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Codex Review RPG Codex Review: Kingdom Come: Deliverance

Wesp5

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
1,805
What annoyed me the most about KCD was the endless loading when you talk to somebody!
What hardware you've got? On my Samsung 960 Pro there's only a one-second black screen after pressing the Talk key.

Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050, also even a second black screen kills immersion a lot. I can't remember any other first person RPG doing this!
 

SlamDunk

Arcane
Joined
Nov 20, 2006
Messages
3,081
Location
Khorinis
Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050
Is the game installed on a HDD? That makes a huge difference for the worse in KCD. Compared to a HDD, a modern M.2 NVMe SSD brings a whole host of speed improvements into the game.

I got quickly used to the one-second delay. It has never really bothered me.
 

Paul_cz

Arcane
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
2,023
Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050, also even a second black screen kills immersion a lot. I can't remember any other first person RPG doing this!

You need SSD and better hardware.
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.
It's funny how the game runs on Cryengine while Cryengine was never intended to do around 95% of things that KCD does.
 

Wesp5

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
1,805
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.

Okay, still weird that most other RPGs do not need to do this, even if their NPCs were doing other things before...
 
Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
5,293
What annoyed me the most about KCD was the endless loading when you talk to somebody! What use is an open seamless world looking so great if any personal interaction will kick you right out of the immersion with a black loading screen...

As others have mentioned, I think it's an SSD issue. I have an SSD drive, and never takes more than a second to load.

First, thank you for the review.
But since when having the mods make the game better from reviewer standpoint? You say "combat press X to win", and then "but hey, there is a mod for that, so everything is fine". With such logic every reviewer can turn "skyrim is a shallow game" into "but hey, there are mods for every aspect of it, so 10/10".
Also for some reason you didn't mention another turning down point for many people - the ending.

My point of view regarding mods and reviews is this: I am willing to give games better reviews if they can be modded up within reason (that is say 3-4 mods but not 30-100), because ultimately, reviews are not about punishing/rewarding devs, in my opinion, but rather about pointing out great games to play to the players. If game A can be amazing with a couple of mods, why NOT let people know that it's amazing? You might disagree, but that's how I feel. The problem with something like Skyrim is that it is so all-around bad, that pretty much everything must be modded out, which makes it no longer about modding but replacement.

As far as the ending, shitty endings in RPGs are such a common thing, that I don't even bother anymore. After all, if you spend 100-200 hours having fun, so what if the last one sucks.
 

Black Angel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
2,910
Location
Wonderland
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.

Okay, still weird that most other RPGs do not need to do this, even if their NPCs were doing other things before...
Really? I can't remember any other RPGs where you can speak with a character while they're, say, drinking or eating, or carrying a bucket of wood, or carrying a bag of grains, etc etc. It doesn't happen in KCD, which is why as has been explained the black screens are necessary to 'set up' the NPCs for conversations with Henry. Meanwhile, Bloodlines and Gamebryo-based Bethesda games (including New Vegas) has the advantage of NPCs immediately stopping whatever they're doing and the camera zooming in right towards their face. I think Skyrim is their only game where conversations can immediately happen even if an NPC is chopping a wood and they don't stop their activities, for example, but.... eugh.... Skyrim
yuck.gif


Oh, and I vaguely remember in Gothic games, you could pretty much initiate conversations with NPCs without it fading into a black screen even when they're doing something, and it has more or less the same dialogue format with KCD (cinematic-esque, camera shifting focus between the characters), but the Gothic games are in full 3rd person, and it's also WAY ahead its time.
 

Smejki

Larian Studios, ex-Warhorse
Developer
Joined
Oct 22, 2012
Messages
710
Location
Belgistan
Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050, also even a second black screen kills immersion a lot. I can't remember any other first person RPG doing this!

You need SSD and better hardware.
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.
It's funny how the game runs on Cryengine while Cryengine was never intended to do around 95% of things that KCD does.
It hides the NPC and spawns in a copy of the original NPC. This twin NPC unfortunately has to be re-initialized (loading in assets, recomputing their clothing, starting over their brains etc.) which takes some time.
 

Wesp5

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
1,805
This twin NPC unfortunately has to be re-initialized (loading in assets, recomputing their clothing, starting over their brains etc.) which takes some time.

Can it be that this is true for the player too? Because very often he did wear different things than in the rest of the game. Or has this been fixed now?
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,735
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050, also even a second black screen kills immersion a lot. I can't remember any other first person RPG doing this!

