Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Sound Canvas VA, Roland's Virtual MIDI Synthesizer

Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
5,904
Yes, I agree but I was specifically referring to the case of Krondor - I can't ascertain for this specific case if there was a 'lead' synth, and both the MT-32 and SC-55 versions of the soundtrack have their strengths and weaknesses that might appeal to individual tastes. I personally prefer the MT-32 in this case, but it might very well (given the time period) have been written for the SC-55, which also sounds very good.
 

schru

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2015
Messages
1,142
Sceptic, I'll see about recording some of those tracks after Wednesday, as I'm currently busy.
 

Gragt

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Nov 1, 2007
Messages
1,864,860
Location
Dans Ton Cul
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin
:necro:

It may not have been necessary but I’ve decided to post an update to this thread. The original post was rather informative but, as schru mentioned, it works up to Windows 7 but not on Windows 8/10.

I’ve also decided to write a bit more on improving MIDI playback on Windows in general. I imagine that most Codex regulars know this already, but I know there are many who don’t know yet about the various ways one can enhance MIDI music (using anything else than the default Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth is usually an improvement), or even why this is desirable. spekkio might be interested in adding part of this to his list of game fixes and improvements.

When it comes to MIDI music, I use Falcosoft MIDI Player. It is a damn good piece of software with a score of options, and it can also act as a MIDI host—meaning it can play MIDI from any program on your system. It can also act as a MUNT emulator, although that’s a story for another time. It is portable, so download it and extract it somewhere.

I should mention here that there are other MIDI host options, but if you know them you probably don’t need to read the rest of this post.

The next piece of software is CoolSoft MIDI Mapper, which allows you to select the MIDI source on your system. There are other options available up to Windows 7, but on Windows 8/10, and likely beyond, Microsoft has removed the native Windows MIDI Mapper and to the best of my knowledge this is the only option we have to change the MIDI source.

In order to connect the two programs, we’ll need loopMIDI. It acts as a virtual cable between MIDI Player and MIDI Mapper.

There are two ways to proceed now. I’ll cover the two because I find them both useful and there isn’t an option that covers all needs. Some games will sound better with one and not the other, but both are much better than the Windows default.

What you need now is a SoundFont bank. Think of the MIDI file as the music partition and the SoundFont bank as the orchestra. There are various files floating on the Net and they vary greatly in quality and size (some of them boast a size of 1 G and more!). You have to try and decide which sound best to your ears. There are many different opinions, making it difficult to settle on a bank of choice. For what it’s worth, I can vouch for 8MBGM.SF2—you’ll need to look it up, but it is relatively popular so it shouldn’t be too hard to find; it came bundled with Creative cards, like the SB Live!, and it provides good quality for just a bit less than 8 M. Even if it isn’t to your liking, it is a good starting point.

Firstly, open loopMIDI. Create a MIDI port by clicking the “+” at the bottom of the screen. You can also give it a name if you want to. In my example, I decided to call it “MIDI Player”.

2XpakaN.png


All you need to do now is to open MIDI Player. Open the Settings screen (click the cog icon on the left of the program). In the “Midi Out” section, tick “Use Bass (Soundfonts/VSTi)” and it will open another panel. In the “BassMidi Settings” panel, simply select your default SoundFont. Finally, in the “Midi In” section, tick “Active” and select your loopMIDI port as the Input Port. The rest can be left alone.

5DHKr8J.png


The last step is to open MIDI Mapper and select your MIDI port, thus linking all MIDI calls to MIDI Player.

HKZGnC1.png


Windows games and programs will now play all MIDI files through MIDI Player, which is configured to use your SoundFont bank. DOS games running in DOSBox will also use it as long as the game is set to use General MIDI (most ’90s games should have the option, although not all do). Remember that in order for this to work loopMIDI and MIDI Player must both be open, else the system will default to Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth.

The other option is very similar but makes use of VSTi. For our purposes, just think of VSTi plugins as an alternative to SoundFont: they provide the orchestra.

MIDI Player comes with its own set of VSTi (one of which is the aforementioned MUNT emulator) but we specifically want to use Sound Canvas VA. The Roland SC-55 was the standard sound module in the ’90s and many musicians used it when composing. The general idea is that if music was created with specific hardware, it’s the way it’s meant to be played.

