Something RPGs lack that MMORPGs have.

[Grauken]

MMOs are social, about the respect you earn (or think you do) in comparison to other people. That exists in single player games these days to a degree as well (all the achievement whores on steam), but to a large extend the enjoyment you get out of single player games is the singular journey, a uniquely solipsistic experience that is very much unlike the dick measuring contest that MMOs are

 

[Ranarama]

Fucking MMORPGs no longer have that bullshit. They're raid machines.

That's why MOBAs stole their lunch money.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

I see anvi is targetting TemplarGR's seat. Good luck on your quest anvi. Don't to forget to post daily to really grind up that XP.

 

[rolandz_Baton_PROD]

I used to play Guild Wars 2 for 40 hours or so mainly for its story and world, but jumped ship when all of that ran out. All that was left was just grinding and doing the same thing over for some legendary or cool loot.

What you describe is fine as long as the gameplay loop is not only fun and satisfying to go through, but also deviating every time you come around to indulge in said game play loop.

Otherwise you'll just uninstall it and forget about it like the overwhelming majority of MMO's

 

[Old Hans]

There is a whole other level of how important what you are doing is when you play an MMO. I don't mean some fly by night MMO you play for a few weeks, but I mean in one of your long term loves. Everything matters because you are building up over a journey that can take years.

A single player RPG has its advantages too, but looting stuff and a lot of the tension and sense of achievement is so much weaker than what you get in an MMO. For example imagine an item that is so good that people will log in every night and sit in the same room of a dungeon and kill stuff for hours, just for a chance to get this item. It might take them a week to get just that one item, and there are 20 more they want right away. And so much more.

Even a good RPG, I know I will be uninstalling it in a week or two anyway so I really don't care about a whole lot.

what year are you posting from? this hasnt been a thing since early 00's

 

[Void_Pickle]

You're right. I'm going to look back so fondly on the thousands of hours I spent on [mmo]. Those rare gloves were well worth it.

How about playing a tabletop rpg instead. You can still play for extensive periods of time without... all the negatives that come with mmos.

 

[DalekFlay]

How is it any different to New Vegas?

Jarl answered better than I will, but basically good singleplayer RPGs give you enough story, context, richer quest design and stuff like faction systems and tactical combat which add to the "lootin' and watchin' bars go up" core gameplay to make for a more satisfying experience. Getting to know Veronica and choosing which faction to support, sneaking into bases to sabotage things, nailing that headshot with my cowboy rifle from long-distance... these things were just as big a part of New Vegas as getting that next perk or finding the best rifle. MMOs don't really have that stuff in anywhere the same quantity, from what I have played of them. Every single one wears its grind on its sleeve, treats quests as check-marks and treats combat as a tedious necessity.

I will grant you a lot of singleplayer games lately are taking this route as well though, stuff like Assassin's Creed and Mass Effect Andromeda. They have MMO style design with singleplayer story focus, a weird kind of marriage that people fall for. It's depressing.

 

[cosmicray]

The only thing I felt MMO TOR did better than its KotOR parents was the vastness of world. It's huge. Sure, it might feel barren, but at least there's a feeling of a big city or planet grander than any hub in KotOR could have had. Which is why I kept playing it longer than I ever thought I would.

 

[DalekFlay]

The only thing I felt MMO TOR did better than its KotOR parents was the vastness of world. It's huge. Sure, it might feel barren, but at least there's a feeling of a big city or planet grander than any hub in KotOR could have had. Which is why I kept playing it longer than I ever thought I would.

That's one of the two MMOs I've put real time into, because I liked the story (Imperial Assassin) and of course like Star Wars. The world design was pretty good, though in typical MMO fashion the quest design, combat and pacing were terrible. It was very much a "I'm suffering through this to finish the story and see the next planet" experience, rather than a enjoyable one overall. I'd love to play a version of that game overhauled for singleplayer, though of course it would never happen.

 

[anvi]

How is it any different to New Vegas?

Jarl answered better than I will, but basically good singleplayer RPGs give you enough story, context, richer quest design and stuff like faction systems and tactical combat which add to the "lootin' and watchin' bars go up" core gameplay to make for a more satisfying experience.

But a good MMO does all that too, only better.

 

[anvi]

I used to play Guild Wars 2 for 40 hours or so mainly for its story and world, but jumped ship when all of that ran out. All that was left was just grinding and doing the same thing over for some legendary or cool loot.

What you describe is fine as long as the gameplay loop is not only fun and satisfying to go through, but also deviating every time you come around to indulge in said game play loop.

Otherwise you'll just uninstall it and forget about it like the overwhelming majority of MMO's

I agree but I think a good game can keep that loop fun. EQ was awesome because the loop was fun anyway, but it also changed every 10-20 levels. So at low level you fight face to face with enemies and your pet helps, you blast some spells to help. By level 20 you can't do that anymore so the combat changes. And then at 30+ things change again.

 

[anvi]

You're right. I'm going to look back so fondly on the thousands of hours I spent on [mmo]. Those rare gloves were well worth it.

How about playing a tabletop rpg instead. You can still play for extensive periods of time without... all the negatives that come with mmos.

What negatives? Most negatives from MMOs are easy to avoid. And this thread isn't saying MMOs are best, it is saying there are aspects of MMOs that single player games could really use.

 

[Shaewaroz]

MMOs are Skinner Boxes created to exploit the weak-minded for $$$.

