Vapourware Scam Citizen - Only people with too much money can become StarCitizens! WOULD YOU LIKE TO KNOW MORE?

[Blaine]

It's always been the case, now more so than ever. In fact quad SLI GTX 680s, 32 GB of RAM, a 1 TB SSD, and an i5 or i7 Ivy Bridge CPU will be many times more powerful than the upcoming generation of consoles, and quite likely half-again or twice as powerful as the generation after next.

 

[Morgoth]

I doubt there will be a generation after next.

 

[tuluse]

"Essentially, I can build a high-end PC now that's much more powerful than the new consoles that will be announced this year."

When hasn't this been the case?

I'm not sure, but multicore processors for mainstream weren't available in 2005 yet? The first Core 2 Duo was released in 2006 I think.

Core 2 Due was available in 2006, but the Pentium D was available in 2005.

That said, the Xbox, Xbox 360, and PS3 all used GPUs that just finished development and weren't available to customers yet.

 

[Blaine]

The pledge counter on the Roberts Space Industries website will soon tick over to $8m, but coupled with the $2.1m they raised on Kickstarter, Star Citizen has already raised over $10m (before fees, taxes, and the middlemen's cut).

There hasn't been any genuinely new information about the actual game in the past couple of months—only a series of in-house fan fiction, fan spotlights, "meet the developer" interviews, Wingman's Hangar episodes (I quite frankly can't stand that loud, annoying hog of a man), and Citizen's Card updates.

 

[Jaesun]

That is a LOT of booze and hookers.

Hope he has a good time.

 

[Elthosian]

The pledge counter on the Roberts Space Industries website will soon tick over to $8m, but coupled with the $2.1m they raised on Kickstarter, Star Citizen has already raised over $10m (before fees, taxes, and the middlemen's cut)..

Correct me if I am wrong but, didn't they add the Kickstarter's monies to the website's pledge counter some time ago?

 

[Blaine]

Correct me if I am wrong but, didn't they add the Kickstarter's monies to the website's pledge counter some time ago?

You're right. It's been so damned long I'd forgotten, and I additionally failed to read the fine print, because I'm so used to glancing at the homepage at this juncture.

In any case, the total just ticked past $8m, which reminds me of something: If people in general weren't so painfully stupid, shortsighted, and self-centered (in two distinct ways which I'll describe in the next paragraph), Kickstarter projects would ideally leave all pledge options available on their own websites throughout development—with the exception of items that are by their very nature limited in quantity, such as handmade physical extras, original concept art, naming an NPC after your cat, and so on.

This can't happen (or if it does, you won't know about it until after the crowdfunding campaign) for two closely related reasons: 1.) If people realize in advance that full pledge options will be available for the next year or three, many of them will wait until the last minute years down the road to pledge; and 2.) The concept of securing limited-availability bonuses that latecomers won't get appeals to many, encouraging them to pledge early and generously in order to one-up the noobs.

All of this is fairly self-evident, and hoping for anything else is wishful thinking, but it still pisses me off. These arbitrary pledge limitations are unnecessary and ultimately detrimental to everyone.

 

[Sunsetspawn]

Depends on the range and what you use to detect. If you have passive sensors you're limited by the speed of light unless you detect tachyons or some superluminal phenomenon that a warship makes. However the smart way to attack (even if you have FTL jump drives or whatever, unless you can jump on top of the guy) would be to get on a trajectory towards your target as far away from it as possible. You accelerate at something like an AU or more from the target, preferably hiding the heat by burning engines behind a celestial body and just surf with all engines off until you reach the target. Only way to detect the ship would be to actually spot it, which would probably happen minutes before the attack itself at best.

Wouldn't the act of having burned the engines make the ship in question "hotter," and therefore easier to see because it would be emitting infrared radiation? To an IR camera that shit would look like a christmas tree against the background of space.
Or not, I haven't put much thought into it. I was under the impression that in a vacuum heat dissipated much more slowly than in an atmosphere because there aren't less energetic molecules surrounding the more energetic ones to absorb the energy. This would leave only thermal radiation as the method of heat trans...
oh dear, I've gone cross eyed.
All I know is my car engine be hot for hours after I turn that shit off tho, son.

That is a LOT of booze and hookers.

Hope he has a good time.

I'm imagining Roberts clapping his hands and exclaiming, "Bitches, show Charlie Murphy your titties!"

 

[Haba]

Oh god... Repeat after me: There is no stealth in space. There is no stealth in space. There is no stealth in space.

No. There is no stealth.

