From Software The Dark Souls Discussion Thread

[Jasede]

2 has by far the best PvP. Had a really good time. Lots of builds and good weapons and spells.

Game is truly not that good when it comes to boss hitboxes, world logic or area design but the mechanics are rock solid.

 

[Average Manatee]

Yeah, I disagree - wich definetly justifies all the 'Retarded' ratings you DS II fanatics give out to everyone calling it bad...

Then tell us which Souls game has better balanced stats, larger variety of viable builds and just better overall mechanics than DS II.

Poise mechanics and staggering most enemies is fundamentally broken, so those builds aren't viable (in the sense of offering anything new).
Spells are complete dogshit, so out with hexes/miracles/sorceries/pyromancy.
What's left other than DEX builds?

are you sure you talking about dark souls 2 and not about 3?

Quoting myself:

Let's also take a detour to talk about some basic game mechanics that were screwed up for no reason. Armor is good in DS1. You can read how it works here (http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/396507-dark-souls-stats-i-damage-formula-and-analysis). But the TL;DR is, armor in DS1 has both flat damage reduction and percentile damage reduction properties. In other words it worked like armor in Fallout 1/2 work, and armor in FO1/2 is awesome. Dark Souls 1 is slightly less awesome in terms of letting you be immune to everything but crits to the eyes, but just as awesome in always feeling effective whether you're taking lots of small hits or a few big hits. Dark Souls 2 decided to screw this up for reasons I can't understand. Physical armor is now purely a flat damage reduction (like Damage Threshold from FONV), and it sucks ass. It's .1 DT per armor rating, and with the max armor at around 1500 your flat 150 damage reduction does jack shit to shrug off common enemies dealing 800 damage by the mid game. Why? I dunno, I guess they wanted to make the game harder by nerfing all of the tank builds? On the other hand, DS2 decides to make Elemental resistance fully percentile. You start at 10% and every 100 elemental armor adds 10% more. 900 fire resistance? Take 0 damage from all fire attacks. Period. Thanks to this Vitality (increases max equipment load, yes I can't remember which is which between this and Vigor/Endurance either) is a useless investment. ~45 levels of Vitality to *maybe* take 3 hits instead of 2 or 4 hits instead of 3 is a joke, and the game is laughing at you as you still have a shitty roll. 30 points of vigor will give you 600 HP and give you 15 to spare somewhere else. Robes that protect against elemental attacks weigh virtually nothing and half the endgame enemies have some combination of normal damage and elemental damage on their standard attacks anyway, so sometimes you're being protected more by robes than armor when impaled by a frozen spear or what have you. TL;DR #2 almost all the armor in DS2 is useless, the only sensible options are to wear robes (elemental resist), nothing (slightly faster rolls/stamina regen) or +souls gained armor (kill the armor merchant in the starting area for it, you're not buying anything from him are you?). Dodge or block everything, don't rely on armor to do anything unless it's a dragon breathing fire.

Poise (the other part of armor) and poise damage (the thing strength weapons are for) also kind of sucks. It's not actually broken for the player or really changed in any way I can tell from DS1, it's just not suited for DS2's PvE. Poise is entirely about being a tie-breaker in 1v1 combat. You and your opponent swing together, you both hit, they stagger because they suck and you combo their ass to death. It keeps you swinging through 1, maybe 2 hits at most. But because DS2 is all about groups of enemies everywhere trying to just bully your way through with a strength weapon is suicidal. You take one hit, you stagger your attacked target and in return his buddies all get their hit in to stun you and then lol now you're stunned while in the middle of 3-4 enemies ready to rape you. GG no re. Additionally almost every boss is nigh immune to poise damage as far as I can tell, so those big strength weapons dealing 700-800 damage are literally useless jokes compared to dex weapons hitting 3x as quickly for 500-600. This is a real bummer, in DS1 almost every boss could be stunned by a good two-handed strength weapon (even lowly maces and clubs), leading to a lot of free time to get hits in. I did manage to stun a few bosses with the high-level pyromancy Fire Whip (in particular Mytha can be stunlocked to death with it) but I'm pretty sure that's so far above the level of poise damage that strength weapons deal out that there's no point bothering. There's also a ring that gives +poise damage, faster weapons end up as good or better than strength weapons with it on when fighting the things that can be reasonably stunned. Everything still kind of works and feels balanced for PvP, it's just the PvE environment that poise is messed up in.

