Decline Retold, Remade, Reforged, Resurrected, Remastered - Where are new IPs?

[Fargus]

What do you mean no new IPs? There are quality games like Dustborn, Flintlock, Forspoken, Immortals of Aveum etc-etc all fo you to enjoy

 

[Frank Capicoli]

What do you mean no new IPs? There are quality games like Dustborn, Flintlock, Forspoken, Immortals of Aveum etc-etc all fo you to enjoy

The best part is you don't need to waste money, bandwidth, or storage space to enjoy them .

 

[Fargus]

Good thing they ran out of franchises to ruin and now they have no choice but to make these trainwrecks

 

[Dark Souls II]

Good thing they ran out of franchises to ruin and now they have no choice but to make these trainwrecks

No, instead you should be asking: who will make Arcanum 2 - Larian or Owlcat?

And Planescape: Torment 2 is yet to be made as well

 

[Fargus]

Hey if Bloodlines 2 is successful we can always expect Chinese Room to continue preserving Troika's legacy by making a sequel to Arcanum where you play as The Phyred One or something.

 

[Ezekiel]

Remasterings are nothing new.

Oh, come on! You show one game and act like it's always been like this, as if videos games were being remade left and right during the SNES. What is your point even?

 

[S.torch]

Many good answers in this thread about why the current state of things. Going from the financial to the cultural. I think there's another very important reason as to why all of this is happening that's yet to be mentioned.

Any form of creation in any field is born from inconformity. Artists always created because they felt unease with the world. A feel that something is wrong, out of place or lacking one way or the other. This sentiment was ultimately the drive behind the creative force. And this applies not just to modern artists but people from the distant past too.

Creating is the best confession that something is missing because you're throwing out there something that didn't exist before. It's the desire to fill that blank space.

But if you believe we are in the best time ever, everything's right and wholesome, there's no problems anywhere, everything is moving forward and nothing is ever wrong... Why create anything in the first place? Just consume and consume. If you're a suck-up to the system there's no reason to put any effort on anything besides the bare minimum to fill your pockets and dry the paypigs. And that type of person are the ones in the high echelons of the creative industry now.

 

[Ezekiel]

Even if you had true AI middleware allowing a small team churn out current year AAA quality production values...

You don't need AAA production values for incline, that's your first mistake

Yeah, people act like production values of 20 years ago are unacceptable, when they're totally fine for anything short of a glorified movie- and glorified movies are shit anyways. Art direction trumps production values for visual appeal every time.

Indies don't have production values from 20 years ago. No indie is making games with the animations, music, polish, scale, voice acting, rich mechanics and style of Resident Evil 4, Metal Gear Solid 3, The Wind Waker, Devil May Cry 3, Shadow of the Colossus, God of War, Okami, Super Mario Sunshine, Max Payne 2 and so many others. (I don't mean all for each, but a lot of different expensive elements that combine into a satisfying whole, so relax!) In fact, indies are trapped in this awkward middle where the hardware is so far ahead of what they can afford to put in the game that the whole thing feels cheaper and more vacuous. I'm happy that we have indies, but the lack of anything else becomes boring. You yearn for more.

 

[Ol' Willy]

The so-called AAA was never good.

The thing is that we didn't really have AAA in the game industry well before 2000s. The few exceptions are mostly from Japs like FF7 or some Sonic titles with bloated budgets

Nowadays, a game with multimillion budget is popping every month

 

[luj1]

Game studios have three main problems, in my opinion,

(1) Lack of original vision
(2) Inadequate content pipeline
(3) not traditionally educated designers

 

[luj1]

The so-called AAA was never good.

So FF7 was the first AAA lol

 

[Damned Registrations]

Even if you had true AI middleware allowing a small team churn out current year AAA quality production values...

You don't need AAA production values for incline, that's your first mistake

Yeah, people act like production values of 20 years ago are unacceptable, when they're totally fine for anything short of a glorified movie- and glorified movies are shit anyways. Art direction trumps production values for visual appeal every time.

Indies don't have production values from 20 years ago. No indie is making games with the animations, music, polish, scale, voice acting, rich mechanics and style of Resident Evil 4, Metal Gear Solid 3, The Wind Waker, Devil May Cry 3, Shadow of the Colossus, God of War, Okami, Super Mario Sunshine, Max Payne 2 and so many others. (I don't mean all for each, but a lot of different expensive elements that combine into a satisfying whole, so relax!) In fact, indies are trapped in this awkward middle where the hardware is so far ahead of what they can afford to put in the game that the whole thing feels cheaper and more vacuous. I'm happy that we have indies, but the lack of anything else becomes boring. You yearn for more.

I mean I guess if all you care about is 3D action games with voice acted cutscenes I can see your point. But uhh... I don't. At all.

