From Software The Dark Souls Discussion Thread

[cvv]

Ignored.

Ok let's talk about the game for change. After doing solid amount of PvP I've concluded I do prefer PvP in DS2. The backstab mechanic is just way too abusable in this game and players fall in two groups - those who know it and abuse it up the wazoo and those who don't and lose all the time. Also it feels, weirdly, there are more hacks and cheats in DS1 but maybe it's just me. There was this guy I stabbed repeatedly with my trusty +10 Divine Halberd that was shredding shit throughout NG and NG+ and I was hitting him for 20 dmg. Another was hitting me through my Artorias shield with an unaugmented estoc. Plus all the backstab-teleporting dudes (tho that may be just lag)- A couple more cases like that.

I'm giving the game a rest again but generally it's confirmed - my most favourite game ever. Last area I've visited before uninstall was Ash Lake. Still remember when I first stumbled into it after a harrowing adventure in the Great Hollow I was totally transfixed. Incredible place. And the moment when you wander into the dragon shrine without prior knowledge and don't notice the dragon until he uncoils.... Man this game.

Too bad this was the last Miyazaki's Dark Souls. Can't wait for his next project.

 

[Invictus]

Ignored.

Ok let's talk about the game for change. After doing solid amount of PvP I've concluded I do prefer PvP in DS2. The backstab mechanic is just way too abusable in this game and players fall in two groups - those who know it and abuse it up the wazoo and those who don't and lose all the time. Also it feels, weirdly, there are more hacks and cheats in DS1 but maybe it's just me. There was this guy I stabbed repeatedly with my trusty +10 Divine Halberd that was shredding shit throughout NG and NG+ and I was hitting him for 20 dmg. Another was hitting me through my Artorias shield with an unaugmented estoc. Plus all the backstab-teleporting dudes (tho that may be just lag)- A couple more cases like that.

I'm giving the game a rest again but generally it's confirmed - my most favourite game ever. Last area I've visited before uninstall was Ash Lake. Still remember when I first stumbled into it after a harrowing adventure in the Great Hollow I was totally transfixed. Incredible place. And the moment when you wander into the dragon shrine without prior knowledge and don't notice the dragon until he uncoils.... Man this game.

Too bad this was the last Miyazaki's Dark Souls. Can't wait for his next project.

Since he said From is working on 2 games (one of which is a Dark Fantasy setting) I really hope they revive Tenchu, after playing Nioh I am kind of hoping they do theirnown take on a classic japanese setting. I still remember replaying over and over a mountain mission till I killed all enemies in stealth to get the poisoned food
Good times

 

[sullynathan]

wait, how do I fight kalameet again? I have beaten Artorias but Goughs door is locked.

Sanctuary guardian is the most underrated boss in this game. Really good opener to the DLC but no one ever talks about it.

 

[Elwro]

Explore more, you'll open that door later. Also, yes, it is possible do kill K without Gough's help.

 

[cvv]

wait, how do I fight kalameet again? I have beaten Artorias but Goughs door is locked.

Sanctuary guardian is the most underrated boss in this game. Really good opener to the DLC but no one ever talks about it.

This. A really good boss. Decently challenging on NG+ too since he hits like a truck and if you get caught in his combos you're as good as dead even with 40 Vit.

Also the key to Gough is in the Oolacile Township iirc, in the room with the mimic (you have to jump there).

 

[Invictus]

All the bosses in the DLC are fucking excellent, they really show that with a bit more time and polish From did their best work, I daresay they are the best bosses overall of the series in fact with great movesets, arenas and styles
I remember the first time spending 2 3 tries for the Guardian, a couple of hours for Artorias (he keep killing me when he powered up till I figured out how to stop him from charging) and one night each for Kalamet and Manus. I was using a Pyromancer char with lower strength and dex so Manus especially never gave me enough time for casting so I tried to do them both in melee and boy was it incredible
Probably would have been easier using combustion on them than going melee but still they were such memorable fights... sadly the Manus template of a super aggressive boss seemed to stick for future bosses in the series rather than fights like Kalamet which I found more fun

 

[sullynathan]

If you liked Kalameet, you'll like Sinh . They're rye only 2 great Dragon bosses but, I prefer Sinh because there was option for summons, his opening for the fight looked cooler and he didn't seem as tough as Kalameet.
Kal Is great but it's one of the bosses I don't like fighting because he's too resilient.

