Review RPG Codex Review: Pillars of Eternity, by Decado

[kazgar]

C'mon everyone, 82 more pages and this one can catch up to Darth Roxor

Err

I for one think this is the better of the 2 POE reviews and probably be better then the third or fourth one so we should definitely print it out on flayed human skin parchment and send it to Obsidian for framing.

I mean

What a load of rubbish, Decado couldn't write his way out of a paper bag!

or how about

This is a fair and balanced review, when I pause, I feel like its points are made in real and timely fashion.

 

[Crescent Hawk]

I just want Obsidian to pump more rpgs before turning into blizzard with Armored Warfare. PoE is a decent game, but they can do better. If rpgs of PoE quality were frequent I would be happy.

Damn it I want more.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

For various reasons I've stayed uninvolved in almost everything related to PoE (everywhere, not just the Codex) but then I noticed this thread and decided to take a good look.

Most of what I'll be saying here comes with a disclaimer of Probably Talking Out Of My Ass since I've not played PoE, not read either of the "official Codex reviews" and am jumping into the Drama Wars somewhere in the middle of episode 4, it seems. But even from this "outside" vantage point, something smells really funky about all of this.

Darth Roxor has written (at least) two reviews (that I know of) which do precisely what is expected of the Codex: To take RPGs apart. Yes, he often prefers using his teeth and bare hands rather than using fancy words, beating around the bush and discussing trivial matters back and forth with surgical precision. One would expect that anyone assigning him a review of a game that should not be slammed should have made sure beforehand that the game can take a beating, so to say. I'm sensing that this is not the case, that RPG Codex Staff screwed up and now there's damage control and backpedaling and disinformation being spread everywhere to cover that up, and doubly so on the internal drama amongst the staff.

People here have been wailing on Decado for his review, which I find kinda odd considering that his review is not the real problem, but the obvious show of force behind its creation. That's the elephant in the room, that's your target.

 

[Alex]

I am literally laughing out loud at the idea a link hidden in a list of like 100 games is a "spotlight".

But are you actually laughing?

By the way, I thought you guys would have had enough of PoE by now...

 

[Ninjerk]

For various reasons I've stayed uninvolved in almost everything related to PoE (everywhere, not just the Codex) but then I noticed this thread and decided to take a good look.

Most of what I'll be saying here comes with a disclaimer of Probably Talking Out Of My Ass since I've not played PoE, not read either of the "official Codex reviews" and am jumping into the Drama Wars somewhere in the middle of episode 4, it seems. But even from this "outside" vantage point, something smells really funky about all of this.

Darth Roxor has written (at least) two reviews (that I know of) which do precisely what is expected of the Codex: To take RPGs apart. Yes, he often prefers using his teeth and bare hands rather than using fancy words, beating around the bush and discussing trivial matters back and forth with surgical precision. One would expect that anyone assigning him a review of a game that should not be slammed should have made sure beforehand that the game can take a beating, so to say. I'm sensing that this is not the case, that RPG Codex Staff screwed up and now there's damage control and backpedaling and disinformation being spread everywhere to cover that up, and doubly so on the internal drama amongst the staff.

People here have been wailing on Decado for his review, which I find kinda odd considering that his review is not the real problem, but the obvious show of force behind its creation. That's the elephant in the room, that's your target.

No, everything is fine. Nacht der langen Rezension is at hand.

 

[tuluse]

But are you actually laughing?

By the way, I thought you guys would have had enough of PoE by now...

Literally and actually, but it was really more like this than anything hearty.

Also, I was almost assuredly done by the time you read the post.

 

[Cadmus]

We only picked this review because of all the massive butthurt and OUTRAGE it would cause...

good job, why don't you cause more butthurt by re-reviewing Dragon Age 2 and giving it 10/10, that would show those stupid nerds, he he!
Or ahha ahahha better yet, do something like, delete some discussion threads, you will cause so much butthurt, veri gud troll!

 

[Sceptic]

Darth Roxor has written (at least) two reviews (that I know of) which do precisely what is expected of the Codex: To take RPGs apart. Yes, he often prefers using his teeth and bare hands rather than using fancy words, beating around the bush and discussing trivial matters back and forth with surgical precision. One would expect that anyone assigning him a review of a game that should not be slammed should have made sure beforehand that the game can take a beating, so to say. I'm sensing that this is not the case, that RPG Codex Staff screwed up and now there's damage control and backpedaling and disinformation being spread everywhere to cover that up, and doubly so on the internal drama amongst the staff.

