. 3.5E Wizards in IWD2 followed the same/similar kit design as 2E ones from IWD1 and BG series - starts with all spells of their school learned, gets +1 spell slot / level and has a ban on up to 3 opposite schools, depending on a choice.

A mod called "Tome and Blood" (mod for 2E Infinity Engine games) expanded them further by giving them in-theme special bonuses (for example diviners cannot be backstabbed because of their ability to predict the future), school-specific cantrips (e.g. Stiffen Bones for Necromancers or summon rabbit for conjurers) and changing the school restriction to necromancy for everyone except necromancers + a penalty to learning spells of other schools from scrolls. Necromancers get a bunch of extra bonuses, an exclusive magic school but can be evil only and receive stat penalties IIRC.

I don't remember how specialisations in 3.5E are treated and I don't have my IWD2 anywhere nearby to check.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Could Assassin's alignment requirement be changed to "Any Non-Good" from "Any Evil" ? Not all Assassins in D&D are evil as far as I recall.

Any chance of adding Favoured Soul (divine equivalent of sorcerer essentially) as either a regular class or a prestige one in the future?

I'll be adding a 'lax rules' house rules option which will ignore alignment requirements for classes among other things.

I'll add Favoured Soul once I've hooked the character creation interface. Probably in the coming months since I also want to add subraces, psi and a generic 'features' selection for kits.

Once you hook it, will you also add stuff like mage specialisations or deity-specific kits (E.g. like how there are Knights of Mystic Fire as Mystra-oriented Paladins or deity-specific cleric kits in Faerun)?

Mage specializations are already in, no?
As for kits, that's more or less the intent, though I can't comment on the specifics since I'm not too familiar with them right now. Have a few other bridges to cross first

They aren't unless you count the school specialisation feat, which is just a school-specific spell penetration. I'm referring to specialisation kits like Invoker, Abjurationist, Illusionist etc.

AFAIK school specialization in ToEE/3rd ed gives you an extra spell slot of the spell school, nothing to do with spell penetration. If you're referring to something else, I'm not familiar with it.

I haven't seen it implemented at all other than the feats which work the way I mentioned. 3.5E Wizards in IWD2 followed the same/similar kit design as 2E ones from IWD1 and BG series - starts with all spells of their school learned, gets +1 spell slot / level and has a ban on up to 3 opposite schools, depending on a choice.

Ah, in that case you just missed it - when creating a wizard there's an optional Features tab that you have to click to pick a specialization school, which gives you the extra slot etc.

What I had in mind is to expand the Features tab to support other such customizations/kits similar to the examples you listed.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Started on the Arcane Archer class today, and it just dawned on me what a piece of trash class it is in 3.5 I'm tempted to just outright substitute it with the Pathfinder specification.

I'll try to list as many as I know/can find.

There are actually quite a few materials that help with ASF. Maybe they could be implemented as +0 enchantments for appropriate equipment, while still having the appropriate costs?

• Leafweave RoW: Reduces arcane spell failure by 5%, armor check penalty is lessened by 2 and maximum dexterity bonus is increased by 1. Leafweave applies on padded, leather, studded leather and hide armor.
• Wildwood RoW: Lessens arcane spell failure by 5%, but reduces armor bonus by 1 and increases max dexterity bonus by 1.
• Thistledown Suit RoW: Reduces arcane spell failure chance by 5% and increases the armor's check penalty by 1.

There is also the Twilight enchantment (also in Magic Item Compendium) that is +1, and lowers ASF by 10%. Requires Cat's Grace to enchant.

So, regarding this... I gather these materials would be used to craft padded / leather armors with 0-5% ASF? Otherwise ToEE's Elven chains should be good enough I reckon.
I'll add the Twilight Enchantment as well (will be craftable when the Non-Core Materials house rules option is enabled).

 

[Knightly]

First of all thanks for awesome work you've done, doing and will do, Sitra.