 

[Excidium II]

How much item discovery u need to get a guaranteed drop of those black knight weapons?

 

[Crospy]

There is no such a thing. Base drop chance is 20%, and augments with a decent bump at 1 humanity (26%) then becomes increasingly harder to upgrade (29% at 4 humanity for eg). Even if you had 10 humanity and the covetous ring it will never reach anywhere near guaranteed drop level.

Max item discovery is basically having 10 humanities and the covetous ring so go with that and try your luck.

 

[Excidium II]

that suxxx

 

[Crospy]

If the weapon you really want is accessible on one of the first BK encounters I'd just reset the game until I get it. The Burg, Parish and Darkroot ones are not too bad to resetfarm. I would cry if I had to do the one in the catacombs though.

And there is no way I'd wait until I got Sen's covetous ring to try the max discovery thing as killing it and not having the drop would really suck cocks.

 

[cvv]

that suxxx

They're pretty bad tho except the Greatsword which is bad ass. But even if you can get the drop in the Burg on NG you can't use it anyway due to high stat requirements. The best farming spot for BK weapons is the Kiln, they're popping up like mushrooms there. I'd be surprised if you needed more than two runs to get them all.

Twinkling upgrade weapons are generally bad, in all Souls. I've been SO FUCKING DISAPPOINTED when I finally, halfway through NG+, pumped up enough stats to use the Grant...and found out it's outclassed by my Demon Machete and few others, much more common weapons. Dat split damage man, feels so bad.

 

[Excidium II]

their weapons looks so cool tho.

 

[Crospy]

cvv^has no idea wtf he's talking about

The BK weapons don't have great damage scaling but their base damage is fucking insane and they don't suffer from the generality he mentioned about twinkling weapons: they're not split damage weapons.

Also the stat requirement aren't that bad. Did you forget you can wield the weapon with half the strength when two handing without a shield?
The BK halberd is loved by speedrunners for a reason.

[edited out some derp while writing hastily]

 

[cvv]

cvv^has no idea wtf he's talking about

The BK weapons don't have great damage scaling but their base damage is fucking insane and they don't suffer from the generality he mentioned about twinkling weapons: they're not split damage weapons.

Also the stat requirement aren't that bad. Did you forget you can wield the weapon with half the strength when two handing without a shield?
The BK halberd is loved by speedrunners for a reason.

What does it matter their base damage is "fucking insane" when any good common weapon like claymore or halberd surpasses them once fully upgraded?

And yes, speedrunners, the embodiment of an average player. Because an average player can easily breeze through the game without a shield, hopping sprightly between mobs just in their undies.

Good thing one of us knows what he's talking about.

 

[Crospy]

A claymore would only surpass it by the time your stats reach NG+ and probably not before doing a good portion of the game. It scales with high stats but before you truly get high stats it's always going to trail behind the BK weapon hard during a normal NG run.
The halberd will only surpass it if you build with magic and do constant magic buff before every fight (which is an amazingly fun way to play! rest at a bonfire all the time to get the buff back!). Halberd as a class of weapon tends to have the worst scaling so the only thing that allows other halberds to outperform it is going magic buff way, as the BKH can't use magic buff like the darkmoon spell. It's their only edge and playing with constant buffing is an annoyance more than a fun factor imho.

As for playing without a shield.. if you can't do that after the countless hours you probably already spent you should consider suicide. It's one thing for new players to find this difficult but you have little excuse. Also it's not really difficult to alternate between two handed and getting your shield back for some blocking. Learn the game, tard. We're not talking about doing NG+7 at SL1 naked with a club.