You're actually completely wrong. Nobody asked Roxor to write a review, there was never any screwup. Roxor volunteered to write the review by himself, he did, and then when the drama over its publication erupted DU stepped in and published it. Then Decado wrote another review and it was published. There was no backpedaling, the person/people opposed to Roxor's review were against it since the beginning.

 

[Sensuki]

Man it would have been so good to read that discussion.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

good job, why don't you cause more butthurt by re-reviewing Dragon Age 2 and giving it 10/10, that would show those stupid nerds, he he!
Or ahha ahahha better yet, do something like, delete some discussion threads, you will cause so much butthurt, veri gud troll!

Well, there's Konjad's quickie with Dragon Age 2.

 

[FeelTheRads]

We only picked this review because of all the massive butthurt and OUTRAGE it would cause...

As opposed to Roxor's review that caused butthurt among the staff too? Or you were butthurting each other with that one?

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Man, don't want to start a butthurt war

ah, the sweet innocence of page 2

 

[Drowed]

The truth is that POE is just not *that* good. It's not a bad game, it's just not the amazing and wonderful game that everyone expected it to be. Especially when you expect it to please everyone. The secret is: POE didn't do it, neither would Baldur's Gate. I can say that, by far, I had much more fun playing POE than both BGs. The magic system and the items are undoubtedly better at BG. But... Well, it pretty much ends there. 95% of the encounters are summarized in prebuffing and "dancing" with the characters attracting enemies while the mages and ranged PCs destroy them. (Aka, kiting, which in essence is something completely ridiculous to see and do.)

In fact, the Baldur's Gate itself would be destroyed, possibly much more violently than POE was if it were released today. Hell, even Fallout would be criticized by many. It's essentially a matter of expectations, and I have the perfect example: Shadowrun. SRR is a good game, but in almost all aspects, it's simpler than POE (simple characters, almost no inventory management, fewer classes variations, simpler story), but looking at the general reaction here, it seems like it was better received.

Why?

Because what everyone expected from it was an improved tablet game. And then, the game surprised most people. The thing is that everyone expected POE to be the redemption of RPGs, and it was just a "normal good game".
There is no greater sin.

 

[Orion]

Nothing stands out or rises above the ambient mediocrity in POE. Nothing feels like it's been crafted with love or imagination. To me that is far worse than not meeting too high expectations.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

You're actually completely wrong. Nobody asked Roxor to write a review, there was never any screwup. Roxor volunteered to write the review by himself, he did, and then when the drama over its publication erupted DU stepped in and published it. Then Decado wrote another review and it was published. There was no backpedaling, the person/people opposed to Roxor's review were against it since the beginning.

Thanks for the (over)correction, but it doesn't really change anything I wrote, does it? People on staff were opposed to Roxor's review, steps were taken to try to oppose it (and him) and then they got overruled. For the lulz, I guess.

Now we have two divides: One between the staff and the admins, and another between the staff and the rest of the Codex. The staff have painted themselves into a corner. It's clear as day that it's time to reorganize the staff, sort this mess out.

I'm probably stating the obvious here and arriving far too late to the *party*, but there you go.

 

[DeepOcean]

The truth is that POE is just not *that* good. It's not a bad game, it's just not the amazing and wonderful game that everyone expected it to be. Especially when you expect it to please everyone. The secret is: POE didn't do it, neither would Baldur's Gate. I can say that, by far, I had much more fun playing POE than both BGs.

Well, you say PoE isn't that good then you say that is better than both BGs, then you say BGs combat is just dancing as if tanking dumb melee hordes over and over is better. Nigga, Baldur's Gate was released 20 years ago and was the first RPG Bioware ever did, obvious if it was released today would be criticized and please trying to minimize the credit of other games to make PoE look better isn't a convincing argument for the merit of the game. If PoE was good and not comatose boring as it is, people wouldn't compare it so much with 20 year old games.

About shadowrun, it was criticized as fuck when DMS was released because it was a tablet game and only with the release of Dragonfall HBS somewhat redeemed themselves and most people that play it think the game is "nice" but hardly is codex top 10 material , the game was well received because it was a proof that HBS is willing to improve as the game is drastically better than DMS and if Hong Kong keep the tendency of radical improvement over Dragonfall, it will be a good RPG.