While the previous setup works fine in general, some compositions simply sound better with a Sound Canvas. Sound Canvas VA aims to emulate a SC-88, which includes a SC-55 mode. It isn’t exactly the same as a SC-55 but it still sounds great and surpasses many SoundFont banks that claim to reproduce the SC-55 sound—interestingly, Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth is based on the SC-55 but sounds rather flat.

Sound Canvas VA isn’t free but you can download a trial version from Roland. It will only play music for 10 minutes at a time, and is limited to 14 days, though it should give you an idea of what to expect.

If you have set up MIDI Player correctly, this part should go fast: install Sound Canvas VA and then start MIDI Player. From the main menu, select the “Bass VSTi Plugins” option, or simply press SHIFT+I. In this new window, you can see that the OPL3 VSTi is loaded by default.

XJGYcrQ.png


Press the stop button to unload the current plugin, then press the file button to load Sound Canvas VA (you’re looking for “SOUND Canvas VA.dll” in the directory where you installed it). If all goes well, you will see the Sound Canvas menu.

2XwlABD.png


The last thing to do is go to option > system and change the map mode from SC-8820 to SC-55.

2qEa2P5.png


It may not be a completely faithful reproduction of the SC-55 sound but that’s as good as it gets without owning the actual hardware. If you want to use mainly the Sound Canvas VA plugin, you can tick the “Autoload at startup” box.

The procedure is the same for any other SoundFont bank or VSTi plugin you may decide to try. This should drastically improve the MIDI playback quality of your games, and hopefully the enjoyment you’ll derive from them.

Edit: as a bonus, here’s a list of patches from tikalat on VOGONS. The good chap has spent the past years patching MIDI problems in games, and some are specific Sound Canvas problems.
 
Last edited:

schru

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2015
Messages
1,142
Thanks for you post Gragt. I've been using CoolSoft MIDI Mapper for a longer time now and it indeed resolves the issue with the default MIDI device.

Also, my apologies to Sceptic about never making those recordings, I just kept putting them off. I was very busy for a few months and then I moved, losing regular Internet access for a while. I'll have to look into it at some point.
 

Gragt

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Nov 1, 2007
Messages
1,864,860
Location
Dans Ton Cul
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin
Thanks for you post Gragt. I've been using CoolSoft MIDI Mapper for a longer time now and it indeed resolves the issue with the default MIDI device.

I’m glad you could confirm it. I’m still using Windows 7 but I was considering moving to Windows 10 when/if I make a new computer. Thanks to that program, it seems the future of MIDI music is secure (until the next Windows version, that is).

Do soundfonts do anything for Grimoire?

I don’t have Grimoire, but from what I’ve read it simply plays MIDI like anything else. In this case, yes: SoundFont/VSTi should change the way the music is played.

The only game I know of that seems to have its own way of playing MIDI is Knights of the Chalice. You can open the files from the game folder but change the global MIDI settings of your computer won’t change the way it plays in game.
 

schru

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2015
Messages
1,142
In case of Grimoire it would be best to ask Cleveland Mark Blakemore what he used to compose the music. The SC VA is definitely preferable to Microsoft's soundfont, but it's not accurate or that well balanced for all games.
 

Gragt

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Nov 1, 2007
Messages
1,864,860
Location
Dans Ton Cul
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin
Given the time it took, if the music was composed somewhat early in development I wouldn’t be surprised if it turns out to be a Sound Canvas soundtrack.

If not sure, there is always the option to listen to it with your prefered options and see if you like it that way. As I wrote earlier, 8MBGM.SF2 is my choice SoundFont because it is rather well-rounded.
 

schru

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2015
Messages
1,142
I might add that while I did not have many chances to play games with the SC VA, and when I did it performed perfectly satisfactorily, I did listen to MIDI music with it a lot outside of games. In the end I found myself preferring SC-55 recordings due to rather subtle differences in certain instruments and the way the more resonant drum kits of the SC VA tend to sound too pronounced and a little artificial.