Thanks to your efforts (everyone on your team and Co8 team included) Temple of Elemental Evil is epitome of D&D 3,5 Computer gaming.

Probably I am the least techy guy you can find so don't know if this classes can be done or not, so leaving them to your judgement.

Core Classes:
- Favored Soul - Complete Divine
- Warlock - Complete Arcane
- Archivist - Heroes of Horror (Wizard like Divine Caster who can write divine spells into their prayer books. Int based casting/DC, Wisdom for bonus spells)

Prestige Classes:
- Fochlucan Lyrist
- Pale Master - Libris Mortis
- Shadowbane Stalker - Complete Adventurer

As a general multi-classing request, can we also have Able Learner(from Races of Destiny) feat?

 

[deuxhero]

The only remotely worthwhile use of Arcane Archer in 3.5 (long casting time spells as a standard action. PF explicitly blocks this from working) doesn't even apply in ToEE (as such spells aren't implemented) so I'd agree with using the PF version.

 

[Knightly]

Have two more requests/sugesstions:

Hexblade - Base class from Complete Warrior
Bladesinger - Elf/Half Elf specific class from Complete Warrior as well

 

[Endarire]

I'm most interested in the martial adept classes, but that requires an engine overhaul.

May we get a Cooperative Crafting rule? This checks if anyone in the party has the spells/requirements for crafting something, not just whoever has the crafting feat. For example, a Wizard with Scribe Scroll but without bull's strength in a party with a Druid3 who has bull's strength could make scrolls of bull's strength. (It's RAW but may be fit for the House Rules tab.)

May we also get a vendor in Hommlet or/and Nulb who sells all level 1-5 Wizard scrolls? Wizards are the only class who gets shafted in spells known, and they're meant to be item crafters in this game! Verbobonc sells more spell scrolls, but why should I need to wait until I'm notably higher level and micromanage/metagame what Wizard spells I learn at level up when a vendor would be an efficient solution for this?

 

[Sitra Achara]

First of all thanks for awesome work you've done, doing and will do, Sitra.

Thanks to your efforts (everyone on your team and Co8 team included) Temple of Elemental Evil is epitome of D&D 3,5 Computer gaming.

Probably I am the least techy guy you can find so don't know if this classes can be done or not, so leaving them to your judgement.

Core Classes:
- Favored Soul - Complete Divine
- Warlock - Complete Arcane
- Archivist - Heroes of Horror (Wizard like Divine Caster who can write divine spells into their prayer books. Int based casting/DC, Wisdom for bonus spells)

Prestige Classes:
- Fochlucan Lyrist
- Pale Master - Libris Mortis
- Shadowbane Stalker - Complete Adventurer

As a general multi-classing request, can we also have Able Learner(from Races of Destiny) feat?

Favored Soul nearly done, going to be the first new base class available in Temple+.

On that note, the character class python specification file format has been updated, so if anyone has made a Mod of the existing classes, please make sure to redo your changes when you get the newest version.

 

[deuxhero]

I'm most interested in the martial adept classes, but that requires an engine overhaul.

May we get a Cooperative Crafting rule? This checks if anyone in the party has the spells/requirements for crafting something, not just whoever has the crafting feat. For example, a Wizard with Scribe Scroll but without bull's strength in a party with a Druid3 who has bull's strength could make scrolls of bull's strength. (It's RAW but may be fit for the House Rules tab.)

May we also get a vendor in Hommlet or/and Nulb who sells all level 1-5 Wizard scrolls? Wizards are the only class who gets shafted in spells known, and they're meant to be item crafters in this game! Verbobonc sells more spell scrolls, but why should I need to wait until I'm notably higher level and micromanage/metagame what Wizard spells I learn at level up when a vendor would be an efficient solution for this?

Bernie's apprentice sells scrolls (attached to an otherwise useless NPC in the basement in Co8 to prevent her joining the party from breaking it), though what she actually sells is fairly random.

 

[Sitra Achara]

I'm most interested in the martial adept classes, but that requires an engine overhaul.