TL;DR Big weapons and big armor do not do anything meaningful in DS2 like they did in DS1.

Magic is also rather trash as mentioned in my previous post. Because you're constantly fighting groups and overall magic damage is rather weak outside of uber spells, you're always ending up in melee range before you can kill them all. Once you're there, do you want to spend 2s casting a spell (3s for any of the better spells) unable to dodge or .75s stabbing for the same damage? Bosses also have the same problem, since all of them have very clear gap-closing moves designed to punish a player who tries to back off and cast a slow spell from a medium distance. If you're going to end up in melee with them and dodging just the same as a melee character would, why cast a spell rather than attack with a much higher DPS melee weapon? There's simply no reasonably difficult boss fight in which magic is anywhere near as good as melee, and relatively few areas in which it excels. Again, nerfed because DS2 devs decided that there was a right way to play (quick, active melee) and a wrong way to play (virtually everything else)? I hear magic used to be more like DS1 and was nerfed because it made the game too easy, I guess that answers that. Game needed to be made harder, so make something good suck.

TL;DR Magic is complete shit.

 

[Elwro]

As for viability, well, I pumped Resistance and concentrated on upgrading armor the first time I played DS1 (blindly). That build was not viable :D But yes, DS1 is really versatile...

 

[DJOGamer PT]

If you want to start with the worst, start with DS III.

Fixed.

I actually have no idea why I'm getting showered with so much hostility.

But if you feel better - go ahead.

>says the game is shit, gives no reasons why
>is confronted with valid counter arguments to his opinion, can't back up his opinion
>"why so mad bro?"

 

[Teut Busnet]

Fixed.



>says the game is shit, gives no reasons why
>is confronted with valid counter arguments to his opinion, can't back up his opinion
>"why so mad bro?"

For the last time, 'DS II defense force':

I said three things about DS II, because some guy wanted to know which souls games he should play and in which order:

• It's the worst Souls game.
• If you have the chance, play Demon's Souls and Bloodborne instead of DS II and DS III (because they offer something different compared to the lukewarm DS sequels - I didn't praise DS III either)
• There are a lot of guys here that like the game, they can tell you why.

Nowhere did I call the game 'shit'. Beeing the worst game in a series =/= 'shit'. Stop putting words in my mouth.

If you think that justifies a shower of 'retarded' and 'shit' ratings, call 'my arguments' (that I didn't even make, ffs, someone wanted a recommendation - I gave one. I didn't intend to write a fleshed out critique.) idiotic and allege I have no opinion of my own and just parrot some youtuber is fine - cool.

 

[ZodoZ]

Dark Souls is their breakthrough album, which will always be good

Demon's is the album they did before they got big -- fans will appreciate the greatness, the rest will pass

DSII is the album with exploratory tracks they recorded with various people, 3 CDs, bonus DVD which is actually the best, but incoherent artistic vision and no real quality control

DSIII is the best of album with a couple of new tracks and remakes of some original hits; good, but kinda soulless

Bloodborne is the solo guitarist side project which for many people outshone the main deal

Aren't Demon's and Bloodborne console only?

 

[HoboForEternity]

The reason i "pass on DeS is because it is only on dead console and my cpu isnt good enough for pcsx3

 

[toro]

Fixed.



>says the game is shit, gives no reasons why
>is confronted with valid counter arguments to his opinion, can't back up his opinion
>"why so mad bro?"

