Shadow Empire - planetary conquest from Advanced Tactics/Decisive Campaigns dev

[Parsimonious cook]

Yes, I would.

 

[AgentFransis]

Would you recommend this at the full price?

Absolutely, it's a masterpiece.
But you don't have to since it's still on discount: https://www.matrixgames.com/game/shadow-empire

 

[Joggerino]

This is a great wargame IMO. The logistics system is great, the planet generation is interesting and adds a lot of variety. My only problem is that i believed there would be a stronger development aspect but this game is completely geared towards warfare. And the default start is extremely slow, i'd recommend starting with two zones and an OHQ per zone setting.

 

[L'ennui]

Just tried this after getting back into Advanced Tactics Gold and remembering how good this guy's games are (started with People's Tactics way back).

Wow, this is such a great package for sci-fi/post-apocalyptic wargaming! If someone makes a good mod based off of Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri, I'm afraid the game will simply take over my life.

I'm playing a pirated version, but I will buy it ASAP.

 

[sser]

Had this game on my radar forever -- have the turn cycles improved at all? In terms of how fast they process.

And can it be played in windowed mode, or on one monitor at full-screen windowed? Strange question I'm sure but as I've gotten older I have really started to enjoy games I can play on one screen while simultaneously working projects on another.

 

[dehimos]

It has improved, but it is still long. An option has been introduced, in the initial configuration, to limit the processing time.

It can be put in windowed mode, but you must modify a txt: https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4823262

 

[Beowulf]

It has improved, but it is still long. An option has been introduced, in the initial configuration, to limit the processing time.

It can be put in windowed mode, but you must modify a txt: https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4823262

You can switch between giving AI more time and faster turns mid-game.

 

[Aemar]

Portraits. Use this mod by our resident silly nose artist @dehimos.

Haha I installed that. This is way better than the original.

 

[madhouse]

I'm reading the lore section from this game's manual. This is some soulful, shitty, ESL high school tier writing.
I've never really played a game with military systems like this. How difficult is it to get into? I'm trying to finish up the manual and read whatever I can find in-game. Is it similar to HOI 3?

 

[AgentFransis]

Portraits. Use this mod by our resident silly nose artist @dehimos.

Haha I installed that. This is way better than the original.

I love how half of them look either very angry or supremely bored/no-sure-if-serious. It fits so well with the game.

I'm reading the lore section from this game's manual. This is some soulful, shitty, ESL high school tier writing.
I've never really played a game with military systems like this. How difficult is it to get into? I'm trying to finish up the manual and read whatever I can find in-game. Is it similar to HOI 3?

Not that difficult. It's very complex but it has a UI that actually tries to inform you unlike something like DF or Aurora and the manual is very comprehensive (though not 100% complete right now). Read it and play and you'll figure it out.

It shares some slight similarities with HOI in that this is a wargame and HOI is a watered down wargame, so you'll have fronts of infantry and tanks and do operational command etc. But obviously SE is turn based, has a different combat model and all other systems are very different.

 

[dehimos]

I love how half of them look either very angry or supremely bored/no-sure-if-serious. It fits so well with the game.

The best solution was that kind of eyes: anger and boredom represents the war. A professional can do better, but it was very difficult for me to place face-eyes-hair when each file has a different size (there are a couple of bugs with the wrinkles, but nothing weird).

 

[madhouse]

This game is brilliant.

 

[madhouse]

Spoiler

I've cut these cunts off of any supply for about 5 - 6 turns now. Troops being magically supplied with all supplies despite full envelopement for what has been a year or so in in-game time?

Dropped.
I hate how the dev can make a game this interesting and then completely fuck it up by giving minor regime troops free supply, regardless of what, in a war game all about tactical combat and logistics(!!!). I understand AI has to cheat by making free roads, etc., to stay competitive, but this is straight up retarded.I understand they're not particularly strong troops either, but having to brute force all of the early game is lame.

 

[Beowulf]

Spoiler

I've cut these cunts off of any supply for about 5 - 6 turns now. Troops magically being magically supplied with resources despite full envelopement?

Dropped.
I hate how the dev can make a game this interesting and then completely fuck it up by giving minor regime troops free supply regardless of what in a war game all about tactical combat and logistics(!!!). I understand AI can cheat by making free roads, etc., but this is straight up retarded.

It makes some sense. I guess those are slavers, which are a cityless minor (like nomads and some raiders). Minors without a city (and non-aligned forces) don't have a supply source (Mutants, Arachnids, Sentient AI, Slavers, raiders) and as such can "live off the land" so they don't starve and disappear without a reason.
Sure, those completely surrounded should be considered out of supply eventually., so you might want to post in the suggestions thread on the forums.
Majors and minors with city troops suffer from the lack of supply (albeit you also have to surround them completely or destroy their food sources, as they get logistical bonuses and basically can transport supplies without limits everywhere).