You need SSD and better hardware.
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.
It's funny how the game runs on Cryengine while Cryengine was never intended to do around 95% of things that KCD does.
It hides the NPC and spawns in a copy of the original NPC. This twin NPC unfortunately has to be re-initialized (loading in assets, recomputing their clothing, starting over their brains etc.) which takes some time.

Ugh that's a terrible kludge. Will you be coming up with a better solution for your next game?
 

SlamDunk

Arcane
Joined
Nov 20, 2006
Messages
3,081
Location
Khorinis
Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050, also even a second black screen kills immersion a lot. I can't remember any other first person RPG doing this!

You need SSD and better hardware.
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.
It's funny how the game runs on Cryengine while Cryengine was never intended to do around 95% of things that KCD does.
It hides the NPC and spawns in a copy of the original NPC. This twin NPC unfortunately has to be re-initialized (loading in assets, recomputing their clothing, starting over their brains etc.) which takes some time.

Ugh that's a terrible kludge. Will you be coming up with a better solution for your next game?
I was going to ask just that. Imagine The Final Act having seamless transitions into conversations with NPCs. Doesn't Red Dead Redemption 2 have that?
 
Last edited:

Smejki

Larian Studios, ex-Warhorse
Developer
Joined
Oct 22, 2012
Messages
710
Location
Belgistan
Intel i5 3.00 GHz and NVIDIA Geforce 1050, also even a second black screen kills immersion a lot. I can't remember any other first person RPG doing this!

You need SSD and better hardware.
Smejki explained the need for those blackscreens here on codex in KCD thread. From what I remember it has to do with the fact that the NPCs can be talked to wherever they are (since they have lives) doing any kind of thing (since they have jobs/hobbies) and so the game has to "prepare" the dialogue scene from whatever the NPC was doing before player started the interaction.
It's funny how the game runs on Cryengine while Cryengine was never intended to do around 95% of things that KCD does.
It hides the NPC and spawns in a copy of the original NPC. This twin NPC unfortunately has to be re-initialized (loading in assets, recomputing their clothing, starting over their brains etc.) which takes some time.

Ugh that's a terrible kludge. Will you be coming up with a better solution for your next game?
It's certainly among our priorities.
 
Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
5,293
This is old news (about big battles). Yeah, that never made it in. If you saw the performance on my pretty good gaming rig during the Battle of Prisbyslavitz (roughly 50 combatants total maybe), there is no way in hell CryEngine can support really large battles on modern hardware.

There is another aspects of it though: In a really large battle, a single combatant matters very little, so it would have to be compeltely scripted in terms of outcome.
 

Crescent Hawk

Cipher
Joined
Jul 10, 2014
Messages
645
Mount and blade already gives a good picture for that. If Bannerlord allows bigger shit it will be even better.
 

deama

Prophet
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
4,532
Location
UK
I agree with some of the broad strokes of the review, the scope/ambition and world building are some of the biggest pluses in the game. Largely unrivaled even.

I think everything about the combat description is overblown. What's bad about it is not as bad as presented and what's good about it is not as good as presented.

For example I found the intricate combo system largely pointless. For one thing it's a pain in the ass to remember which combos start at which point so you're constantly looking it up. The helpers aren't helpful enough and looking up the combos in your dex is a pain in the ass. Further once you do memorize a few favorites you really don't feel under-prepared or any strong desire to learn more. The game doesn't demand it of you. It's a system without a purpose. Maybe masterstrikes contribute to trivializing the combos but I don't think that's it even mostly.

(The only mod of the ones mentioned I used when playing was the removal of slow-mo parry, because that was such a mind mindbogglingly stupid thing to not have a toggle for)

The big thing the review only hints at though is the flow of the game really can be a problem. Particularly at the start of the game, I really HAAATED the post-tutorial intro sequence and almost quit playing. It takes forever, its super railroaded and uses cheap tricks to keep you on rails. Also the review doesn't even note one of the worst quests in the history of all quests, the monastery infiltration quest. Pure gameplay cancer. Also I disagree that there are no fetch quests, there are some. Not enough to make anyone go crazy over it but they are there (the game calls them activities not quests, but they are effectively quests optional though they are). But I do agree that the major side quests and such are interesting and well done.
I donno what you mean about the monestary being the worst quest; I was so good at sneaking I just stole everything until I took what I needed and just ran out.
 
Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
5,293
I would say play the main game, then if you enjoy it, buy the DLCs. None of them dramatically change the experience or anything, most just add some extra content.
 

xuerebx

Erudite
Joined
Aug 20, 2008
Messages
1,005
Thanks. Unless they're heavily discounted I can do without the DLCs then.
 

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