May we get a Cooperative Crafting rule? This checks if anyone in the party has the spells/requirements for crafting something, not just whoever has the crafting feat. For example, a Wizard with Scribe Scroll but without bull's strength in a party with a Druid3 who has bull's strength could make scrolls of bull's strength. (It's RAW but may be fit for the House Rules tab.)

May we also get a vendor in Hommlet or/and Nulb who sells all level 1-5 Wizard scrolls? Wizards are the only class who gets shafted in spells known, and they're meant to be item crafters in this game! Verbobonc sells more spell scrolls, but why should I need to wait until I'm notably higher level and micromanage/metagame what Wizard spells I learn at level up when a vendor would be an efficient solution for this?

Endarire, something like vendors who sell all the scrolls with 100% chance is something you can easily mod yourself. I encourage you to look at data\rules\invensource.mes, make whatever edits you want to the existing spell vendors, and submit them so whoever else wants it can download and enjoy it too. This is also something that I consider too 'content oriented' for Temple+ so I prefer it to be handled this way.

 

[Etharil]

Now that you've previewed the Favoured Soul class, I'd - personally - love to see the Magus kit in the future. The spellslinger, battlemage sort of class would be awesome.

 

[Endarire]

Archmage: How do you plan to implement this? Normally, by choosing an Archmage ability, you must give up a spell slot of a certain level. (I disagreed with that and removed that when I GMed.) If you do implement it this way, ensure you remove specialty slots first since that's most optimal and RAW legal.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Archmage: How do you plan to implement this? Normally, by choosing an Archmage ability, you must give up a spell slot of a certain level. (I disagreed with that and removed that when I GMed.) If you do implement it this way, ensure you remove specialty slots first since that's most optimal and RAW legal.

Archmage is probably going to get swapped for Dragon Disciple since it has less relevance to ToEE (you can first take it when hitting level 14, unless you're soloing the game is nearly over at that point).

 

[Knightly]

Same goes for Hierophant as well?

For making things a bit easier with breath attacks you can turn Dragon Disciple to Red Dragon Disciple like some other CRPG did.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Same goes for Hierophant as well?

For making things a bit easier with breath attacks you can turn Dragon Disciple to Red Dragon Disciple like some other CRPG did.

Wasn't planning on doing the Heirophant.
Also once the planned classes have been done I'll pass the ball to the userbase for creating new classes, since I really want to get Skirmish mode going. ToEE really needs some new content and I have some cool ideas for set piece scenarios I want to try.

 

[Endarire]

Also consider using the Pathfinder Dragon Disciple since it's better, or so I heard.

 

[deuxhero]

It is, but it's dependent on advancing an ability (bloodline) that 3.5 doesn't have.

 

[Endarire]

Pathfinder Dragon Disciple: Just ignore the bloodline advancement part. A core Bard/Fighter should be able to, by RAW, max the class.

I'd also like Fochlucan Lyrist (Complete Adventurer) and Arcane Hierophant (Races of the Wild) for theurge classes. This way, I can better solo the game with a dual caster.

PS: What is the level cap for Mystic Theurge and Eldritch Knight? (I hope they're uncapped due to them being gishy and theurgic and the only way to get these things in game at present!)

 

[Sitra Achara]

Yeah they're all currently uncapped :D

 

[Endarire]

Alleluia!

Pweath investigate my most recent feature suggestions/requests in the thread. There are some which seem easily implemented.

For Eldirtch Knight, may we get +1 Fighter bonus feat at EK1, 11, 21, etc. but with a lost caster level only at EK1? May we get more interesting/helpful/Pathfinder-like class features for Mystic Theurge and the other PrCs?

 

[Sitra Achara]

Alleluia!

Pweath investigate my most recent feature suggestions/requests in the thread. There are some which seem easily implemented.

I read everything posted and prioritize based on my judgment. There's no need to pimp your own requests.

 

[Endarire]

Apologies. I didn't realize what was happening behind the scenes.