For the last time, 'DS II defense force':

I said three things about DS II, because some guy wanted to know which souls games he should play and in which order:

• It's the worst Souls game.
• If you have the chance, play Demon's Souls and Bloodborne instead of DS II and DS III (because they offer something different compared to the lukewarm DS sequels - I didn't praise DS III either)
• There are a lot of guys here that like the game, they can tell you why.

Nowhere did I call the game 'shit'. Beeing the worst game in a series =/= 'shit'. Stop putting words in my mouth.

If you think that justifies a shower of 'retarded' and 'shit' ratings, call 'my arguments' (that I didn't even make, ffs, someone wanted a recommendation - I gave one. I didn't intend to write a fleshed out critique.) idiotic and allege I have no opinion of my own and just parrot some youtuber is fine - cool.

DS3 is the worst game in the series.

 

[cretin]

couldnt get into DS3. Just not engaging. Kind of dull.

an actual DS1 remaster, not the shitty non remaster that was released, with DS3 mechanics would be my jam.

 

[Wunderbar]

with DS3 mechanics

no

 

[Lutte]

DS3 mechanics are the worst of the series. The only saving grace of the game is how enjoyable many of the boss encounters are, going back to DS1 much of the encounters outside of AotA feels soporific in comparison. But the mechanics of ds1 are far superior. DS3 has useless armor, useless magic, rollspamming without a second thought because stamina management has become a non issue (despite stamina being one of the staple mechanics, a core part of how a souls game plays), instafast healing that is imbalanced even when taking into consideration enemy aggressiveness, a roster of mostly useless weapons because of how ineffective they are compared to some of the truly obviously optimal ones.
The only thing DS3 does better on a mechanical level than DS1 are things DS2 also did, like omnidirectional rolling while using lockon. Or QOL improvements like eating multiple souls at once.

I still did enjoy DS3, as a sort-of boss rush game rerunning it skipping all content but I don't want more games in the vein. If DS3 had been made by any other developer, I'd be praising the 'attempt' at making an okay, but not great, souls like game and say the dev has the potential for greater things in the future. But this is the third of a series and a game by From and it's trite, uninspired, and clearly something put out without much love as contractual obligation of a trilogy for their publisher, Bamco.

 

[ZodoZ]

The reason i "pass on DeS is because it is only on dead console and my cpu isnt good enough for pcsx3

Wait..what?!
What hardware do you have that can't run pcsx3 emulator?

On a side note. Wow the website for the emulator looks super
https://rpcs3.net/

I guess they changed the name or acronym to RPCS3 from PCSX3

From the site:
minimum system requirements:
CPU: any x64 capable processor

From what I am seeing in forums the emulator has come a long way in development but still has a long way to go.
So even if your rig can run the emulator there is no guarantee the quality won't be shit.
Sounds like smart people are saying just buy a used PS3 for around $100..

Maybe I'll test it on my build and see what it looks like. Maybe..
So many PC games in backlog..

 

[aweigh]

Demon Souls runs fantastic on RPCS3. Anyone with a modern i5 processor and above can run it at 4k.

 

[Strange Fellow]

There's an i5 in my machine and I averaged around 10-20 fps last time I tried it a few months ago. Unless there have been some drastic improvements since then I think you're overestimating the emulator.

 

[ZodoZ]

Demon Souls runs fantastic on RPCS3. Anyone with a modern i5 processor and above can run it at 4k.

There's an i5 in my machine and I averaged around 10-20 fps last time I tried it a few months ago. Unless there have been some drastic improvements since then I think you're overestimating the emulator.

Well now I have to experiment.

Where can I get the Demon ISO or what is it that the game is stored on?

 

[Strange Fellow]

Demon Souls runs fantastic on RPCS3. Anyone with a modern i5 processor and above can run it at 4k.

There's an i5 in my machine and I averaged around 10-20 fps last time I tried it a few months ago. Unless there have been some drastic improvements since then I think you're overestimating the emulator.

