Prestige Classes for ToEE

[g0ld0]

Oh don't try the duelist yet, it's definitely mot implemented. There's a reason it's called WIP preview ^^

Ahahahahaha... alright then... if you say so...
Just cost me 3 ranks of perform (in a cross-skill class)...

 

[Sitra Achara]

Coming this weekend:

 

[Neanderthal]

Might be some info on Canonfire about prestige classes: http://www.canonfire.com/cf/index.php

 

[deuxhero]

PF alternate classes are really just kits/alternate class features/archetypes by a different name. They only get a special billing/name like that because their changes are so extensive. You don't need a separate slot for them.

With the base classes you listed as included, you just need Psionics (XPH+Psionic Rogue really, most non-core Psionics are rubbish) and Binder then you'll have all the base classes anyone would actually want to use. Factotum is great, but I doubt its very freeform abilities would translate well to a computer game.

As for prestige classes, there over 500 in 3.5, but the vast majority are rubbish, redundant (there are a lot of dual advancement classes that nobody will use when they can pick a better one), won't translate to a combat focused video game (Merchant Prince: Makes you better at running a business and pretty much nothing else) or are completely unusable as printed in the first place. Abjurant Champion is one I'd include because almost every fighting mage build needs it for max power.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Oh don't try the duelist yet, it's definitely mot implemented. There's a reason it's called WIP preview ^^

Ahahahahaha... alright then... if you say so...
Just cost me 3 ranks of perform (in a cross-skill class)...

So, working on the Duelist now... Most of it went pretty smoothly, just have the Precise Strike left to do. I gotta ask though, what's the appeal of this class? Seems pretty gimp to me.

 

[deuxhero]

The fluff is something people want, but the class is universally recognized as being absolute garbage mechanically. Same with Dwarven Defender.

 

[Andhaira]

Sitra Achara Hey this looks sweet! But aren't classes like Archmage requiring at least 15 levels in Wizard or so? How will characters attain such a high level, or does the Hillsfar mod or something else allow that?

Also do you new graphics/animations for the new spells and abilities like Arcane Fire (Archmage?)

Please don't fuck this up. And don't add any gay shit like Cloud's materia dong.

 

[Swithin]

Hey Sitra, just found out about TemplePlus this morning and felt the need to come by and say thanks. I haven't touched ToEE in years, but I'm excited to see what finds its way into the game over the coming months and years! Amazing work!

Factotum is great, but I doubt its very freeform abilities would translate well to a computer game.

Factotum was the first thing that came to mind when I read that adding classes is now possible. ^_^ You're probably correct that most of the flexibility that makes the class so appealing is lost without all the social aspects of play, but the upshot is that in a single-player setting you can take the time to formulate plans and co-ordinate the party's actions, and the factotum play pattern really shows off this strength. Plus, if the class is added early, factotum fans get to anticipate buffs in every update as spells, items, and maybe even expanded uses for skill checks get added. They really do interact with everything (assuming Font of Inspiration is implemented...)

I didn't mean to run on about the factotum, but if I've understood correctly with Temple Plus it's now trivial to roll up a party of any level. I can't see myself ever having the time or interest to create a complete campaign (the IWD project is mind-boggling,) but I could see the fun in setting up shorter level-specific scenarios and single-room encounters (I find 1st level one-offs insipid.) I'd guess most of the ToEE player-base are probably looking for longer adventures, but if ToEE as a 3.5 combat simulator and this "vignette" style of downloadable quest takes off I honestly think the factotum would be a pretty good fit for the game (consider an encounter geared for up to three 15th level PCs, with an emphasis on stealth: your goal is to extract an artifact from the third sub-level of a cultic enclave, and multiple combats will almost certainly lead to a TPK. Two PRC-x/rogues and a factotum start sounding pretty good, right?) On a related note, I can't wait to try out the ToB classes!

...

I can see myself being talked into learning how to add the factotum myself in about two months.

In any case, thanks for all the hard work, Sitra Achara!

 

[Sitra Achara]

The fluff is something people want, but the class is universally recognized as being absolute garbage mechanically. Same with Dwarven Defender.