Here are two tracks from Hexen for comparison of instruments:

Crypt (the chorus)

SC-55 http://www.mediafire.com/file/elxw93cm87jj57j/Crypt_%28SC-55%29.flac/file

SC VA http://www.mediafire.com/file/pphhm3fbw2kobss/cry.mp3/file

Sixate (the flute)

SC-55 http://www.mediafire.com/file/q5owh143ft5c7qm/Sixate_%28SC-55%29.flac/file

SC VA http://www.mediafire.com/file/c2hnuj2rap3sffo/Sixate_%28SC_VA%29.flac/file
 

Gragt

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Nov 1, 2007
Messages
1,864,860
Location
Dans Ton Cul
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin
I understand how you feel. It’s not even supposed to emulate a SC-55 but a SC-88 which had a SC-55 mode. It also seems to depend on the version of Sound Canvas VA used: Roland has been patching it over time and some instruments apparently sound better in the later versions. For reference, the latest version should be 1.12 and the trial version is 1.03.
 

mwnn85

Savant
Joined
Aug 14, 2017
Messages
210
It's hard to listen to anything else once you've tried the *special* version of Sound Canvas VA that's out there.
A damn shame it's overpriced, released only on Windows + OSX and horrible online DRM too.

The closest thing I've heard that sounds comparable to Sound Canvas quality-wise on a Linux system would be the fatboy soundfont with Fluidsynth.
I've got that working nicely with GZDoom, Shockolate, OpenXcom, CorsixTH, etc.
You need to set an environment variable to get it working with SDL based ports i.e:

export SDL_SOUNDFONTS="/usr/share/soundfonts/FatBoy_v0784.sf2"

Like most people I only ever heard midi music using Adlib or Soundblaster back then - crude garbage by comparison; I never would've known these games were intended to sound so good.
I never played through Heretic or Hexen back in the day so I must rectify that. (only a bit of Hexen 2)
I've had a quick go; the gauntlets seem ludicrously good and the maps are full of traps.
Queued up Quake 1 as well with Quakespasm.
Just can't beat the enemy, map and weapon designs of these old classics.
 
Last edited:

schru

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2015
Messages
1,142

Sceptic

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
10,880
Divinity: Original Sin
In the end I found myself preferring SC-55 recordings due to rather subtle differences in certain instruments and the way the more resonant drum kits of the SC VA tend to sound too pronounced and a little artificial.

Here are two tracks from Hexen for comparison of instruments:
Thanks for the recordings! I think what surprised me most was just how much richer the real SC-55 sounds compared to the VA. I thought it might be just the reverb/chorus settings on the real module, but there's no reason the software can't emulate them (even the original Virtual Sound Canvas from like 15 years ago could do this), so it does seem like they either used lower quality samples or the software simply can't reproduce the same sound quality.

I understand how you feel. It’s not even supposed to emulate a SC-55 but a SC-88 which had a SC-55 mode. It also seems to depend on the version of Sound Canvas VA used: Roland has been patching it over time and some instruments apparently sound better in the later versions.
I don't remember how the SC-55 mode was supposed to work (I never had an SC-88) but the SC-88 samples do sound better than the SC-55 most of the time, even if the loss of fidelity is not always desirable if you're a purist. The VA samples just sound bad though, even compared to the SC-55. I find it weird that they'd even need to patch the samples, I'd have thought they could simply dump the ROM from the SC itself, like you can do for the MT-32, but maybe it doesn't work like that.
 

agentorange

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
5,256
Location
rpghq (cant read codex pms cuz of fag 2fa)
Codex 2012
I "acquired" a copy of Roland Sound Canvas VA and am using it (in SC-88 mode) while playing Descent. Sounds phenomenal. I didn't know about any of this virtual midi synthesis stuff before now so thanks for the thread. Once you get into it it's amazing how different these soundtracks can sound when played through different formats.
 

A horse of course

Guest
This thread is a great illustration of why you guys will never have sex
 

Morenatsu.

Liturgist
Joined
May 6, 2016
Messages
2,838
Location
The Centre of the World
Not sure if this was mentioned anywhere else, but apparently an über accurate roland soundfont has been posted online on the interwebZ -> https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/118828-updates-in-progress-the-most-accurate-sc-55-soundfont/ . Don't know how it compares to the stuff mentioned here, I leave it up to the afficionados to elaborate.
‘the differences are NEAR INDISTINGUISHABLE!!!’

orly. Well, it sounds like an SC-55 with a slight distortion on everything. Close enough, I guess. Closer than any other soundfont I've heard, at least.
 