 

[Swigen]

MMO’s are boring shite for retards and every time a single player RPG adopts aspects of MMO’s it always to their detriment. Like all the shitty “collect 10 of x” quests or quests that rely on random drops, JESUS what a goddamn waste of time! Is it that hard to come up with a compelling reason for completing these menial tasks? Some kind of payoff storywise? No? Not even a fanservice CG? Just 800 xp kthnxbai? $15 dollars a month... SUCK MY BAAAAWLS!!!!

 

[DalekFlay]

But a good MMO does all that too, only better.

Give me an example.

 

[anvi]

But a good MMO does all that too, only better.

Give me an example.

EQ had all of that 20 years ago.

 

[anvi]

MMO’s are boring shite for retards and every time a single player RPG adopts aspects of MMO’s it always to their detriment. Like all the shitty “collect 10 of x” quests or quests that rely on random drops, JESUS what a goddamn waste of time! Is it that hard to come up with a compelling reason for completing these menial tasks? Some kind of payoff storywise? No? Not even a fanservice CG? Just 800 xp kthnxbai? $15 dollars a month... SUCK MY BAAAAWLS!!!!

Bad quests are not unique to MMOs... Plenty of crappy RPGs that are no better. Even Skyrim quests rarely amount to more than that. There are great quests in MMOs too though, and the reason people do it isn't for some story faggery, it is because they want the reward. If you are all about story, why even play games?

 

[anvi]

The main mechanic of MMOs is grind.

You talk in absolutes about something you barely know anything about.

 

[Duckard]

It really is a shame that there's no practical way to replicate some of the best parts of MMOs in singleplayer. Gearing up for a quest in Runescape back in the day was full-on intense, knowing that one fuckup meant you'd lose just about everything you were carrying permanently, possibly setting you back several real-life days' worth of gameplay. You had to take along emergency escape teleports, anti-poisons just in case you randomly got fucked, healing items and still leave enough space to pick up all the garbage shit you'd need for the quest. In singleplayer games, you just quickload and quicksave until you eventually know exactly what to do, and the worst consequence for failure is losing like a minute of gameplay.

The only immediately obvious way around this is permadeath, but permadeath games universally fucking suck.

Not always.

Spoiler

 

[JarlFrank]

The main mechanic of MMOs is grind.

You talk in absolutes about something you barely know anything about.

I tried plenty of MMOs. All of them required a disproportionate investment of time and effort into repetitive elements of the gameplay in order to get ahead.

 

[Wysardry]

The only feature from MMORPGs that I'd like to see more of in offline RPGs is special events (such as festivals) that happen at specific times of the year.

 

[Black Angel]

The main mechanic of MMOs is grind.

You talk in absolutes about something you barely know anything about.

How the fuck is that something he barely know anything about, when it's precisely what you confirmed in OP?

A single player RPG has its advantages too, but looting stuff and a lot of the tension and sense of achievement is so much weaker than what you get in an MMO. For example imagine an item that is so good that people will log in every night and sit in the same room of a dungeon and kill stuff for hours, just for a chance to get this item. It might take them a week to get just that one item, and there are 20 more they want right away. And so much more.

 

[anvi]

The main mechanic of MMOs is grind.

You talk in absolutes about something you barely know anything about.

How the fuck is that something he barely know anything about, when it's precisely what you confirmed in OP?

A single player RPG has its advantages too, but looting stuff and a lot of the tension and sense of achievement is so much weaker than what you get in an MMO. For example imagine an item that is so good that people will log in every night and sit in the same room of a dungeon and kill stuff for hours, just for a chance to get this item. It might take them a week to get just that one item, and there are 20 more they want right away. And so much more.

Because there are MMOs you can complete in a week. How that grind? There are also grinds in mmos that are fun and a lot less grindy than various single player games. It is like trying to explain the internet to old people, I tell you all the great things you can do and you are all like, "but there are scammers!"

 

[anvi]

The main mechanic of MMOs is grind.

You talk in absolutes about something you barely know anything about.

I tried plenty of MMOs. All of them required a disproportionate investment of time and effort into repetitive elements of the gameplay in order to get ahead.

You mean like every game ever?

 

[Machocruz]

Grinding for rare drops...is not part of my conception of what RPGs are about. I've never see it in any tabletop I've ever participated in over 25 years. And I would be someone who would entirely disagree with the assumption that Jarl laid down, that it's the core gameplay of RPGs, even CRPGs. Loot was something I usually never game a damn about. If I found something better, of course I'd equip it because that's the logical course of action. Other than that, finding a nice item was a perk, not something that motivated me to play.

That said, it can work as a general video game concept and there is some satisfaction to be had. Diablo 2, Final Fantasy 12 are two single player games where I spent time on this process because I wanted to see what the appeal of loot hunting was for other people, and I didn't regret doing so. Although I didn't go after the things that had ridiculously minuscule drop rates. And I did go treasure hunting in Morrowind, but that's bound to exploration, which most RPG players love, not grinding

MMOs though...entirely too little butter spread across too much toast. Even to get to what in my opinion is a great dungeon crawling experience or boss, which is my motivation for playing, takes longer than I like. I never got that far in WoW or other MMOs. I think Uldaman was the farthest I ever got (BC era) and it was finally a dungeon that hit the spot of what I wanted out of the game. But seemed to me like a looong journey to get there.