Figures! Oh well, maybe the Mobility enhancement will be more useful when the Tumble mechanics are brought to the 3.5 format. It could also be improved via a House Rules option - any suggestions?

Sitra Achara Hey this looks sweet! But aren't classes like Archmage requiring at least 15 levels in Wizard or so? How will characters attain such a high level, or does the Hillsfar mod or something else allow that?

Also do you new graphics/animations for the new spells and abilities like Arcane Fire (Archmage?)

Please don't fuck this up. And don't add any gay shit like Cloud's materia dong.

Yeah, vanilla ToEE runs probably won't get much use for these classes, you'll need the Co8 mod with added content and even then you'd probably have to play a solo/small party run to get the most out of it.

I'll indeed have to create effects for the new spells and abilities that require it. Fortunately ToEE has a fairly robust particle fx system just for that, and plenty of existing effects as well, so I can copy and edit for just about anything I'd want.

That said, I'm leaving Archmage for last

Hey Sitra, just found out about TemplePlus this morning and felt the need to come by and say thanks. I haven't touched ToEE in years, but I'm excited to see what finds its way into the game over the coming months and years! Amazing work!

Factotum was the first thing that came to mind when I read that adding classes is now possible. ^_^ You're probably correct that most of the flexibility that makes the class so appealing is lost without all the social aspects of play, but the upshot is that in a single-player setting you can take the time to formulate plans and co-ordinate the party's actions, and the factotum play pattern really shows off this strength. Plus, if the class is added early, factotum fans get to anticipate buffs in every update as spells, items, and maybe even expanded uses for skill checks get added. They really do interact with everything (assuming Font of Inspiration is implemented...)

I didn't mean to run on about the factotum, but if I've understood correctly with Temple Plus it's now trivial to roll up a party of any level. I can't see myself ever having the time or interest to create a complete campaign (the IWD project is mind-boggling,) but I could see the fun in setting up shorter level-specific scenarios and single-room encounters (I find 1st level one-offs insipid.) I'd guess most of the ToEE player-base are probably looking for longer adventures, but if ToEE as a 3.5 combat simulator and this "vignette" style of downloadable quest takes off I honestly think the factotum would be a pretty good fit for the game (consider an encounter geared for up to three 15th level PCs, with an emphasis on stealth: your goal is to extract an artifact from the third sub-level of a cultic enclave, and multiple combats will almost certainly lead to a TPK. Two PRC-x/rogues and a factotum start sounding pretty good, right?) On a related note, I can't wait to try out the ToB classes!

...

I can see myself being talked into learning how to add the factotum myself in about two months.

In any case, thanks for all the hard work, Sitra Achara!

Thanks! I agree that the ToEE engine would be well suited to mini-adventures. Might actually be a good idea as an alternative to Total Conversions of other games - capture the cool set-piece battles and carry your party from scenario to scenario. Would also help reduce grinding combats originally designed for a RTWP game flow.
Any help in creating classes would be appreciated, I'll do my best to help anyone willing to put in the effort

 

[g0ld0]

So, working on the Duelist now... Most of it went pretty smoothly, just have the Precise Strike left to do. I gotta ask though, what's the appeal of this class? Seems pretty gimp to me.

Yeah, It's mostly for fluff purposes...
As for prestige classes, Exotic Weapon Master (3.5) is a nice little add-up for flavor. Battlesmith is also nice for magic arms and armor crafting for non-casters. I'll have to dig up my old books to see if there is anything that comes to the fore.

 

[Sitra Achara]

I could optionally add Riposte and Disarming Riposte to the Duelist. If the enemy rolls a 1 on their attack roll you get an AoO. At level 5 it also breaks their attack (I.e. if they had 3 attacks, rolled 1 on the first and got hit by the AoO they'd be denied the rest of them), and at level 7 a Disarming AoO that acts as if you had Improved Disarm.

 

[Dr. Bak]

The fluff is something people want, but the class is universally recognized as being absolute garbage mechanically. Same with Dwarven Defender.