Well now I have to experiment.

Where can I get the Demon ISO or what is it that the game is stored on?

You'll have to sail the high seas for that one. Not something I'd condone, of course.

 

[aweigh]

there's some instruction or something called TSX that if your intel cpu doesn't have it then rpcs3 won't run as good. some i5s have it and some don't, i can't remember.

could also well be i'm overestimating the emulator as well, just for the sake of being contrarian, i don't deny that.

 

[yellowcake]

RPCS3 greatly benefits from AVX2 so it runs much better on Haswell+ intel CPUs. I'm glad that my OC'd 2500k can handle Nier good enough for now.

 

[Vorark]

Haswell initially had TSX support but turns out it was bugged and was disabled.

 

[Wunderbar]

There's an i5 in my machine and I averaged around 10-20 fps

just like on original console

 

[ZodoZ]

Demon Souls runs fantastic on RPCS3. Anyone with a modern i5 processor and above can run it at 4k.

There's an i5 in my machine and I averaged around 10-20 fps last time I tried it a few months ago. Unless there have been some drastic improvements since then I think you're overestimating the emulator.

Well now I have to experiment.

Where can I get the Demon ISO or what is it that the game is stored on?

You'll have to sail the high seas for that one. Not something I'd condone, of course.

Arrrr matey. Sailin' the high seas yer say?

Demon Souls runs fantastic on RPCS3. Anyone with a modern i5 processor and above can run it at 4k.

There's an i5 in my machine and I averaged around 10-20 fps last time I tried it a few months ago. Unless there have been some drastic improvements since then I think you're overestimating the emulator.

Well now I have to experiment.

Where can I get the Demon ISO or what is it that the game is stored on?

Okay So I DL'd RPCS3, installed firmware, pointed RPCS3 at the game disc, and fired her up.
Using a keyboard was the imput option I had at this time without further installation for a pad or mouse.
Controls were not intuitive at first (DS: PTDE was same) but after a few minutes I stumbled on the right key ("x") to get the game running past the first screen.

I watched a few Youtube videos for Demons Souls for PC set up and configurations.
I'm fairly certain I have not tweaked the config adequately for my rig. As a result the game runs but is fairly sluggish and not ready for actual play.
FPS wise the meter jumped from 0-30 and sound was in and out at best.
That being said the game looks great.
Well except for the soldier's missing shield after character selection. Apparently this is a known bug. The shield is there just not visible.

 

[aweigh]

ZodoZ

remember to change an rpcs3 option in the first page, make sure 'spu decoder: llvm recompiler' is selected.

- spu decoder: llvm
- threads: either 'Auto' or '1' or '2', whichver works best for u (usually Auto is good though)
- in 2nd page, change Renderer to 'vulkan' (much faster than openGL)

 

[ZodoZ]

ZodoZ

remember to change an rpcs3 option in the first page, make sure 'spu decoder: llvm recompiler' is selected.

- spu decoder: llvm
- threads: either 'Auto' or '1' or '2', whichver works best for u (usually Auto is good though)
- in 2nd page, change Renderer to 'vulkan' (much faster than openGL)

Thanks )
I "think" that is what I have. Like you say I think testing SPU thread settings may change FPS for that sweet spot.
I did pick Vulkan but not sure a 1060 3G card can handle this load.
I'm optimistic with some tweaks I will have the pleasure of experiencing this great title.
Might even get me to buy a Playstation console

 

[aweigh]

I did pick Vulkan but not sure a 1060 3G card can handle this load.

It can.

RPCS3 stresses cpu, not gpu.

 

[ZodoZ]

I did pick Vulkan but not sure a 1060 3G card can handle this load.

It can.

RPCS3 stresses cpu, not gpu.

Interesting..didn't know that.
I have i5-7400 3Ghz w/8 gigs ram (DDR 4 3 Ghz)

Hopeful Demon's Souls will run smooth