Speedrunners are not the elite you think it is. I've done speedruns at between 1h30 to 2h of DS1 and DS2. Not anywhere the top runners but it's not that big of a deal. Doing low level runs particularly at higher NG is far more excruciating because it's much harder to not make mistakes in fights when they last for so much hitpoints. When everything dies quickly in NG with a good weapon it's not really a problem. Made a mistake once, died? run back and kill it this time.

 

[sullynathan]

their weapons looks so cool tho.

Nah, they're pretty good especially in Dark Souls 3. The only downside I think is that they can't be buffed.

 

[Elwro]

BK are good for some demon bosses, like the firesage. They can make a real difference.

 

[Jigawatt]

Was just doing some PvP in Darkroot via Cat Covenant ring. Had some good fights, but also seeing a lot of what cvv mentioned, i.e. people who clearly know how to abuse lag for backstabs. One moment they're in your face with a shield up, next their sword is in your back, not even a roll or anything in between. Kinda sucks that ping is always going to be > 150ms to nearly everyone from down in the ass of New Zealand

 

[cvv]

Was just doing some PvP in Darkroot via Cat Covenant ring. Had some good fights, but also seeing a lot of what cvv mentioned, i.e. people who clearly know how to abuse lag for backstabs. One moment they're in your face with a shield up, next their sword is in your back, not even a roll or anything in between. Kinda sucks that ping is always going to be > 150ms to nearly everyone from down in the ass of New Zealand

I suspect it's not just about the geo-lag, I'm pretty sure most peeps I dueled were from Yurop too since it's like 5AM in the US when I'm playing. Tho lag certainly doesn't help. I think the flawed backstabbing mechanics of DS1 is more at fault here anyhow.

Also I can confirm what Elwro said - Oolacile is by far the worst place for these kinds of weirdos. I saw that kind of behavior much less in the Forest and the Burg. (Tho the Forest seems to be infested with SL200+ Havel mages for some reason, maybe the invasion range is much looser here so the uber-high level twinks have a field day with the Forest defenders).

 

[Elwro]

Yesterday I got summoned for Seath and the person didn't know how to cross the Crystal Cave. It's great to see new players - the game's still alive

I also like to leave summoning signs in weird places.

 

[Jigawatt]

(Tho the Forest seems to be infested with SL200+ Havel mages for some reason, maybe the invasion range is much looser here so the uber-high level twinks have a field day with the Forest defenders).

I think forest invasion is completely unbounded in the upward direction, so yeah lots of people hang out there hoping to catch unsuspecting forest defenders. Luckily with DSCM you tend to get people closer in SL

 

[cvv]

(Tho the Forest seems to be infested with SL200+ Havel mages for some reason, maybe the invasion range is much looser here so the uber-high level twinks have a field day with the Forest defenders).

I think forest invasion is completely unbounded in the upward direction, so yeah lots of people hang out there hoping to catch unsuspecting forest defenders. Luckily with DSCM you tend to get people closer in SL

You do? Dunno. As I posted already, last week I kept running into a SL 544 Havel mage, several times in a row even (after two attempts at him I just jumped off the cliff when I saw him coz what's the point). Even tho DSCM showed there are 20+ more people in the forest.

 

[SymbolicFrank]

While I think Dark Souls is a great and unique game, it is definitely not a casual game. It requires lots of time and dedication. If you stop playing it for a month, you lost everything that is important: your personal (twitch) skills. That's what pushed it out of my personal top 10.

Because of that, it is not an RPG, even if it has stats. Because they're mostly meaningless. Those stats aren't all that much better at level 50 than at level 1, except if you spend all the points in just one or two stats. And even then it's perhaps twice of three times what it was at level 1.

What makes the most difference is having the stats to wield the right equipment. Upgraded as high as possible.

But even with all that, it will mostly make the game go faster and allow you to make a few more mistakes. It's much easier to play this game at skill level 1, when you've honed all your twitch skills, then at a very high level with great gear when you just took an extended break. Which is what I dislike about it.

And the thing with stats in an RPG is, that it automagically makes the player character much better at those things governed by those stats. Which is only borderline the case in Dark Souls. It does make a very small difference, but it is not the difference between automatic failure or success.

 

[Excidium II]

Yeah it's not an RPG, it is a videogame.