Right now I'm playing a Rog 1/Ftr 7/Dwarven Defender 2 with a solid 38 AC (wihout magic items) that's decent for a 10 lvl character.
Pretty much all the core prestige classes cover in shame if compared with the secondary 3.5 supplements; sometimes sticking with a base class is a better choice in terms of power. Nevertheless I see in that the early effort of the authors to keep balance in the universe, before joining the dark side of untested content.

Moving on, these are my suggestions, one for each playstyle:
Dread Pirate (C.Adv p.39)
Radiant Servant of Pelor (C.Div p. 52)
Geometer (C.Arc p.39)
Frenzied Berserker (C.War p34)

 

[DnDPaladin]

so... crusader is coming huh... so we'll be able to solo all the contents with the class.
just saying, anything coming from tome of battle - book of nine swords is pretty abusive in any games. no wonder the book was banned from pretty much all table top games.
but its awesome how far you are getting with all this, i'm loving more and more every release. i'd so help if it was that easy adding stuff to it. but i dont know anything about python.
so all i can say is keep going this is awesome and might just become the best D&D engine ever created.

 

[deuxhero]

ToB is like Psionics: Only abusable if you ignore rules.

Also: You say that like Wizard's can't already solo the game. A few optional fights aside, ToEE is not a particularlly hard game if you grasp basic party building and tactics.

The fluff is something people want, but the class is universally recognized as being absolute garbage mechanically. Same with Dwarven Defender.

Right now I'm playing a Rog 1/Ftr 7/Dwarven Defender 2 with a solid 38 AC (wihout magic items) that's decent for a 10 lvl character.

What does this character do with something that doesn't target AC or simply chooses another character to attack?

 

[Dr. Bak]

What does this character do with something that doesn't target AC or simply chooses another character to attack?

He actually survived hard fights, assassin's death attacks, clay golem's cursed wounds, and good ties against higher level fighters
1 level of Rogue allowed me to max out diplomacy (used for provocking foes to attack me) and UMD (prot. vs evil, freedom of movement, touch of idiocy for casters, blur against sneak attacks)
That's a fun to play character, but I still agree with you that core prcs are outshined by the 2nd-party material's majestiness (e.g. shadowcraft mage, dweomerkeeper, archivist etc...)

 

[Endarire]

Typically, we call...

Archmage: ACM/Acm
Arcane Archer: AA
Arcane Trickster: AT
Assassin: Ass or Asa
Blackguard: BG
Dragon Disciple: DrD
Duelist: Duel
Dwarven Defender: DwD
Eldritch Knight: EK
Horizon Walker: HW
Mystic Theurge: MT

And so on.

 

[deuxhero]

Diplomacy provoking foes to attack is a thing in ToEE?!

 

[Valky]

Diplomacy provoking foes to attack is a thing in ToEE?!

Yeah, there's a handful of fights in the temple that start with a conversation and you can talk your way out of based on conversation skills.

 

[Sitra Achara]

Warning to all newcomers: The RPGCodex is sort of like Nulb.

 

[Valky]

Warning to all newcomers: The RPGCodex is sort of like Nulb.

Secretly full of do-gooders that you have to do quests for to discover?

 

[Sitra Achara]

You can certainly get quests in here... they usually involve a lot of grinding.

 

[Dr. Bak]

Diplomacy provoking foes to attack is a thing in ToEE?!

I haven't tried the DwD in ToEE yet, it was me describing my tabletop character.
Applying taunt mechanics in game would be less straightfoward. Interaction skills can change NPCs attitude, other than that the Goad feat is he only reference I recall (Pathfinder has Antagonize)

edit: link

 

[Sitra Achara]

Oh don't try the duelist yet, it's definitely mot implemented. There's a reason it's called WIP preview ^^

Ahahahahaha... alright then... if you say so...
Just cost me 3 ranks of perform (in a cross-skill class)...

Good news, Duelist will be out this weekend

 

[g0ld0]

Good news, Duelist will be out this weekend

Nice!!!!

 

[Sitra Achara]

Good news, Duelist will be out this weekend

Nice!!!!

Out now. Even managed to do the Dwarven Defender in time

Next stop: Arcane Trickster