If Obsidian wanted to release a mediocre game, they shouldn't paint themselves on a corner and arrogantly claiming they would "fix" the IE games... the "fix" Obsidian did is like you having an old car that has its problems but works but you want an improvement on the performance, so you give it to a mechanic for him to improve its performance and what you get back was your car but they changed all the insides and placed an eletric engine that runs like shit, worse than your old car, because the mechanic was a radical pro green activist and that was better for you and the enviroment.

 

[Cadmus]

Nothing stands out or rises above the ambient mediocrity in POE. Nothing feels like it's been crafted with love or imagination. To me that is far worse than not meeting too high expectations.

I think the environments and the visuals in general show lots of love and attention to detail. I don't remember the last game I played with the maps like these. I guess that's all though.

 

[tuluse]

Shadowrun games don't have trash mobs or random loot tables

 

[AMG]

Yeah, they don't have any loot at all .

 

[Ninjerk]

Nothing stands out or rises above the ambient mediocrity in POE. Nothing feels like it's been crafted with love or imagination. To me that is far worse than not meeting too high expectations.

The music was pretty decent, too. It stayed out of that "jingle-like" quality that the Baldur's Gate games had.

 

[Sensuki]

BG1 music > PE music

 

[Weirdstuffinspace]

Your review made MCA leave Obsidian.

 

[Decado]

Well now I feel bad.

 

[Drowed]

Well, you say PoE isn't that good (...)

Because it isn't.

(...) then you say that is better than both BGs

It is.

then you say BGs combat is just dancing as if tanking dumb melee hordes over and over is better.

It's about the same level of retardation. But I did not say POE was better than BG because of the combat.

(...) please trying to minimize the credit of other games to make PoE look better isn't a convincing argument for the merit of the game.

Better to what?

If PoE was good and not comatose boring as it is, people wouldn't compare it so much with 20 year old games.

Like, what, every comparison made by someone here? Or do you have any suggestions for games made in the last 5-10 years to which you would use as a comparison?

People make comparisons with these games because, even today, they are considered "timeless classics", the summit of the genre, regardless of the time they were made. For many, there is no game made in the last 20 years that even deserves the title of "RPG" - so what other comparison you expect to see? Yet the irony is that these same games are full of faults and problems; in many ways, they're worse than many RPGs released in recent years. But few would dare say this for themselves, let alone acknowledge publicly here.

If Obsidian wanted to release a mediocre game, they shouldn't paint themselves on a corner and arrogantly claiming they would "fix" the IE games...

True. Even if they did "fix" the horrible companions, the poorly-written dialogue, the weak story and the strange/retarded movement of PCs with that horrible pathfinding and stuttering.

They just "forgot" in their quest for balance(tm) that the reason that led many to like the BG series is the passion for D&D and its mechanics, the fighting and itemization. POE isn't a game for combat fans. The funny thing is that neither is BG, but that's what, even today, leads many to like the series. Strange, indeed.

(Especially since if you take away the combat from the BG series, what's left?)

 

[Answermancer]

People here have been wailing on Decado for his review, which I find kinda odd considering that his review is not the real problem, but the obvious show of force behind its creation. That's the elephant in the room, that's your target.

I don't think I'll ever understand why so many people on the internet are so fond of conspiracy theories. I guess, statistically, a ton of people must be fond of them in "real life" too, I've just had the good fortune to not interact with them much.

Infinitron linked the exact genesis of Decado's review about a page ago: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...illars-of-eternity.98676/page-46#post-3878068

This is fresh in my mind since I basically just lurk here and sometimes don't come around for a month or two, so I just got around to reading that thread last week and I distinctly remember seeing that post and wondering if he would actually write a review and if we'd end up with 3 or what would happen with VD's (oh and I'm still only halfway through that thread, by the way, holy fuck you people wrote a lot). If you actually look at the thread, Inifinitron even says right after "yeah you can write a review, but we're already gonna have 2 and your time might be better spent on one of the upcoming games." That hardly seems to me like a grand plot to engineer a snuggly-cuddly-feelgood review.

So like pretty much all conspiracy theories, I roll my eyes at this one, but I'm sure you'll tell me how those posts are just a ruse and jet fuel can't melt steel doritos.

Full disclosure to preempt or enhance your tin foil: I liked PoE and even finished it (I finish maybe 5% of the games I play), and also backed it for a considerable sum of monies. I also don't like this review very much for the reasons that Tigranes has excellently outlined in this thread.