Anyway, it's all in the manual in a separate chapter showcasing what mechanics are applied to different types of AI's and to what degree.

 

[Parsimonious cook]

Exactly, the minors live off the land, which is compensated by inability to make any tech advancements.

 

[AgentFransis]

Yep. Make some real troops, add buggies or tanks, envelop and destroy.

 

[madhouse]

quote

Exactly, the minors live off the land, which is compensated by inability to make any tech advancements.

I wouldn't have a problem with living off the land if the planet wasn't an inhospitable, lifeless rock with no breathable atmosphere (at least for humans), and if they weren't camping out in a big field of rocks in bum-fuck nowhere that is entirely surrounded by my zone and troops. I understand the need for them no to worry about logistics of delievery, for they have no cities and it would be awkward to model them otherwise, but they should not be exempt from lack of supplies if they are cut off from the rest of their zone of control. This is probably a fairly valid suggestion for official forums, and I might just put it out there. I really like this game so far, but considering early game is largely about dealing with these shithouse raiders, it is not particularly fun or interesting to have to brute force your way with pure numbers rather than using the tools this game has specifically laid out for intelligent tactics and wargaming. You shouldn't have to research tanks when infrantry should be enough with intelligent tactics and aggressive envelopement.

Yep. Make some real troops, add buggies or tanks, envelop and destroy.

Destroying them is not a problem, it is the fact that you have to brute force them in the first place rather than doing what makes sense, i.e. cutting off units from rest of their army and reducing their supplies and morale for defense penalties before destroying them. It's bad design.

 

[AgentFransis]

I mean, enveloping them is already enough. Now you just need to make them retreat and they'll surrender. I'm guessing you're heaving trouble with that since you're relying on shitty militia which are themselves undersupplied and with low readiness. Also you don't even have a full surround there so I'm not sure why you're talking about supplies at all. There's nothing stopping them from linking back up with their main force next turn.

 

[madhouse]

I mean, enveloping them is already enough. Now you just need to make them retreat and they'll surrender. I'm guessing you're heaving trouble with that since you're relying on shitty militia which are themselves undersupplied and with low readiness. Also you don't even have a full surround there so I'm not sure why you're talking about supplies at all. There's nothing stopping them from linking back up with their main force next turn.

Except they've been sitting there for 5 turns. Why are you excusing shitty design so hard? Reason why I'm using shitty militia there is because my actual military was busy with bigger threats. Little did I know raiders can craft sandwhiches out of sand and stones.

 

[AgentFransis]

Sure it would be nice, but it just doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

 

[madhouse]

Sure it would be nice, but it just doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

I understand, it just seems to break the immersion when you realize all the cool stuff game lets you do with envelopements and such are uselss against some early enemies. I think the reason why they avoided breaking out is because the troops didn't register them being starved (since they are supplied), and thus AI doesn't think it's necessary to move. They'd still be there even in late-game if I kept sufficient amount of troops around as peackeepers for a human-zoo with people eating stones and sand.

 

[AgentFransis]

But that's what I'm saying though - it's not useless at all. If you surround them and then win, even if you kill no one they will all surrender. It's still the best way to go about it.

I wouldn't say cutting off supplies is the main point of envelopment but rather cutting off the enemy's routes of retreat. A Stalingrad like siege where you wait for the enemy to starve is not terribly typical. As far as I'm aware usually when the Germans secured an envelopment they moved to reduce the pocket as soon as possible.

When I'm doing in envelopments I rarely wait for starvation, I destroy the pocket to keep the momentum of the attack going. Also with fast units you create a pocket without needing a full envelopment so reducing the pocket immediately prevents the enemy from running away.

 

[madhouse]

But that's what I'm saying though - it's not useless at all. If you surround them and then win, even if you kill no one they will all surrender. It's still the best way to go about it.

I wouldn't say cutting off supplies is the main point of envelopment but rather cutting off the enemy's routes of retreat. A Stalingrad like siege where you wait for the enemy to starve is not terribly typical. As far as I'm aware usually when the Germans secured an envelopment they moved to reduce the pocket as soon as possible.

Enemies get massive penalties for being out of supply for combat readiness and morale mostly. It is extremely useful, especially when you can't afford to have the bulk of your force in one place to forcefully crush everything at once, and you might be using sub-par, reserve troops. I think it's especially relevant early on in the game with shitty militias (I know you can start with actual military and more techs) and before you've built up a solid basis to make actual armies with.

 

[AgentFransis]

That's why I don't go on offensives with sub-par forces. Holding the line is enough. In fact your line is dangerously extended and I would pull it back. The fact that the raiders even allowed themselves to stay surrounded for so long is a fault of the AI.

 

[Joined on the 4th of July]

Biggest annoyance in the 'AI ignoring the rules' category for me is how AI majors can casually turn after turn drop roads (that would cost thousands of industry points for the player) over mountain ranges.