Sceptic

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
10,880
Divinity: Original Sin
The differences are very distinguishable IMO, and I'm not a musician and usually pretty bad at telling small differences apart. But then I've been using a Sound Canvas for my retro gaming for a decade now.

The problem with this, and any SC-55 soundfont (including, honestly, Roland's own virtual software) is that the Sound Canvas applies a lot of effects on the raw samples, and nobody really understands how these work. They're usually not dictated directly by the MIDI file itself but seem to be decided more dynamically by the module, possibly for example based on which tones are concurrently playing or if specific sequences of notes are played. Like I said no one really understands it, but it's presumably what gives the SC its distinctive sound, and it's naturally impossible to emulate by ear alone (because, if you adjust the soundfont for one specific MIDI, you'll mess up how another one is supposed to sound; these effects aren't coded by the instrument bank but by the module itself)

I had tested the soundfont with Doom a month or two ago. You can immediately notice the difference in the opening guitar riff on E1M1. Other tracks I had to put side by side to notice the differences, sometimes more obvious, sometimes more subtle. E2M2 is really good, this is one of the few soundfonts that gets it right (and for a more atmospheric track like this, it's important). For comparison, I have listened side by side to Munt with an MT-32 ROM and to my own CM-32L module, and I genuinely could not tell the difference no matter how hard I tried (Munt really has become quite amazingly accurate, I must say)

This probably is the most authentic SC soundfont, but I wonder, if you're not going for 100% fidelity, is it worth going halfway there, or are you better off getting another not-as-authentic soundfont but with high quality tones? The SC-55 is 40 30 years old, and frankly the tones sound it. I guess give it a hear and see (?) what you think.

Since the soundfont was specifically tuned for Doom, a link that might be of interest: https://sc55.duke4.net/
The MIDI soundtrack recorded on a real SC-55, with some hacks to get the files to loop properly. When specifically playing the games listed there, these will sound as much like the real thing as you can get
 
Last edited:

schru

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2015
Messages
1,142
Well then, set the emulator/screen scaling correctly too.
 

Sceptic

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
10,880
Divinity: Original Sin
Cross-posting from the Doom thread per Jack Of Owls suggestion, since this is no longer very relevant to that game.

Finally, some games have tracks that create problems for each other, because when instruments are modified or even a part has a certain instrument set, these may not be reset between tracks, which results in wrong instruments being used in subsequent tracks. This is especially noticeable in Duke Nukem 3D with certain tracks.
Interesting, I did not know this. I'm guessing this problem will also appear with one of the hardware modules. I'll have to try it out on the SC-55. Do you know which tracks specifically this happens with?

Slightly related fun fact: although Doom was composed on the SC-55, it doesn't use any of the GS tones that are specific to the device and sticks to the 128 standard General MIDI tones. I know this because doom.exe forces a GM reset on the Sound Canvas, and you can tell by starting World of Xeen afterwards, which does use the extra GS but does not initiate a GS reset (or any reset actually), hence the famous "opening a door does telephone ring sound" bug.

As for the SC-88 and SC-88 Pro maps, it seems that scant few games in the West used those synthesizers, as they were rather expensive and didn't have expansion-cards or daughter boards based on them, while games would soon switch over to CD music.
I know for a fact that Settlers 2 was composed on an SC-88 and needs to be played through one to sound right, it takes advantage of the SC-88's expanded parts; notes will cut off when played on an SC-55mkII because that device doesn't have enough parts. Witchaven was composed on something other than the SC-55, my mkII gives me a warning about a missing drum kit when I play it there, but I don't know if it was an SC-88 or the Yamaha XG. You are right though that once you get into these years it stops mattering for us as users, because everyone started moving to digital files or CD audio, so we no longer need to have the right device for everything to sound right.

I don't think the Yamaha XG saw much use in the West, but Japanese games used it more, I think the most famous one is Final Fantasy 7, though I never had that synthesizer and didn't care much about the game to investigate this much.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom