KickStarter Shroud of the Avatar - Lord British's Not-Ultima Online 2

[Metro]

I'll agree with the first two but the fact is Roberts sold in-game ships which is the same thing as selling in-game housing... actually arguably worse since Star Citizen is based around ships whereas housing is a side-feature. Yeah there's a difference in pricing but the concept is the same.

 

[Hobz]

Apparently I missed the fact he already has $8 million lined up from private investors/publisher... so... why is this on Kickstarter?

I don't see the problem with a studio trying to get more fundings through any way, kickstarter included.

Of course they have to be very transparent about that and particularly about the impact this initial funding has on the scope of the game and their freedom as a developers.

 

[BigWeather]

Is Ultima Forever really bad? I'd like to revisit Ultima in a new form and this Nultima clearly isn't it... At first I was very incensed by the whole Lady British thing but after this KS and losing faith in Lord British seeing the light maybe it isn't so bad.

 

[Jaesun]

Is Ultima Forever really bad? I'd like to revisit Ultima in a new form and this Nultima clearly isn't it... At first I was very incensed by the whole Lady British thing but after this KS and losing faith in Lord British seeing the light maybe it isn't so bad.

http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...-entertainment-to-mount-ultimas-corpse.74084/

 

[BigWeather]

Is Ultima Forever really bad? I'd like to revisit Ultima in a new form and this Nultima clearly isn't it... At first I was very incensed by the whole Lady British thing but after this KS and losing faith in Lord British seeing the light maybe it isn't so bad.

http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...-entertainment-to-mount-ultimas-corpse.74084/

Sigh. Seems so unfair with all these classic series getting great sequels for Ultima to get two terrible ones, with honestly no hope for it to get better as the current owner and the original creator are both so far off the mark.

 

[Stabwound]

In a battle of the shitty, Shroud of the Avatar looks leagues better and Ultima-like than Ultima Forever appears to be.

 

[Jaesun]

In a battle of the shitty, Shroud of the Avatar looks leagues better and Ultima-like than Ultima Forever appears to be.

I hate to say it, but I do agree. Having played Ultima Forever.

However which MMO is better is not a good thing.

 

[Jaesun]

Richard Garriott about 3 hours ago
Greetings! Richard "Lord British" Garriott here.
I was having to post via the Portalarium account for a while, due to some Kickstarter hiccup, but now I can post as myself. First, let me thank you all for your interest and support so far! Let me again clarify, we are building a game that is story driven and about social issues and your behavior ala U4-7. Our interactivity goal is to be a deeply interactive as U7. While people can play essentially and likely literally solo / offline, online play will allow you to participate in the persistent world, where you will see the shops and homes of all other players, and you can adventure alone or with fiends and strangers with our "ad hock" multiplayer system. It is NOT a client server MMO, but rather continuous automatic matchmaking favoring your real world friends.

Richard Garriott about 3 hours ago
@Ambrose - It is my hope that all the folks who think they really just want to play offline will play online. I really believe our plan will provide a deeper world to experience without either pestering you to buy crap all the time, nor interfering with your feeling of "I am the chosen hero". Yet, I understand the two camps of A) I want a solo player Ultima style game, and B) I want the UO style MMO experience (before it was "ruined"). We will provide those options, as best we can. Yet, I still hope and believe, the way we are tackling the online play will serve both camps! If not, you can play solo!

 

[Broseph]

 

[Excidium]

It's perfect, it's the game that will make everyone happy.

 

[80Maxwell08]

It's perfect, it's the game that will make everyone happy.

And when everyone's happy, no one will be.

 

[Blaine]

Well, at least he quote-unquote "admitted" that Trammel et alia ruined Ultima Online. That's awfully big of him.

For those of you who don't like MMOs, if you could just go ahead and like them anyway, King Yiddish would really appreciate it. Why not buy a townhouse while you're at it?

I must say that this "basically an MMO except it's dynamic matchmaking" model (which Star Citizen will also use) does not fit the usual MMO mold. We'll have to wait until one of the two games is released to see how it fares.

 

[Excommunicator]

It is my hope that all the folks who think they really just want to play offline will play online

He really, truly has no idea.

 

[FrancoTAU]

I'll say this, it's the most confusing pitch for a game that's already well into development. Now it sounds like he means it's an Ultima solo game with a ton of optional larping. He really needs to be more clear. Am I going to see thousands of people running around the gameworld or is just restricted to one city? He's talking about PvP so that can't even be the case.

 

[RK47]

Maric 13 minutes ago

NTRPFCon Yeah, but you paid $500.00 less. Every Kickstarter I have seen has done this (added another tier after one sells out). It's not out of the norm anyway.


NTRPGCon 21 minutes ago

I thought the point of housing was limited... now that the $3000 houses sold out, you add new $3500 ones ? I wouldn't have bought in had I known you'd just add more houses on the fly... they are suppose to be rare...

 

[FrancoTAU]

Yeah, I just saw that. I get why the larpers enjoy the having their own home/shop or whatever. I just don't understand why forcing the majority of players, who aren't going to pay the fees for those things, would get out being forced to be around these douches. Either it's really an MMORPG or he's basically saying I'm forcing 90% of you to be online so that you have to endure the douches solely to milk them of money while you wander around doing the solo game.

 

[Blaine]

And that right there demonstrates how these Shroud of the Avatar houses are fundamentally different from Star Citizen's pledge ships: The ships don't occupy a permanent piece of real estate in the game world. It also demonstrates why selling limited-availability persistent virtual property to backers in a persistent-universe game is a blatant cash grab. Having something unique so that you can brag to your friends and show off your tremendously girthsome pixel cock is a large part of what MMOs are all about. Here you have a city house with a special founder's plaque and a "Lord" title for your character, not because you accomplished anything in the game, but because you paid Lord Yiddish $3,000 (well, $3,500 now). A certain type of MMO player will do anything to secure something like that.

Star Citizen pledge ships are just ship hulls. Not persistent or limited in availability, no special title, no plaque, far less expensive than these homes, and any other player can afford the same hull rather easily once the game goes live. They won't represent any kind of e-peen value really. Except for the Vanduul Fighter (in some of the aforementioned respects), which is why I got one. Fuck off.

That guy (NTRPGCon) wanted to be one of only twenty people to have a shiny house, and proceed to brag about it continually until he puked his fucking lungs out. He's getting what he deserves, really, although in reality the group he's bought into will still be fairly elite as far as the number of people who've got it.

 

[Severian Silk]

In my experience, Griefing hurts the game's 'economy' as in, it may prevent new players from getting into the game. Whereas the in-game economy can actually benefit from griefing or even the potential of griefing.

Nothing stimulates the economy like liquidating assets by killing some people here and there.

 

[Blaine]

EVE Online's entire economy hinges on ships and their components exploding constantly.

 

[FrancoTAU]

I haven't put much time in MMO games in general, but the only times I've had any joy with them came from griefing.

 

[Severian Silk]

Just like real life.

 

[jewboy]

Garriot is such dick

It is my hope that all the folks who think they really just want to play offline will play online.

The unstated part is that he hopes this will allow him to defeat piracy without having to resort to traditional DRM. That is the only reason for the online requirement.

I really believe our plan will provide a deeper world to experience without either pestering you to buy crap all the time,

A deeper world? What is he talking about? How does an MMO provide a 'deeper world'?

nor interfering with your feeling of "I am the chosen hero".

If being a 'chosen hero' is what he thinks single player RPGs are about then thank god he has no interest in trying to make one. Is this a subtle dig at single player RPGs?

Yet, I understand the two camps of A) I want a solo player Ultima style game, and B) I want the UO style MMO experience (before it was "ruined"). We will provide those options, as best we can. Yet, I still hope and believe, the way we are tackling the online play will serve both camps! If not, you can play solo!

Translation: Embrace and extend. This is a perfect example of a content creator without even a hint of artistic integrity.

 

[Blaine]

I'm beginning to strongly suspect that a number of famous computer game developers from the 1980s and 1990s were—as is frequently the case in life—simply at the right place at the right time, met the right people, and were kept in check by their bosses and/or colleagues. I call this the George Lucas effect. Richard Garriott wears his hair in a tiny little braid, owns a snake pendant, LARPs as king of the nerds, looks like a sommelier, and happened to make some quite decent cRPGs in the 1980s and 1990s. I'd say there are dozens, possibly hundreds of other human beings who could have directed games of a similar caliber or better, had they been in the right place and time with the proper bona fides.

Much like George Lucas, you put these guys in the 2000s and give them a bunch of money, full creative license, access to advanced technology, they develope a pan-galactic ego, they're free from handlers, and then all of a sudden you get an ancient LARPer telling you that what you think you enjoy is wrong.

I'll read a few good fantasy or sci-fi novels written in the 60s, 70s and 80s, and I see concepts and characters that completely blow Garriott's ideas away, or Lucas', or Chris Roberts' for that matter. Bog-standard space ships BUT THE ENEMY ARE TALKING ANTHROPOMORPHIC CATS!

Of course, there's more to making a computer game than having good ideas. Ideas come a dime for a dozen. But that's the problem, isn't it? You only get to put your ideas into computer games if you have something else to offer, some other skill set that gets you "in", be it coding, music, art, personnel management, web development, something. Didn't Josh Sawyer start as the company janitor? The idea filter for computer games is far from anything remotely resembling a meritocracy.

Garriott is totally out of control. He's gone full George Lucas.

 

[Infinitron]

Blaine Sawyer was the Black Isle website administrator. Which is slightly below the janitor, I guess.

 

[Infinitron]

Things are getting restless in the Kickstarter comments. Read from bottom to top: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/portalarium/shroud-of-the-avatar-forsaken-virtues-0/comments

That Oddball guy is the worst sort of goosestepping fanboy.