Cross Code, Hollow Knight, Starsector, Factorio, Monster Sanctuary are all games that look great, have good music, and have plenty of scale, rich mechanics and style. Shadow Empire makes all the paradox games look like the shallow end of the kiddie pool. Stardew Valley was aping a game from over 30 years ago and crushed the fucking market with it's very simple 2D graphics, as did Terraria and Rimworld.

If you must have something 3D you can look at Troubleshooter, which is excellent as well and utterly curb stomps anything AAA has tried to do in it's genre since... FFT? Against the Storm is excellent in the city builder genre, Risk of Rain 2 and Warframe have been the only shooters that have ever kept my attention for more than an afternoon or two, Synthetik is an amazing twinstick shooter, Kenshi is pretty amazing for an open world sandbox.

Yeah, occasionally I'll have an itch for a particular sort of spectacle only a fuckton of money can scratch, like Monster Hunter or a Fromsoft title. But if you feel like indies are samey or lacking in anything but graphics and VA, you're living under a rock.

 

[Ezekiel]

Even if you had true AI middleware allowing a small team churn out current year AAA quality production values...

You don't need AAA production values for incline, that's your first mistake

Yeah, people act like production values of 20 years ago are unacceptable, when they're totally fine for anything short of a glorified movie- and glorified movies are shit anyways. Art direction trumps production values for visual appeal every time.

Indies don't have production values from 20 years ago. No indie is making games with the animations, music, polish, scale, voice acting, rich mechanics and style of Resident Evil 4, Metal Gear Solid 3, The Wind Waker, Devil May Cry 3, Shadow of the Colossus, God of War, Okami, Super Mario Sunshine, Max Payne 2 and so many others. (I don't mean all for each, but a lot of different expensive elements that combine into a satisfying whole, so relax!) In fact, indies are trapped in this awkward middle where the hardware is so far ahead of what they can afford to put in the game that the whole thing feels cheaper and more vacuous. I'm happy that we have indies, but the lack of anything else becomes boring. You yearn for more.

I mean I guess if all you care about is 3D action games with voice acted cutscenes I can see your point. But uhh... I don't. At all.

Cross Code, Hollow Knight, Starsector, Factorio, Monster Sanctuary are all games that look great, have good music, and have plenty of scale, rich mechanics and style. Shadow Empire makes all the paradox games look like the shallow end of the kiddie pool. Stardew Valley was aping a game from over 30 years ago and crushed the fucking market with it's very simple 2D graphics, as did Terraria and Rimworld.

If you must have something 3D you can look at Troubleshooter, which is excellent as well and utterly curb stomps anything AAA has tried to do in it's genre since... FFT? Against the Storm is excellent in the city builder genre, Risk of Rain 2 and Warframe have been the only shooters that have ever kept my attention for more than an afternoon or two, Synthetik is an amazing twinstick shooter, Kenshi is pretty amazing for an open world sandbox.

Yeah, occasionally I'll have an itch for a particular sort of spectacle only a fuckton of money can scratch, like Monster Hunter or a Fromsoft title. But if you feel like indies are samey or lacking in anything but graphics and VA, you're living under a rock.

I don't just care about those, but that was 2003 to '05 and you said twenty years. Even when I consider my last game, Spyro the Dragon (1998), I don't see indies doing something like that, or they're few and very far between. Most indie music is much more ambient, bodies are more rigid and only some have the scale.

 

[Ezekiel]

Speaking of remakes and Spyro, I did this yesterday and then had a look at the same level in the remake. It's gaudy. I have no idea why there are enough players who prefer the more literal/showy over the impression of an idea in the original that this would get made and then sell well. Simplicity of original was more surreal and charming. The dragon also looks somehow more rigid. Think it's because his legs are more tucked in.

 

[NecroLord]

They should start a new company called Re Entertainment (or alternatively Reeeeeeeeentertainment) and just churn out shite after shite after shite

shameful lack of originality and new IPs, it was never this bad

I figured by now that making completely original and new IPs is a risky proposition for Triple A companies who are generally averse to taking risks and losing money...

Indie is the future.
For example, the guy who made both Fear and Hunger games.
Original horror (with jrpg elements) IP, though he was inspired by horror movies and popular culture elements (also finnish folklore, since the guy is from Finland).

Remakes/remasters are just cashgrabs. It is easy to "resurrect" and make more accessible an old IP than create something completely new, as that takes creativity and risk taking, something which game developers seriously lack nowadays.

 

[Damned Registrations]

This is fable, from 2004.

Original monster hunter, same year.

SMT Nocturne, 2003. Not even an action game, a fucking turn based jrpg that should by rights have much better visuals.

This is a modern indie action game:


What part of this isn't high enough production value compared to what was listed above?