Rd = 13.4 * sqrt(A) * T2

 

[Hellraiser]

Wouldn't the act of having burned the engines make the ship in question "hotter," and therefore easier to see because it would be emitting infrared radiation? To an IR camera that shit would look like a christmas tree against the background of space.
Or not, I haven't put much thought into it. I was under the impression that in a vacuum heat dissipated much more slowly than in an atmosphere because there aren't less energetic molecules surrounding the more energetic ones to absorb the energy. This would leave only thermal radiation as the method of heat trans...
oh dear, I've gone cross eyed.
All I know is my car engine be hot for hours after I turn that shit off tho, son.

That's actually correct, only way to get rid off the heat would be to radiate it into space, there's also the problem of the sun heating up the vessel as well. If we're assuming there is a thermal power source running 24/7 on the craft (like a reactor of any kind) you get even more problems. IR sensors would be the way to go.

 

[J_C]

Oh god... Repeat after me: There is no stealth in space. There is no stealth in space. There is no stealth in space.

No. There is no stealth.

Rd = 13.4 * sqrt(A) * T2

Why? Actually I'm really interested in this.

 

[Misconnected]

Why? Actually I'm really interested in this.

Stealth ultimately is about making the object indistinguishable from its environment. In other words; the environment requires features that can be matched or which can mask the object. Space is basically featureless.

 

[J_C]

Why? Actually I'm really interested in this.

Stealth ultimately is about making the object indistinguishable from its environment. In other words; the environment requires features that can be matched or which can mask the object. Space is basically featureless.

But this is only for optical stealth. The fighter jets for example use radar waves for detection (and presumably space fighters too). The stealth fighter's plating absorbs some of these waves, and/or makes it difficult for the wave to be reflected back to the attacking jet.

 

[Turisas]

Why? Actually I'm really interested in this.

Stealth ultimately is about making the object indistinguishable from its environment. In other words; the environment requires features that can be matched or which can mask the object. Space is basically featureless.

Yeah but what if you use a subspace phasing cloak. With, uh, inverted tetryon compositors and stuff...

 

[J_C]

Why? Actually I'm really interested in this.

Stealth ultimately is about making the object indistinguishable from its environment. In other words; the environment requires features that can be matched or which can mask the object. Space is basically featureless.

Yeah but what if you use a subspace phasing cloak. With, uh, inverted tetryon compositors and stuff...

That can't work because the flux emiiters are made from dark tyrium on the radars and that counters the phasing cloak's frequency. That causes the enemy to....ummm, OK I just go back to work now.

 

[Haba]

Rd = detection range (km)
A = spacecraft projected area (m2 )
T = surface temperature (Kelvin, room temperature is about 285-290 K)
If the ship is a convex shape, its projected area will be roughly one quarter of its surface area.

A Russian Oscar submarine is a cylinder 154 meters long and has a beam of 18 meters, which would be a good ballpark estimate of the size of an interplanetary warship. If it was nose on to you the surface area would be 250 square meters. If it was broadside the surface area would be approximately 2770. So on average the projected area would be 1510 square meters ([250 + 2770] / 2).

If the Oscar's crew was shivering at the freezing point, the maximum detection range of the frigid submarine would be 13.4 * sqrt(1510) * 2732 = 38,800,000 kilometers, about one hundred times the distance between the Earth and the Moon, or about 129 light-seconds. If the crew had a more comfortable room temperature, the Oscar could be seen from even farther away.

If you want to depress yourself even more, read here.

 

[J_C]

Rd = detection range (km)
A = spacecraft projected area (m2 )
T = surface temperature (Kelvin, room temperature is about 285-290 K)
If the ship is a convex shape, its projected area will be roughly one quarter of its surface area.

A Russian Oscar submarine is a cylinder 154 meters long and has a beam of 18 meters, which would be a good ballpark estimate of the size of an interplanetary warship. If it was nose on to you the surface area would be 250 square meters. If it was broadside the surface area would be approximately 2770. So on average the projected area would be 1510 square meters ([250 + 2770] / 2).

If the Oscar's crew was shivering at the freezing point, the maximum detection range of the frigid submarine would be 13.4 * sqrt(1510) * 2732 = 38,800,000 kilometers, about one hundred times the distance between the Earth and the Moon, or about 129 light-seconds. If the crew had a more comfortable room temperature, the Oscar could be seen from even farther away.

If you want to depress yourself even more, read here.

I get it. Well, lets just imagine that by the time space combat and interplanetary travel is possible, they will invent new materials and engines to use. Which solves the stealth problem.