 

[Butter]

Oh sure, things like the MS/xbawks blob absorbing every fucking thing around with no rhyme or reason are likely to collapse eventually. But that just means the survivors of an AAA crash are going to be even more risk averse, possibly only in the financial area (acquisition sprees like Embracer and MS, starting a ton of project with cheap debt just because interest rates were low and then shitcanning them and panic cost cutting to pay debt etc.). Whoever is left is going to play safe, and it's just going to be the same stale shit for 10-20 years until the next generation comes in, thinks old timers were too cautious and full of "youthful" hubris just repeats the same stupid patterns.

There's a difference between publishers playing it safe, and developers playing it safe. Publishers writing checks for 300 million dollars is them not playing it safe at all. If and when they decide to start giving reasonable budgets again, it will embolden developers to start taking chances because there's less financial risk. Essentially, publisher risk and developer risk are inversely correlated.

Of course, none of that matters when developers are still creatively bankrupt and incompetent and ideologically committed to pushing garbage.

 

[Valestein]

Remasterings are nothing new.

Oh, come on! You show one game and act like it's always been like this, as if videos games were being remade left and right during the SNES. What is your point even?

That's two, and there's more if you look into the various remakes of the original Castlevania (Which is what Super Castlevania "4" was) or remake-sequels like Super Metroid. Although back then it was more about churning out sequels like Mega Man than remakes or remasters.

 

[Sigourn]

I can't be the only one who notices luj1's thread are all about "modern gaming is bad", right?
Talk about something new or insightful for a change ffs.

 

[Ezekiel]

This is fable, from 2004.

Original monster hunter, same year.

SMT Nocturne, 2003. Not even an action game, a fucking turn based jrpg that should by rights have much better visuals.

This is a modern indie action game:


What part of this isn't high enough production value compared to what was listed above?

We're severely short of good third person shooters, and the indie devs almost always go for first person view because it's cheaper and easier. A game like this, about slaying monsters, would have benefited from good melee mechanics mixed in, which are usually better in third person.

 

[Ezekiel]

Roll your eyes, but it's true. Almost all 3D indie action games in which you control a person are in first person view. Boring.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Melee focused game then:



Haven't played it, but had a team of 24 people and biggest complaint seems to be the writing. Which was probably still better than Fable or whatever ~2004 bethesda game (Oblivion?) had.

You can't tell me the above two games wouldn't have sold like fucking hotcakes if they released in 2004.

Edit: After a quick browse of the souls-like tag, throw in Sifu, Little Witch Nobetta and Lies of P. There's no doubt 3 times more than that, but the genre doesn't interest me enough to keep track of like I do with roguelikes or strategy games.

 

[Ezekiel]

Melee focused game then:



Haven't played it, but had a team of 24 people and biggest complaint seems to be the writing. Which was probably still better than Fable or whatever ~2004 bethesda game (Oblivion?) had.

You can't tell me the above two games wouldn't have sold like fucking hotcakes if they released in 2004.

I thought this thread was about indie devs making more original games or ones that stand out from the AAA slop. Watching this video shows me that even the indies are copying Souls now, including the retarded dodge roll. Dodging is so overdone now, reducing the importance of the foot movement that's supposed to be so vital in martial arts and that makes fights feel so active. Not much point in finding your spacing and the best position like in Streets of Rage 2 when the button needs to be used to invincibility frame through the attacks anyway.

Camera locks behind the character again (blinding them) and, let me guess, it's done with R3. You can surely customize the controls, but of course there is no hold option for the lock-on. They never put one in, because they don't understand the older system, where strafing is just built in even when there is no target, allowing you to move defensively before you see them and after they are defeated. Might have had some directional attacks with Z-targeting, like the thrust and upward swing of Devil May Cry and what older Zelda did. Impossible with R3 or this modern locking system remapped to another button with no hold option. Well, DmC and Soulstice players can double-tap the stick towards the enemy in order to thrust, but that's a recipe for screw-ups. The former has no lock-on and the latter uses that shitty R3 button. Soulstice also has so much happening on the screen that it's hard to even notice the lock symbol (and know that it's active without the cam also locking behind the character).

You probably switch targets like in Souls as well. Zelda dropped the locking of the camera behind the player while targeting as soon as there was a second stick, in The Wind Waker, because it sucked. I would rather strafe while controlling the cam, switching to the other frontward target with perhaps L3, like in Devil May Cry. Drawback of not being able to choose between left and rightward targets is less than the lack of visibility and locking out of camera controls that causes players to keep falling and backing into walls. If you want to disengage the lock for a look, you can't even do that without potentially turning your back to the enemy.

Looks like there's an estus flask equivalent whose animation you have to find windows.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Whatever. I'm going to go play poschengband. Enjoy your graphics whoring.

 

[Ezekiel]

Whatever. I'm going to go play poschengband. Enjoy your graphics whoring.

She dodged in time and was still hit. I blame FromSoftware, indirectly. Goes back to what I said about the dodge being so overused in new games that devs no longer focus on spacing and positioning. We've all seen the GIFs of this happening in Souls games and experienced it ourselves.