 

[Tzaero]

This site has some speculation on space combat.
http://www.rocketpunk-manifesto.com/

I: The Gravity Well
II: Stealth Reconsidered
III: 'Warships' in Space
IV: Mobility
V: Laser Weapons
VI: Kinetics, Part 1
VII: Kinetics, Part 2 - The Killer Bus
VIII: Orbital Combat
IX: Could Everything We Know Be Wrong?
X: Moving Targets
XI: La Zona Fronteriza
XII: Surface Warfare

Space Fighters, Not
Space Fighters, Reconsidered?

Who knows maybe this guy is a codexer.
http://www.rocketpunk-manifesto.com/2011/05/liberalism-in-spaaace.html





And some other things of relevence.

http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/essay-on-realistic-space-combat-i-wrote.131056/

From Charles Stross' blog
http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2007/06/the-high-frontier-redux.html

 

[Haba]

I get it. Well, lets just imagine that by the time space combat and interplanetary travel is possible, they will invent new materials and engines to use. Which solves the stealth problem.

But... how?

If you have some super sciency material that blocks radiant energy from leaking outside, then where does all the excess heat you produce go? Your crewmen would be fried inside the ship.

And if you have engines that produce no heat, how does that...?

It isn't just about having new materials, it is also bout breaking the laws of thermodynamics. And if your science is able to do that... Well, let's just say that the ramification would be pretty fucking big.

 

[J_C]

I get it. Well, lets just imagine that by the time space combat and interplanetary travel is possible, they will invent new materials and engines to use. Which solves the stealth problem.

But... how?

If you have some super sciency material that blocks radiant energy from leaking outside, then where does all the excess heat you produce go? Your crewmen would be fried inside the ship.

And if you have engines that produce no heat, how does that...?

It isn't just about having new materials, it is also bout breaking the laws of thermodynamics. And if your science is able to do that... Well, let's just say that the ramification would be pretty fucking big.

Of course I don't know the answers for this, these things are not invented yet. As for engines, maybe they will use something which doesn't produce heat. Cold fusion or I don't know. Who knows, maybe in a 100 years we will break the laws of thermodynamics.

 

[mindx2]

Will you guys please get your science out of my space-sim please. I want to shoot things and go all Han Solo on the bad guys, not have a physics lesson!

 

[Misconnected]

But this is only for optical stealth.

That's language-fail. You don't have to be stealthy to avoid being seen by a blind man.

Stealth implies detection will happen unless the one doing the detection can somehow be tricked.

 

[Sunsetspawn]

Wouldn't the act of having burned the engines make the ship in question "hotter," and therefore easier to see because it would be emitting infrared radiation? To an IR camera that shit would look like a christmas tree against the background of space.
Or not, I haven't put much thought into it. I was under the impression that in a vacuum heat dissipated much more slowly than in an atmosphere because there aren't less energetic molecules surrounding the more energetic ones to absorb the energy. This would leave only thermal radiation as the method of heat trans...
oh dear, I've gone cross eyed.
All I know is my car engine be hot for hours after I turn that shit off tho, son.

That's actually correct, only way to get rid off the heat would be to radiate it into space, there's also the problem of the sun heating up the vessel as well. If we're assuming there is a thermal power source running 24/7 on the craft (like a reactor of any kind) you get even more problems. IR sensors would be the way to go.

Truth be told, I think recreating absurdly realistic space battles isn't good for video games. Freelancer is a little too derp, but I think Vega Strike does the genre will. Now if only Vega Strike could fix some of the issues with hostile ships. You can accelerate to absurd speeds in Vega Strike given a little time and afterburning, which is refreshingly realistic for the genre, but when you're doing 40kps towards a jump point figuring your velocity will keep you from being engaged, the stupid enemy AI finds a way to suicide crash into you at about double your velocity.
I'm rambling

 

[Blaine]

http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/thank-you/

Greetings Citizens,
It goes without saying that we were blown away by the response to the Aurora sale. In just one week, we raised over $700,000 for Star Citizen’s development and gained thousands of new supporters! We hope you all enjoyed the extra material released last week… there’s more to come! Today we’d like to clarify a few more issues and provide some information requested after last week’s poll.

Running total is currently: $9,476,833

They plan to have a 300i promotion of some kind soon in order to reach $10,000,000+. If anyone changes their mind and wants to pledge for an LTI ship, I can gift it to you at the original cost—just thought I'd mention it.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

As interested as I am I just have a hard time believing them when they say you can do everything. It's singleplayer! It's multiplayer! It's MMO! It's hosted moddable servers! It's Freelancer! It's Wing Commander! It's Firefly with ship interiors and multiple characters moving in a single ship running around doing things! It's Shattered Horizon with space suit combat! It has boarding actions! It has space stations with interiors! You can land on planets!

Sounds awesome as hell but it sounds too good to be true which scared me away from giving them money.